Tom Brady.....even better than I thought he was.

#27
#27
99gator said:
But, the most insane thing was that they erased that deficit by throwing to James White, Danny Amendola, Julian Edelman, Malcolm Mitchell, Martellous Bennett, and Chris Hogan.

Now, I promise you....I don’t care what the Falcons did to screw it up, no other Qb who has ever played this game would be able to take that group of guys and make that comeback.
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I know Mitchell washed out but while he was on the field he was outstanding, unlike most rookies he actually understood the offense, it was a shame to see him injured. Bennett practically had a career year in 16', Hogan led the league in YPC, he was clutch. Edelman is impossible to cover, Amendola could always be depended on for big plays, and James White just moved the chains and scored touchdowns. Brady always got the most out of the talent around him.... until he was sick of the BS.
 
#28
#28
HoptownVol said:
I know Mitchell washed out but while he was on the field he was outstanding, unlike most rookies he actually understood the offense, it was a shame to see him injured. Bennett practically had a career year in 16', Hogan led the league in YPC, he was clutch. Edelman is impossible to cover, Amendola could always be depended on for big plays, and James White just moved the chains and scored touchdowns. Brady always got the most out of the talent around him.... until he was sick of the BS.
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I expected a lot from Mitchell.

Welker, Amendola, Edelman, a slew of RB's, etc...the underneath routes that New England ran just absolutely crushed. They were consistently the best at finding easy yards and throwing guys open.
 
#34
#34
The new thing that now links Brady and Peyton is that they both should be general managers. When given an opportunity to look out at the NFL landscape and pick a landing spot, Peyton chose a franchise (in 2012) that had not finished above .500 since 2006. But, he looked at his options and picked the Broncos and went to the Super Bowl.

Brady, given the same opportunity, picked a franchise (in 2020) that had not made the playoffs since 2007 and had not had a winning record since 2016. But, he also was able to identify a landing spot where there was sufficient talent to get to the Super Bowl.

As fans, we look and wonder how much difference there is or how much talent there is on a team that's 5-11. These guys knew.

In Peyton's case, people questioned playing in the thin air. They questioned playing outdoors come playoff time when he spent his whole career in a dome. etc.

In Brady's case, people questioned playing in the NFC instead of the AFC. People questioned moving to a division that was thought to be a lot stronger than the AFC East he was leaving. etc.

But, again, these guys knew. Their understanding of the game extended well beyond playing QB.
 
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#35
#35
Unimane said:
He was terrible today. Luckily, the Packers had a flurry of stupidity wrapped around the half and gave away 21 of the 31 points for Tampa on musjudging a fly ball from Brady, twice, not playing for the deep pass with 8 seconds left and fumbling inside the ten. Dude is good, but has an inordinate amount of good luck.
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He was terrible in the 2nd half. He was great in the first half throwing perfect balls on some big 3rd downs.
 
#36
#36
Chippo said:
Peyton Manning has more class than
Brady ever will. Brady is the Barry Bond
of football.
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I wonder if Brady has ever stuck his bare ass and sack in a female trainers face. You shouldn't have hit the send button. Also, tell us how many times Brady has repeatedly plugged a product of his on national TV after any if his 6 Super Bowl wins
 
#39
#39
Unimane said:
A deal with the devil, I guess. He's a guy who's had a solid OL and defense backing him up for his entire career. He throws three INTs today, had two more which were inexplicably dropped by the GB secondary, all while barely getting touched all game, and his team still won. I want to ask him lottery numbers, too.
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Wow a quarterback who wins multiple Super Bowls benefited from having good offensive lines and defenses. I’m completely shocked by this revelation. You know who also had great OLines and defenses? Joe Montana. The defenses in his super bowl years were ranked 2nd,1st, 8th and 3rd. Funny how I never hear anyone attaching qualifiers to his Super Bowls.
 
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#40
#40
HoptownVol said:
You couldn't explain that idiotic comment if your life depended on it.
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It’s so funny that people fall back on the cheating thing. Most people have no idea what spygate even was. Most people still believe the thoroughly discredited deflategate report by Chris Mortensen. The Brady/Pats hate basically boils down to envy.
 
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#41
#41
Boston Vol said:
Wow a quarterback who wins multiple Super Bowls benefited from having good offensive lines and defenses. I’m completely shocked by this revelation. You know who also had great OLines and defenses? Joe Montana. The defenses in his super bowl years were ranked 2nd,1st, 8th and 3rd. Funny how I never hear anyone attaching qualifiers to his Super Bowls.
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Beyond that, with the exception of Gronk, Brady has played with crap on the offensive side of the ball for the vast majority of his career.

Terry Bradshaw, Joe Montana, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, etc., aren't winning a damn thing throwing the ball to Julian Edelman, Deion Branch, Wes Welker, Troy Brown, etc. John Elway is the only guy close on this front and on the back end of his career he had Terrell Davis and Shannon Sharpe.
 
#43
#43
Boston Vol said:
It’s so funny that people fall back on the cheating thing. Most people have no idea what spygate even was. Most people still believe the thoroughly discredited deflategate report by Chris Mortensen. The Brady/Pats hate basically boils down to envy.
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It's amazing how a first report becomes the "reality", even when it's debunked. I mean they only tested 4 Colts balls and 3 of them were deflated too. You never hear anything about that.
 
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#44
#44
99gator said:
Beyond that, with the exception of Gronk, Brady has played with crap on the offensive side of the ball for the vast majority of his career.

Terry Bradshaw, Joe Montana, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, etc., aren't winning a damn thing throwing the ball to Julian Edelman, Deion Branch, Wes Welker, Troy Brown, etc. John Elway is the only guy close on this front and on the back end of his career he had Terrell Davis and Shannon Sharpe.
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As much as I like Montana, he's always in the GOAT conversation yet to me he's one whose GOAT status is defined a lot by his 4 Super Bowl wins. He did pretty well in KC too but if he isn't on those 49er teams, I'm not sure he's a household name. It's just odd to me that with Brady it's always like "Yeah but put him on another team and he does nothing" yet that doesn't seem to happen with Montana. I'm not saying he's Troy Aikman but still.

And for years it's been "Let's see if Brady could do it with another team".....and he just did it....at 43....and still people are making excuses. I mean does he have to go to the Jaguars or Bengals and do it or would there be another excuse?
 
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#45
#45
Boston Vol said:
Wow a quarterback who wins multiple Super Bowls benefited from having good offensive lines and defenses. I’m completely shocked by this revelation. You know who also had great OLines and defenses? Joe Montana. The defenses in his super bowl years were ranked 2nd,1st, 8th and 3rd. Funny how I never hear anyone attaching qualifiers to his Super Bowls.
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Manning had great offensive lines too
 
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#46
#46
VolsSportsFan said:
As much as I like Montana, he's always in the GOAT conversation yet to me he's one whose GOAT status is defined a lot by his 4 Super Bowl wins. He did pretty well in KC too but if he isn't on those 49er teams, I'm not sure he's a household name. It's just odd to me that with Brady it's always like "Yeah but put him on another team and he does nothing" yet that doesn't seem to happen with Montana. I'm not saying he's Troy Aikman but still.

And for years it's been "Let's see if Brady could do it with another team".....and he just did it....at 43....and still people are making excuses. I mean does he have to go to the Jaguars or Bengals and do it or would there be another excuse?
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No one makes excuses except some UT fans
 
#47
#47
VolsSportsFan said:
As much as I like Montana, he's always in the GOAT conversation yet to me he's one whose GOAT status is defined a lot by his 4 Super Bowl wins. He did pretty well in KC too but if he isn't on those 49er teams, I'm not sure he's a household name. It's just odd to me that with Brady it's always like "Yeah but put him on another team and he does nothing" yet that doesn't seem to happen with Montana. I'm not saying he's Troy Aikman but still.

And for years it's been "Let's see if Brady could do it with another team".....and he just did it....at 43....and still people are making excuses. I mean does he have to go to the Jaguars or Bengals and do it or would there be another excuse?
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IMO, if you're looking to minimize Brady the best argument you can come up with is that he's been the beneficiary of consistently excellent (not just good, but excellent) play from his defenses. There have been many, many playoff games where he did not play well at all and his team still won, and the media tends to give him all or most of the credit for winning. It seems like most other legendary QBs, in games where they don't play well, their teams lose.
 
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#48
#48
05_never_again said:
IMO, if you're looking to minimize Brady the best argument you can come up with is that he's been the beneficiary of consistently excellent (not just good, but excellent) play from his defenses. There have been many, many playoff games where he did not play well at all and his team still won, and the media tends to give him all or most of the credit for winning. It seems like most other legendary QBs, in games where they don't play well, their teams lose.
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It’s a team game and no one can win without the team. Mahomes just found that out.

But, the defense argument is also overplayed. He’s had good defenses where he has been. He hasn’t had the 85 bears, steel curtain or 2000 Ravens.

But, we have convenient memories. This Buccaneer team is now being portrayed as flat out loaded. No one said that in June. No one said that in September, particularly after week 1. No one said that in November. But, now they are loaded.

I’ll bet (and i didn’t look) that the Patriots defensive numbers are as bad as they have been in years. The reason? There wasn’t an offense to help them out.

For the record, I do believe that Tampa is very talented, more than anything he ever had in New England except the team that was 16-0.

I think, and have stated it repeatedly that they won with trash in New England in the last 5 years. I mean, compare Devin White to Rob Ninkovich and Kyle Van Noy. Even defensively, they were getting by with trash. Go look at the roster of the 2016 Patriots and you’ll seriously wonder how they went 14-2 and won a Super Bowl
 
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#49
#49
99gator said:
It’s a team game and no one can win without the team. Mahomes just found that out.

But, the defense argument is also overplayed. He’s had good defenses where he has been. He hasn’t had the 85 bears, steel curtain or 2000 Ravens.

But, we have convenient memories. This Buccaneer team is now being portrayed as flat out loaded. No one said that in June. No one said that in September, particularly after week 1. No one said that in November. But, now they are loaded.

I’ll bet (and i didn’t look) that the Patriots defensive numbers are as bad as they have been in years. The reason? There wasn’t an offense to help them out.

For the record, I do believe that Tampa is very talented, more than anything he ever had in New England except the team that was 16-0.

I think, and have stated it repeatedly that they won with trash in New England in the last 5 years. I mean, compare Devin White to Rob Ninkovich and Kyle Van Noy. Even defensively, they were getting by with trash. Go look at the roster of the 2016 Patriots and you’ll seriously wonder how they went 14-2 and won a Super Bowl
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I definitely wouldn't say that this TB defense, or any of his NE defenses were "flat out loaded." It isn't like those defenses were loaded up and down with HoFers or perennial Pro Bowlers. However, there have been a bunch of different games where his defenses have performed incredibly and made it very difficult for him to do something to lose the game. The NFCCG against Green Bay just a couple weeks ago being the most recent example. I wonder how many QBs have thrown 3 INTs (all of them in key situations) at Lambeau and still won? There's a big difference between a lack of household names and "trash" - Brady has basically never had a defense that was trash, and quite often they were among the best in the league despite having guys like Rob Ninkovich on the roster. It's also absolutely amazing to me that in the last 2 SBs Brady has played in, in an era of high-octane offenses, the opposing offense hasn't even scored a TD. That's mind-boggling in today's game, especially considering he went up against Mahomes in one of the games.

I think people that hate on Brady go too far, and they do a really poor job at articulating their argument because they are emotional. They seem him winning another ring, with that smug smile on his face, and it drives them crazy. People who want to rip Brady would be better served by saying things like his most impressive accomplishment, the 7 Super Bowls, is a team accomplishment, and Brady gets undue credit in many cases for wins. It is possible to think that both of these things are true - he's an incredible player, and he gets undue credit.
 
#50
#50
05_never_again said:
I definitely wouldn't say that this TB defense, or any of his NE defenses were "flat out loaded." It isn't like those defenses were loaded up and down with HoFers or perennial Pro Bowlers. However, there have been a bunch of different games where his defenses have performed incredibly and made it very difficult for him to do something to lose the game. The NFCCG against Green Bay just a couple weeks ago being the most recent example. I wonder how many QBs have thrown 3 INTs (all of them in key situations) at Lambeau and still won? There's a big difference between a lack of household names and "trash" - Brady has basically never had a defense that was trash, and quite often they were among the best in the league despite having guys like Rob Ninkovich on the roster. It's also absolutely amazing to me that in the last 2 SBs Brady has played in, in an era of high-octane offenses, the opposing offense hasn't even scored a TD. That's mind-boggling in today's game, especially considering he went up against Mahomes in one of the games.

I think people that hate on Brady go too far, and they do a really poor job at articulating their argument because they are emotional. They seem him winning another ring, with that smug smile on his face, and it drives them crazy. People who want to rip Brady would be better served by saying things like his most impressive accomplishment, the 7 Super Bowls, is a team accomplishment, and Brady gets undue credit in many cases for wins. It is possible to think that both of these things are true - he's an incredible player, and he gets undue credit.
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Everything is indeed a contradiction, even with me.

On the one hand, I believe he gets undue credit.

On the other hand, this is twice he beat Mahomes in the playoffs when I thought Mahomes had the better team. Rodgers has gotten to the Super Bowl once and I thought he’s had teams better than New England multiple times. We can keep going.

So, I don’t know what QBs I can put in New England the last 5 or so years that walk away with rings.

I do think there are guys that could have won with the Bucs.....but, I had the Bucs losing to the Packers and the Chiefs.....so, I’m at a loss.
 
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