Tom Mars: "The End of the NCAA"

[orangefloyd]

How ironic that the same people that have exploited student athletes for decades now want to protect student athletes from being exploited.

 

[crovol]

I think there is no avoiding having Saban playing some sort of key role in what college football is morphing into. Good or bad? Bad if the “new boss” uses the same punishment tactics the NCAA used where they cherry pick those they want to punish and don’t touch the sacred cows.

The good is if he gets involved in reform and moves the sport in a direction where the game still resembles what it is now. Age was definitely a factor in his retirement, but with SEC expansion and divisions evaporating, this Tsunami I of change was more than he could take.

I’d rather see someone else, but be careful what you wish for. Much of Sabans success at Alabama came early on. He did something no other coach since Bear did and that is he jumped in and took total control of that program. The others had all these former Bear players backseat driving, including Paul Bear Bryant ,Jr, Saban shut his door to them which took balls. He’s a “my way or the highway” sort of guy. Ask Kiffin about that.

What I’m saying is it’s going to take leadership. Right now it’s herding cats. He’s a guy that can actually get the sport on the right track.

no i never want saban in control and expect him to be impartial

 

[Godfatha]

I think there is no avoiding having Saban playing some sort of key role in what college football is morphing into. Good or bad? Bad if the “new boss” uses the same punishment tactics the NCAA used where they cherry pick those they want to punish and don’t touch the sacred cows.

The good is if he gets involved in reform and moves the sport in a direction where the game still resembles what it is now. Age was definitely a factor in his retirement, but with SEC expansion and divisions evaporating, this Tsunami I of change was more than he could take.

I’d rather see someone else, but be careful what you wish for. Much of Sabans success at Alabama came early on. He did something no other coach since Bear did and that is he jumped in and took total control of that program. The others had all these former Bear players backseat driving, including Paul Bear Bryant ,Jr, Saban shut his door to them which took balls. He’s a “my way or the highway” sort of guy. Ask Kiffin about that.

What I’m saying is it’s going to take leadership. Right now it’s herding cats. He’s a guy that can actually get the sport on the right track.

I want Saban nowhere near being the decision maker for college football.

 

[ptcarter]

Saban's suggestions were a direct line back to "dark money" by capping earnings in some way. He's a dinosaur who only knows the old ways and he was smart enough to know that when he retired.

Not surprisingly, he suggested Sankey or Byrne (Bama AD) as a commissioner of any new entity associated with college football.

Saban might have the gravitas to lead a new organization but he lacks new ideas. He's talking about token compensation above the table and the old "$100 handshake" under the table, which he did very well.

Saban plans to speak out for 'meaningful change'

Nick Saban said Wednesday he plans to take stronger stances on issues such as NIL and the transfer portal because "what we have now is not college football."

www.espn.com

There is a chance college football can move too far away from the old model. Here is some extreme examples of where this could lead. First, NCAA does have a good role in the non football sports, say the olympic sports, swimming, softball, golf, tennis, track and field. Rare that a track star or swimmer would be able to market his "name, image and likeness", so over time, those sports (like SEC wrestling that got whacked by Title IX) will evaporate. I'd say that's a shame - there should be a place on college campuses for that sort of thing, so NCAA isn't all bad. (It's the enforcement branch, stupid).

Now a new system will be put in place, and without some rules, it's going to be the schools that can afford the players will get the players, and the others will dry up and blow away. I can see schools like, Vanderbilt, MTSU or even Southern Miss type not having a viable football program in 10 years. And those left standing will be the money schools. It could be that you can pick 10 schools that will rise to the top and those others will evaporate, and these are the blue bloods. The days of an App State upsetting Michigan in the big house will be over. College teams will consist of university employees that have nothing to do with attending any classes. A term you will never hear again is "Academically ineligble". It's college football without the college. Pro teams using college stadiums as a venue. That's where we are now. There is an opportunity to guide this in a direction and I'd like to see it where there is more parity, not less. Transfer portal reform is one good step towards that goal.

 

[volinsd]

They got too big for their britches! It's time for them to go!

Next up needs to be all Politicians with over 8 yrs of service.

Let's make it happen Tennessee!

 

[B81]

There is a chance college football can move too far away from the old model. Here is some extreme examples of where this could lead. First, NCAA does have a good role in the non football sports, say the olympic sports, swimming, softball, golf, tennis, track and field. Rare that a track star or swimmer would be able to market his "name, image and likeness", so over time, those sports (like SEC wrestling that got whacked by Title IX) will evaporate. I'd say that's a shame - there should be a place on college campuses for that sort of thing, so NCAA isn't all bad. (It's the enforcement branch, stupid).

Now a new system will be put in place, and without some rules, it's going to be the schools that can afford the players will get the players, and the others will dry up and blow away. I can see schools like, Vanderbilt, MTSU or even Southern Miss type not having a viable football program in 10 years. And those left standing will be the money schools. It could be that you can pick 10 schools that will rise to the top and those others will evaporate, and these are the blue bloods. The days of an App State upsetting Michigan in the big house will be over. College teams will consist of university employees that have nothing to do with attending any classes. A term you will never hear again is "Academically ineligble". It's college football without the college. Pro teams using college stadiums as a venue. That's where we are now. There is an opportunity to guide this in a direction and I'd like to see it where there is more parity, not less. Transfer portal reform is one good step towards that goal.

The small a schools will still be able to offer scholarships, and that will allow them to have sports programs. Some kids will play for the love of the game. Even current sec baseball programs only get like 11 scholarships to be spread out over 25 players. Kids still sign up and play.

 

[VOLociraptorr]

Per Tom Mars, Attorney representing Spyre:

"I think this will be one more brick in the wall that is the end of the NCAA," Mars said. "Short of intervention by Congress, the demise of the NCAA now seems inevitable based on nothing but a financial analysis, as it appears the NCAA is poised to lose all of its upcoming antitrust cases. The cumulative effect of which, could make the NCAA financially insolvent."

"A bad case is a bad case, and they've put all their defenses forward," Mars added. "And there's no precedent anywhere in the United States that supports their defenses."

"Turning upside down rules overwhelmingly supported by member schools will aggravate an already chaotic collegiate environment, further diminishing protections for student-athletes from exploitation," the NCAA said in a statement. "The NCAA fully supports student-athletes making money from their name, image and likeness and is making changes to deliver more benefits to student-athletes, but an endless patchwork of state laws and court opinions make clear partnering with Congress is necessary to provide stability for the future of all college athletes."

Corker said the NCAA's lawyers did not make a compelling argument for why using NIL contracts as recruiting inducements would undermine the academic side of college sports.

"While the NCAA permits student-athletes to profit from their NIL, it fails to show how the timing of when a student-athlete enters such an agreement would destroy the goal of preserving amateurism," the judge wrote.

Time to break out the lifeboats, NCAA.

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tenor.com

Butch Jones was right... brick by brick


He was prophesying the downfall of the NCAA. Even the attorney is using the language of brick

 

[DaddyChad]

I have no conflict whatsoever. College football was about money long before the players got their chance to make money. It’s a business, has been a business for a good while. Coaches, networks, and media have been making billions off this for many a year, not many of those give a damn about “higher education” for student athletes. This is about life changing money for a lot of athletes and their families and it’s actually a willing transfer of wealth from those with more than enough to a lot of families that can benefit from it.

 

[ptcarter]

The small a schools will still be able to offer scholarships, and that will allow them to have sports programs. Some kids will play for the love of the game. Even current sec baseball programs only get like 11 scholarships to be spread out over 25 players. Kids still sign up and play.

It's football money that funds most of this. You right in that aspect and I'm just painting a worst case scenario. I hope it doesn't go that way. I was a wrestler in high school and just before I got to UT, title IX nixed that. Also women's gymnastics. Like that Joni Mitchell song, "you don't know what you got till it's gone." Sort of a shame. (picture from 1970 yearbook)



Edit: Check out that "ball and chain" the opponent has on the good guys ankle. Every wrestler knows that and the "fireman's carry".

 

[Tin Man]

Some years ago, a B1G (Wisconsin?) football player was threatened with the loss of his scholarship because he was receiving money from a song that he wrote. Didn’t this trigger the NIL hullabaloo?

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The small a schools will still be able to offer scholarships, and that will allow them to have sports programs. Some kids will play for the love of the game. Even current sec baseball programs only get like 11 scholarships to be spread out over 25 players. Kids still sign up and play.

I'm not convinced legally, if the players are paid at one college, they can remain unpaid at another.

Despite the massive revenue difference, what's the difference between the athletic department at ETSU vs UT? Why is the effort given by an athlete at UT worthy of pay and the effort at ETSU (or ANY smaller school covered by the NCAA) not?

The revenue programs need to be separate from the schools or they'll ruin it for many, many less talented athletes, students wanting to support their college team, smaller fanbases, and traditions of competition.

 

[GreveHaller]

funny that the NCAA is still undefeated against all predictions that anything will end them

 

[woodpusher]

Different emotions and thoughts about all of this.

1. UT had no other choice, hand was forced by NCAA for their selective enforcement. True, CJP did hand out bags of cash in McDonalds bags, UT admitted such. NCAA admitted UT handled it correctly. Then NCAA targets UT as repeat offender. NCAA knows that CJP didn’t suddenly just discover how to pay players while at UT, this was learned behavior from his days at FL ST, UGA and most recently Bama. Just because you are not guilty because you haven’t got caught is not an excuse for Bama and UGA to not play by same rules that everyone knows are being broken. Frankly, in one sense, I was hoping CJP would sue UT and the lawyers for UT could open a huge can of worms when they deposed CJP about his history at Bama and UGA.

2. This decision basically puts the nail in the coffin, not only for NCAA, but the idea of college football being an amateur sport. It will never be the same. The only course I see going forward is for college football players becoming employees of universities. If this happens, then what prevents them from only being employed for 4 years? Why not 6, 8, even 10 years? Now colleges are competing with NFL for players, will college football eventually evolve as a competing league and go the same path of USFL or others who tried to compete with NFL?

The SPHL (Knoxville Ice Bears) has some sort of eligibility limit, or they did. Mike Craigen exhausted his -- he eventually became the coach.
I'm not sure if there's a union that agreed to that or what.

 

[butchna]

funny that the NCAA is still undefeated against all predictions that anything will end them

As opposed to their record in court.

 

[orangebloodgmc]

funny that the NCAA is still undefeated against all predictions that anything will end them

Nothing ever ends. Until it does.

 

[Woodlawn VOL]

Seems the only difference between the NFL and college football is the NFL drafts it's players and players in college go to the highest bidder.

That is not true in most cases. Sure a small percentage might go to the highest bidder, many of those types never pan out. But for most there are many other factors. Some folks lump all players in wanting the most money and act like it is the only factor, that is pure BS. There is still going to be lots of players that won’t make much until they are in school awhile. Some might not make much or any under NIL. It’s pure crap folks acting like all players are waiting for highest options and it just isn’t true in most cases. Many more will look for a competitive offer but not necessarily the highest. Lots of factors picking a college, and still the majority of players and there parents like the college experience. But they have a right to explore and receive NIL opportunities. GBO

 

[Vol737]

It's the end of college football as we know it.

How do you feel about that?

I don't like a lot of what's happening in college football whether it's the formation of super conferences that is ruining the regional aspect and flavor of college football, or the form in which NIL has taken. I support NIL for these athletes on some levels, just not sure I was anticipating the creation of collectives and how they will operate in all of this going forward. I do think college football will have to figure out who is going to be the governing body and how are they going to cooperate and be proactive instead of being so heavy handed as the NCAA has been. A long way to go still in all of this. JMO

 

[Chad F]

These idiotic, agenda-driven incompetents (the NCAA) failed to do their job early on when it became clear that NIL was coming. They did nothing through incompetence, negligence, a lack of vision, or a combination of all three.

THEN these clowns tried to salvage themselves at Tennessee’s expense. If the NCAA doesn’t die quickly, the university should file a defamation (or whatever the appropriate term is) suit. Their leaking of the information to that Schiano-loving muppet Pat Forde was public slander and false accusation nonsense. Don’t know how it would fare in court, but seriously - to hell with the NCAA.

 

[Woodlawn VOL]

College football and NIL can co-exist, some folks are way over the top with their view of athletes and how NIL will work once it works for awhile it will stabilize itself in time. Look just throwing money didn’t help A&M. There are many factors in many areas. The main thing all schools collectives have the ability now to offer opportunities, instead of a few schools being able to operate under the table without fear of investigation while other are constantly harassed by the NCAA. That model has worn out it’s welcome for most folks and schools. Slow rulings, uneven rulings and look aways. Them days are ending. GBO

 

[Vol865]

The only thing needed to curb infractions is the NFL model. You'll never stop people from trying to cheat. Playing time and game checks are consequences of infractions. At some point, each player will receive a game check. Fine him, coach, whomever, as a consequence of infractions. The sooner they take on a quasi NFL model, the better. This can be "fixed". We're a resourceful country, we can talk and chew gum at the same time. Question is, do we want it fixed? Lots of $$$ to be made while no rules are in place.

I'm talking about if a school blatantly ignores whatever recruiting rules that are voted in then make it where they forfeit the season or maybe even get kicked out of the league based on severity.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

I'm talking about if a school blatantly ignores whatever recruiting rules that are voted in then make it where they forfeit the season or maybe even get kicked out of the league based on severity.

What recruiting rules? The ones that the NCAA now can't use since the the judges ruling?

 

[VOLtaism]

It really doesn't matter that the NCAA is kwashed. College football is as well. This is a whole new thing and the current University structure of University President, AD, coach are not going to be able to keep up with all the NIL deals, this is a pro football franchise. The top 30 university systems are going to franchise the football/basketball programs out in some way and those franchises will form their own league, make their own rules and crown their champion.

 

[1973Vol]

Think there is college sports are chaos now... High School sports is next

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

It really doesn't matter that the NCAA is kwashed. College football is as well. This is a whole new thing and the current University structure of University President, AD, coach are not going to be able to keep up with all the NIL deals, this is a pro football franchise. The top 30 university systems are going to franchise the football/basketball programs out in some way and those franchises will form their own league, make their own rules and crown their champion.

There is no need for a single coach or administrator to keep up with a single NIL deal.

 

[loservol]

I guess that I still feel that hope that it can be figured out and progress in a meaningful way. And for that to have some governing body will have to be established, but that body will need to answerable to the group over which they govern. Remember the last thing to be released from Pandor's box was HOPE.