Transfer Portal is a disaster

#152
#152
Butch s said:
This began when people decided they were entitled to be payed,because a video game used “their” number on a jersey. No name, the technology was such that there wasn’t even really a likeness
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It wasn’t just a jersey number. It was jersey number, exact height and weight, skin color, and home state.
 
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#153
#153
Butch s said:
Y’all are all leaving out one very important point. NO ONE IS MAKING THEM PLAY COLLEGE FOOTBALL
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They're being OFFERED this scholarship and perks to come play football. It's not an academic scholarship.

Come play athletics, we'll give you the scholarship. You've repeatedly said, "The scholarship should be enough." Enough for what? Enough to get them to play sports.
 
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#154
#154
volfan102455 said:
There are expectations of the scholarship that was signed. Just like students that receive the Tennessee Promise funds are expected to complete certain volunteering activities to maintain the scholarship. They know (or should anyway) what they are signing up for. It is education and training both for their chosen sport and their chosen vocation.

With both of these scenarios the student is not an employee nor subject to the rules that a university employee would be subject too. If the players ever become employees, the rules of NIL will have to be modified to ensure they align with the same rules and guardrails other university employees are subject to.

I actually worked part time while in college for a department within the university system. I had to adhere to the rules of that employment as well as the rules associated with being a student.

These athletes should not be treated any different than another student. Every student has things they must adhere to in regard to their student activities and any financial aid they may receive. They don't adhere to those - they lose their aid and must pay their own way.
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With a straight face you can tell me Nico came to UT to PRIMARILY be a student like a Promise kid does?

Until you can, Nico was definitely recruited to play football FIRST, and school is just part of the package the school must satisfy to keep the NCAA and SEC off their back.

Why is honesty about this so hard?
 
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#155
#155
Vol8188 said:
I don’t think it’s a disaster but I would like to see the following things implemented:

1. 2 transfers max
2. Can only transfer after 2 football seasons
3. Any transfer prior to your 2nd full season with that school means you forfeit your second transfer opportunity.
4. All scholarships are a 2 year commitment by the school. So if you sign a guy, you have to keep him for 2 seasons.
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That's how the NCAA loses millions of $$ in fines when they lose the inevitable restraint of trade federal lawsuit. That's a born loser given the impact it would have on NIL $$$.
 
#156
#156
OldVol said:
For those of us that loved the game as it was, it’s a disaster. Let’s look at the situation as it stands.

Many have said the NCAA needs to do something, set limits, do away with transfers. The NIL situation is where it is today because the NCAA was stubborn and overreaching. If they had allowed for reasonable stipends that were more commiserate with a players worth, we might not be in this mess.

The court case that began this is now the law of the land and there’s only one solution and absolutely no one wants to go there.

No one can set a persons value in the marketplace. That’s how the free enterprise system works and that ship left the dock when the court ruled.

Currently, there is another case that would punish the NCAA for forbidding students from being paid directly by the schools. There is also provision in the suit for a 4 year reach back that would compensate players from 2019 till the time the case is settled. In antitrust cases that’s a thing. Schools could be forced to go back from the time the original case was ruled. Imagine the cost of that.

The reason no one wants this is the only way limits can be enforced is if that case won and players become employees. Then, players would organize and then collective bargaining could enforce caps because the players would have agreed to it when they voted on it. The reason no one wants this is because if a collective bargaining entity negotiated caps, they are bound by law to fairly negotiate for all employees. So kids who are getting pennies now would be earning a substantial living wage. The schools don’t want it. The marquee players don’t want it. Yet fans keep clamoring for it and it would be far more worse than the system that is now in place. I wish there was a way to set caps. It would level the playing ground for lesser programs and stop the bidding wars for the best players but the court ruling basically castrated the NCAA when it comes to enforcement. The last thing the NCAA needs is to get involved in another losing lawsuit. Enforcing caps without players being employees with collective bargaining is a great big lawsuit loss for the NCAA. Another loss of that magnitude and the NCAA may as well fold their tent.
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So what happens when the athletes become employees, a salary cap is implemented, and players go on strike for more benefits / money.
Is it going to change the way fans look at college sports. I seem to remember pro sports fans got mad at the greed but it only lasted a few seasons.
 
#157
#157
And frankly I think we are doing the youth of today a disservice by not teaching them what commitment really means. The majority of these young folks will not be pros. They will never see the practice field for an NFL team. That education they are given a chance to earn can make a difference for them. It could be the difference of them returning home to a minimum wage type job or being able to move into a better financial situation in the future.

Many companies will hire a person based on that person showing the resolve to finish what they started. My career only indirectly aligns to my degree. Many I work with have degrees that don't align at all. But we all finished what we started and showed the ability to learn, grow and honor our commitments.
 
#159
#159
lilesrt said:
One remedy would be to go back to the former way where student athletes get their education paid for and drop coaching salaries to a maximum of $250,000 per year. We can’t have coaches & institutions making millions on the backs of young men and women. There has to be a middle ground that collegiate athletics simply hasn’t established yet. In a capitalistic society, student athletes have the right to profit from their talent.
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Coaches will sue the hell out of schools and win. In America, you don't get to tell a coach, "this is all you can make because it's good for the sport. Sorry about your rights."
 
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#160
#160
Butch s said:
So you’re okay with whatever school has the most cooperative money winning every year. The Yankees used to win every year because they had the most money, and could pay any player just so you couldn’t have them
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I just gave you clear proof that we're seeing more parity across the nation. And how quickly teams can turn their programs around thanks to the portal
 
#161
#161
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
With a straight face you can tell me Nico came to UT to PRIMARILY be a student like a Promise kid does?

Until you can, Nico was definitely recruited to play football FIRST, and school is just part of the package the school must satisfy to keep the NCAA and SEC off their back.

Why is honesty about this so hard?
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All the players are one injury away from never being able to take the field again. There is no guarantee that success at the high school level will translate to success at the college level and that success at the college level will translate to NFL success.

I hope that for each of these student athlete's sake, folks are reminding them of that and as such the importance of the educational opportunities they are receiving. It could be all they have to use post college.

And if all the player is interested in is playing football, then they should just bypass college - wait until they are a certain age and try out for the NFL without that experience.
 
#163
#163
a vol n tears said:
So what happens when the athletes become employees, a salary cap is implemented, and players go on strike for more benefits / money.
Is it going to change the way fans look at college sports. I seem to remember pro sports fans got mad at the greed but it only lasted a few seasons.
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This is the sad scenario. Folks will cry that "amateur college sports is dead" but what are you going to do on a Saturday?

The sad scenario is what happens to the schools who can't pay athletes, don't have big TV contracts, "the other schools" in this equation, and the other sports which don't make money.

Can UT pay the women's softball team like they pay the men's baseball team? Volleyball? Tennis? Those athletes, some scholarship and some not, will lose. In my mind the school loses too from this via enrichment from having diverse sports.

It's not a pleasant ending but I think we're over the cliff and on the way down since the schools sued the NCAA to get big TV money and turn football and basketball into incredibly lucrative businesses and then fund other sports.

It was better when the schools weren't greedy for that athletic department money.
 
#164
#164
volfan102455 said:
The Citrus Bowl attendance was really bad - stadium only half full, it that much. First Bowl game involving Tennessee I have ever attended where the attendance was that bad.
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UT made over $8M from the game and I'm sure it's scheduled for next year. There's money coming in. Butts in seats is useless. The money is in TV, sponsorships, brand exposure, and ad revenue.
 
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#165
#165
S.C. OrangeMan said:
That's how the NCAA loses millions of $$ in fines when they lose the inevitable restraint of trade federal lawsuit. That's a born loser given the impact it would have on NIL $$$.
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Nothing about that would be a losing case.
 
#167
#167
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
They're being OFFERED this scholarship and perks to come play football. It's not an academic scholarship.

Come play athletics, we'll give you the scholarship. You've repeatedly said, "The scholarship should be enough." Enough for what? Enough to get them to play sports.
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It is a scholarship for both. For their time, they get:

- Ability to secure an education in the vocation of their choice
- Tutoring to assist with the educational part of the offer
- Access to / Networking with those in the private sector associated with the vocation of their choice
- Training to become better at the sport of their choice
- Advertisement every time they take the field to play the sport of their choice
- Training and guidance on how to deal with the media and public aspect of being a public figure
- FREE Advertisement by association with a sport and a specific team that is contributing to their ability to secure contracts because of who they are
- A place to stay (lodging)
- Food to eat
- Physical and mental assistance to ensure that part of their well being
- Transportation to and from the locations where they will perform

There is probably more that I am not thinking of - but I wish folks would stop acting like they get nothing. If you added up the monetary value of all this, I dare say the equivalency is a very significant number and much more than most of these players would receive "if an employee" - because if they were an "employee" all of this would be noted and included in their compensation package.
 
#168
#168
volfan102455 said:
All the players are one injury away from never being able to take the field again. There is no guarantee that success at the high school level will translate to success at the college level and that success at the college level will translate to NFL success.

I hope that for each of these student athlete's sake, folks are reminding them of that and as such the importance of the educational opportunities they are receiving. It could be all they have to use post college.

And if all the player is interested in is playing football, then they should just bypass college - wait until they are a certain age and try out for the NFL without that experience.
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Any athlete at any level, even PeeWee is one injury away from having their career end.

Your argument is "never reach for your dreams because you might not be able to get them."

I'd rather end my athletic career at 22, have had a heck of a lot of fun playing ball, enjoyed my team and teammates, and maybe made a little money or drove a fine car for a few years.

You act like their lives will be ruined by the experience. Their future may not be what they've planned, but I assume your future is everything you planned it to be? Life is to be lived as it unfolds in front of you.
 
#170
#170
volfan102455 said:
There are expectations of the scholarship that was signed. Just like students that receive the Tennessee Promise funds are expected to complete certain volunteering activities to maintain the scholarship. They know (or should anyway) what they are signing up for. It is education and training both for their chosen sport and their chosen vocation.

With both of these scenarios the student is not an employee nor subject to the rules that a university employee would be subject too. If the players ever become employees, the rules of NIL will have to be modified to ensure they align with the same rules and guardrails other university employees are subject to.

I actually worked part time while in college for a department within the university system. I had to adhere to the rules of that employment as well as the rules associated with being a student.

These athletes should not be treated any different than another student. Every student has things they must adhere to in regard to their student activities and any financial aid they may receive. They don't adhere to those - they lose their aid and must pay their own way.
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I'm not sure there is anything to modify there. Any university employee can try to sell their NIL if someone is willing to pay for it. That, like professional athletes or any celebrity, is separate from any employment compensation they get. Its not subject to any employee rule that I'm aware of. I do believe some companies, maybe all, don't allow employees to use the company name if they are being pay for something outside of their "job".

I'm no legal expert on this so maybe I'm wrong but that seems logically how things work. We know what Peyton made for playing football because that information has been available. We don't know what he makes for endorsements or appearances .
 
#171
#171
VFLCodyGBO said:
Only fix is to let schools pay players and that introduces contracts.
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I hate to say it, but I think you are probably right. I think the only other thing that could cause a problem is the mercenary aspect. The one and dones. My analogy here is UK basketball vs UT basketball (although that line is getting more blurry as the day goes by). UK has been stupid with mercenaries over the last few years whereas we haven't. (My personal case in point though is Philipps. I couldn't care less about him, and really didn't while he was here....but love me some Zakai). Football will be the same. Mercenaries will abound regardless. Kind of makes senior day irrelevant I think as well.
 
#172
#172
volfan102455 said:
It is a scholarship for both. For their time, they get:

- Ability to secure an education in the vocation of their choice
- Tutoring to assist with the educational part of the offer
- Access to / Networking with those in the private sector associated with the vocation of their choice
- Training to become better at the sport of their choice
- Advertisement every time they take the field to play the sport of their choice
- Training and guidance on how to deal with the media and public aspect of being a public figure
- FREE Advertisement by association with a sport and a specific team that is contributing to their ability to secure contracts because of who they are
- A place to stay (lodging)
- Food to eat
- Physical and mental assistance to ensure that part of their well being
- Transportation to and from the locations where they will perform

There is probably more that I am not thinking of - but I wish folks would stop acting like they get nothing. If you added up the monetary value of all this, I dare say the equivalency is a very significant number and much more than most of these players would receive "if an employee" - because if they were an "employee" all of this would be noted and included in their compensation package.
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And they're worth more and have been for decades via under the table payments.

I'm not discounting the scholarship and perks, but athletes have been offered MORE than that for many, many years.

The market, whether you like it or not, says an elite athlete is worth more than just the scholarship and perks. That's facts.
 
#173
#173
The NCAA isn't going anywhere, and especially not our of business. They're too money hungry/greedy. They're not going to give up the mega $$$$ they get.
As far as enforcement is concerned, you don't see them reigning in the refs who let Alabama get away with murder every game.
I've said all along, the NIL belongs to those schools who have the biggest/wealthiest donors and how do the smaller schools compete for the best players when they can't offer as much NIL money? They can't. Can't you hear it now? Player A: Coach how much NIL money am I going to get? And if he doesn't like it, I'm going to bla-bla college instead.
 
#174
#174
volfan102455 said:
Exactly and no one is making they attend the University of Tennessee. It is a choice and that choice comes with a commitment.
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What does that word even mean anymore? People make a commitment to pay for a student loan, and we know how that is working out. Why should a choice of where to play football be any different?

Nah. college football is all about the money now. The loyalty to a team/university is gone, never to return. Frankly, I will be surprised if Nico is here the entire time until he goes pro.
 
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#175
#175
When I was an undergrad (Doug Dickey was our coach), the NCAA ruled football with an iron fist. TV was pretty much limited to one network and consisted of a little more than a dozen games broadcast during a season. TV schedules were made up a year ahead and generally based on the previous year's results. An appearance on TV was an event to be treasured. In other words, it was a fiasco for fans. The Georgia/Oklahoma lawsuit blew a hole in the NCAA below the waterline. Now, it is damned near irrelevant and powerless to address these present problems.
 
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