Transfer Portal is a disaster

[AllThingsTN]

We had an overseeing body. It was called the NCAA, and it did pretty okay at creating a competitive environment for student athletes, but people decided to blame it for everything. People hated it, legislators threatened it, hell, the Supreme Court told it that it was looking forward to killing it off.

Now that college football is wallowing in the muddy filth of this purely profit oriented cesspool -- now, suddenly -- people are clamoring for oversight again. It's beyond entertaining. What is the expression? "You've made your bed, now lie in it." Every time I see someone say "oh they need to impose this restriction" ... who are they kidding? Any attempt to create boundaries will be sued into oblivion. There is no going back. The bed has been made.

College football has been a purely profit oriented cesspool for a long time. It’s just that now the players who provide the means for the profit (legally) get a piece of the pie.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

That "bed" will no doubt include soaring tuition costs, cancelation of all non revenue sports including all women's sports, and most smaller schools eliminating all sports except for intermural games.QUOTE="Voltopia, post: 23539426, member: 25926"]
We had an overseeing body. It was called the NCAA, and it did pretty okay at creating a competitive environment for student athletes, but people decided to blame it for everything. People hated it, legislators threatened it, hell, the Supreme Court told it that it was looking forward to killing it off.

Now that college football is wallowing in the muddy filth of this purely profit oriented cesspool -- now, suddenly -- people are clamoring for oversight again. It's beyond entertaining. What is the expression? "You've made your bed, now lie in it." Every time I see someone say "oh they need to impose this restriction" ... who are they kidding? Any attempt to create boundaries will be sued into oblivion. There is no going back. The bed has been made.

[/QUOTE]

Do those who wallow in the muddy filth of profiting from their own labor agree? If so, they are more than a little hypocritical.

 

[Lars]

"college football will not survive!"

Whether you like it or not, college football will survive.

 

[DooleyOrangePants]

College football has been a purely profit oriented cesspool for a long time. It’s just that now the players who provide the means for the profit get a piece of the pie.

That’s very true. But it seems the folks serving the pie are making sure their slice is just as big as it always has been rather than actually taking a look at how this could be beneficial for all involved rather than a select few and asking for the students, families, fans and Joe Blows to keep ponying up more to keep the gravy train rolling.

 

[SpookyAction]

What boxing said in the 70s and early 80s. It nearly disappeared. NASCAR is the same. Keep thinking it!!!

This mess has happened in less than 3 years and no one is stepping in to stop it. Hell the coaches are even saying it’s a disaster!

I think boxing's decline is a real 180 opposite to what is happening with CFB.
Boxing's decline began when the big fights went from ABC broadcasting it to the masses like CFB today, to limiting access to subscribers of HBO and Showtime beginning in the late 70s and into the early 80s, and limiting it even further when prize fights went to ppv.

CFB's issues are from the billions generated by mass consumption of the product on TV. Boxing became a niche product that sees its niche getting smaller and smaller with viewer buy-ins getting more expensive

Larry Holmes was the last dominant heavyweight boxer the average person saw fight. Sugar Ray Leonard and Marvin Hagler were also that last generation of great champions millions watched. The second half of their careers were on premium cable channels. The number of eyes watching the best boxing live have been limited to smaller and smaller audiences as the Champions were only seen on premium cable and then ppv.

I loved boxing on Wide World of Sports. ABC's boxing coverage with Howard Cosell had a huge influence on me enjoying the sport. I loved watching Cosell.

Mike Tyson was very (in)famous, but by the time he was knocked out by Buster Douglas, few people were watching. I happened to see it live at a friend's house live during senior year of high school. I was calling my father and uncles to tell them it happened. No one could believe it or understand who I was telling them knocked him out. That is boxing's decline in a nutshell.

I did throw a huge party in college for the Foreman-Holyfield fight (1991, wow!). Those two did not disappoint. That is the last Big moment for boxing in my life. I have watched a lot of boxing ppv's over the years, but always at someone else's house.

It certainly did not help when Russian boxers flooded the professional boxing scene in the 90s, and American's became less and less dominant. Their style was based on scoring points. It was a calculating amateur style where the boxer scores point in the first 90 seconds of a round, then retreats to avoid giving their opponents opportunities to score. The majority of rounds lacked action for 2-2.5 minutes. The Russians also lacked the charisma of the American champions.

I read that boxing is still popular around the world where audiences can still watch the best boxers on widely available networks.

 

[Vol8188]

I don’t think it’s a disaster but I would like to see the following things implemented:

1. 2 transfers max
2. Can only transfer after 2 football seasons
3. Any transfer prior to your 2nd full season with that school means you forfeit your second transfer opportunity.
4. All scholarships are a 2 year commitment by the school. So if you sign a guy, you have to keep him for 2 seasons.

 

[AllThingsTN]

That’s very true. But it seems the folks serving the pie are making sure their slice is just as big as it always has been rather than actually taking a look at how this could be beneficial for all involved rather than a select few and asking for the students, families, fans and Joe Blows to keep ponying up more to keep the gravy train rolling.

Agree with that but I expect NIL in its current form will only be around another year or two. TV contracts are coming up and we know that’s what really runs the show. They’ll want something more rigid in place before signing 5+ year deals. Contracts are coming or at least something very difference than it looks right now.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The way to deal with this farce is to fall back to the academic part of the equation. It seems that making a passing grade or for that matter even attending a class has been forgotten. Make these "students" attain a passing grade (say a 2.75 min) of be "fired" and the educational system honor the rejection. That way there will be a "minor league for these guys as there should be. Then we will have a student sports system, as it for most of my life tried to be!!

The schools solved the academic equation by funneling sports revenue into a plethora of tutoring, mentoring, etc programs and such. The guys stay academically eligible and many ARE aware they're getting a great chance to learn and be helped academically if they have deficits. Some don't and let tutors drag them to eligibility.

It's not in the school's recruiting interest to be known as "tough on you in the classroom" like Vandy or an ivy League school.

The NCAA is in no position to tighten academics and I can assure you that the SEC and B1G have zero interest in losing recruits because of academics unless they're Vandy or Northwestern.

 

[CAVPUT]

Contracts are on the way...............

There have to already be NIL contracts. I don't think colleges want any part of having players sign employee contracts with schools. Right now they're sitting pretty. Make them the "employer" and life gets pretty damned hard pretty damned fast for those fat cats.

 

[DooleyOrangePants]

Agree with that but I expect NIL in its current form will only be around another year or two. TV contracts are coming up and we know that’s what really runs the show. They’ll want something more rigid in place before signing 5+ year deals. Contracts are coming or at least something very difference than it looks right now.

You make a really good point. There are always bigger fish and the network contracts seem to rule. That could force the hands of the out of control NIL environment, which I don’t think is sustainable in its current form.

 

[peaygolf]

There have to already be NIL contracts. I don't think colleges want any part of having players sign employee contracts with schools. Right now they're sitting pretty. Make them the "employer" and life gets pretty damned hard pretty damned fast for those fat cats.

That's the way it is in the "real world."

I say make the players pay for their college now.

Tuition
Room/Board
Books
Meal plan
Tutors
Clothes
Shoes
Medical issues (TONS of them)
Health insurance
etc
etc
etc
etc.


Please, don't let me go down that rabbit hole.................I'm trying to adapt and move on.

 

[DooleyOrangePants]

There have to already be NIL contracts. I don't think colleges want any part of having players sign employee contracts with schools. Right now they're sitting pretty. Make them the "employer" and life gets pretty damned hard pretty damned fast for those fat cats.

That’s what the CEO of my company has been saying for a few years. He says the minute this crosses into Employee/Employer territory, all bets are off on survival of the sport. The added costs in that scenario would be massive and so far beyond what they already incur. At that point, you might as well make the former NCAA into a minor league system for the major sports, drop the pretenses of student athlete and be done with it.

Question then becomes would it survive without that tie-in? As much as I love the sports and my university, you end that connection, I doubt I even care.

 

[CAVPUT]

I think boxing's decline is a real 180 opposite to what is happening with CFB.
Boxing's decline began when the big fights went from ABC broadcasting it to the masses like CFB today, to limiting access to subscribers of HBO and Showtime beginning in the late 70s and into the early 80s, and limiting it even further when prize fights went to ppv.

CFB's issues are from the billions generated by mass consumption of the product on TV. Boxing became a niche product that sees its niche getting smaller and smaller with viewer buy-ins getting more expensive

Larry Holmes was the last dominant heavyweight boxer the average person saw fight. Sugar Ray Leonard and Marvin Hagler were also that last generation of great champions millions watched. The second half of their careers were on premium cable channels. The number of eyes watching the best boxing live have been limited to smaller and smaller audiences as the Champions were only seen on premium cable and then ppv.

I loved boxing on Wide World of Sports. ABC's boxing coverage with Howard Cosell had a huge influence on me enjoying the sport. I loved watching Cosell.

Mike Tyson was very (in)famous, but by the time he was knocked out by Buster Douglas, few people were watching. I happened to see it live at a friend's house live during senior year of high school. I was calling my father and uncles to tell them it happened. No one could believe it or understand who I was telling them knocked him out. That is boxing's decline in a nutshell.

I did throw a huge party in college for the Foreman-Holyfield fight (1991, wow!). Those two did not disappoint. That is the last Big moment for boxing in my life. I have watched a lot of boxing ppv's over the years, but always at someone else's house.

It certainly did not help when Russian boxers flooded the professional boxing scene in the 90s, and American's became less and less dominant. Their style was based on scoring points. It was a calculating amateur style where the boxer scores point in the first 90 seconds of a round, then retreats to avoid giving their opponents opportunities to score. The majority of rounds lacked action for 2-2.5 minutes. The Russians also lacked the charisma of the American champions.

I read that boxing is still popular around the world where audiences can still watch the best boxers on widely available networks.

Used to hang on every fight since Liston/Clay. You take it behind a kind of pay wall and most lose interest. At least I did. Having said that, another reason boxing has lost some viewers is the rise of MMA. Personally, I'm a bigger fan of Muay Thai and Lethwei than even the UFC. I'll watch any of those before Id watch boxing today. Still say Hagler vs Hearns round 1 was the greatest round of boxing I've ever seen. Helluva fight.

 

[Butch s]

If "woke" culture men's getting paid for the product you produce instead of others gaining from my sweat, count me in

The woke angle to this is entitlement. We now live in an ultra entitled society. The college football agreement has always been, go to school, go to practice, stay out of trouble. In return you got a free upper education, free room and board, food,treated differently than an average student (bmoc) You were an Amateur athlete who was NOT entitled to be paid. If you don’t like that agreement, that’s fine, DON’T play. Stay home on the couch,smoke dope,eat Cheetos,play video games, maybe even sling some crack rock or meth on a side hustle.You’re not entitled to the university’s money, the “man’s” money, the boss’s money,the owner’s money. Not entitled to food stamps free phone,free healthcare. My parents and grandparents generation were embarrassed to ask for anything free. Today it is demanded

 

[CAVPUT]

That's the way it is in the "real world."

I say make the players pay for their college now.

Tuition
Room/Board
Books
Meal plan
Tutors
Clothes
Shoes
Medical issues (TONS of them)
Health insurance
etc
etc
etc
etc.


Please, don't let me go down that rabbit hole.................I'm trying to adapt and move on.

Ooh...I like that rabbit hole! They want to be "professional", let's take it all the way.

 

[peaygolf]

Ooh...I like that rabbit hole! They want to be "professional", let's take it all the way.

We could sit down and have a really fun "discussion" about this.................

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Ooh...I like that rabbit hole! They want to be "professional", let's take it all the way.

Sure, let's do that. Let's sign them as pro players and make college football disappear.

This attitude of "punish the players for this" when they didn't create scholarships, create the NIL, create the transfer rules, etc is just stupid.

These kids are simply growing up and these are the rules. They didn't make them, many may not want them, but they're not dumb...... you're probably not dumb either....... if there are opportunities out there, Carpe Diem!

What would you have them do at 18yo?

"Oh, I'm sorry. I don't think I should take this legal money or try to maximize my worth because this isn't how my Grandad did it. Thanks for the offer, but football shouldn't work this way."

How reality based is that?

 

[fossilfiction]

The problem is fixed with the playoff expansion and the elimination of all the bowl games outside of the top 25 teams getting there. Then it matters.
NIL and the transfer portal have done exactly what I hoped. Allowed players this American rights to earn in their name and provide better opportunities for the players and programs.

 

[Jimmyandjoes]

The woke angle to this is entitlement. We now live in an ultra entitled society. The college football agreement has always been, go to school, go to practice, stay out of trouble. In return you got a free upper education, free room and board, food,treated differently than an average student (bmoc) You were an Amateur athlete who was NOT entitled to be paid. If you don’t like that agreement, that’s fine, DON’T play. Stay home on the couch,smoke dope,eat Cheetos,play video games, maybe even sling some crack rock or meth on a side hustle.You’re not entitled to the university’s money, the “man’s” money, the boss’s money,the owner’s money. Not entitled to food stamps free phone,free healthcare. My parents and grandparents generation were embarrassed to ask for anything free. Today it is demanded

I would argue it's deserved. The "man" would not have his money, or a large % of it, without the services these athletes provide. Coaches used to get paid 500k/year and now make $8-10mil. That is a direct result of the product they produce and are paid commiserate to the services they provide. This new model just increases the total pool of payees, and IMO, rightfully so. For without them, who would we pay to go see provide their services. It's capitalism. There needs to be regulations/protections but unequivocally, players deserves to get paid. You can make them pay their own tuition, or that can be a perk/bonus. Either way, there would not be college football without the players, whom we pay to see.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

And what will that do but cause massive tuition increases to the majority 95% plus of the students that are simply trying to earn a degree to make it in life.

Nothing, because Tre schools don't pay NIL money.

 

[Jimmyandjoes]

I think boxing's decline is a real 180 opposite to what is happening with CFB.
Boxing's decline began when the big fights went from ABC broadcasting it to the masses like CFB today, to limiting access to subscribers of HBO and Showtime beginning in the late 70s and into the early 80s, and limiting it even further when prize fights went to ppv.

CFB's issues are from the billions generated by mass consumption of the product on TV. Boxing became a niche product that sees its niche getting smaller and smaller with viewer buy-ins getting more expensive

Larry Holmes was the last dominant heavyweight boxer the average person saw fight. Sugar Ray Leonard and Marvin Hagler were also that last generation of great champions millions watched. The second half of their careers were on premium cable channels. The number of eyes watching the best boxing live have been limited to smaller and smaller audiences as the Champions were only seen on premium cable and then ppv.

I loved boxing on Wide World of Sports. ABC's boxing coverage with Howard Cosell had a huge influence on me enjoying the sport. I loved watching Cosell.

Mike Tyson was very (in)famous, but by the time he was knocked out by Buster Douglas, few people were watching. I happened to see it live at a friend's house live during senior year of high school. I was calling my father and uncles to tell them it happened. No one could believe it or understand who I was telling them knocked him out. That is boxing's decline in a nutshell.

I did throw a huge party in college for the Foreman-Holyfield fight (1991, wow!). Those two did not disappoint. That is the last Big moment for boxing in my life. I have watched a lot of boxing ppv's over the years, but always at someone else's house.

It certainly did not help when Russian boxers flooded the professional boxing scene in the 90s, and American's became less and less dominant. Their style was based on scoring points. It was a calculating amateur style where the boxer scores point in the first 90 seconds of a round, then retreats to avoid giving their opponents opportunities to score. The majority of rounds lacked action for 2-2.5 minutes. The Russians also lacked the charisma of the American champions.

I read that boxing is still popular around the world where audiences can still watch the best boxers on widely available networks.

Same. I remember watching Hagler/Hearns or Leonard/Duran and more on ABC broadcast TV

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The woke angle to this is entitlement. We now live in an ultra entitled society. The college football agreement has always been, go to school, go to practice, stay out of trouble. In return you got a free upper education, free room and board, food,treated differently than an average student (bmoc) You were an Amateur athlete who was NOT entitled to be paid. If you don’t like that agreement, that’s fine, DON’T play. Stay home on the couch,smoke dope,eat Cheetos,play video games, maybe even sling some crack rock or meth on a side hustle.You’re not entitled to the university’s money, the “man’s” money, the boss’s money,the owner’s money. Not entitled to food stamps free phone,free healthcare. My parents and grandparents generation were embarrassed to ask for anything free. Today it is demanded

Negative. Not demanded. It's offered.

Athletic scholarships and special treatment was started by schools who wanted to win, not students who just grew up in it.

All the perks, the fancy equipment, the money under the table, etc, etc was started by schools who wanted to win and attract elite kids with "bells and whistles," not the kids.

These are freaking 18yo kids coming out of high school with talent and SCHOOLS are offering this.

This school offers this, that school offers more, this other school offers even more....... and you blame the kids?

 

[GAVol]

The woke angle to this is entitlement. We now live in an ultra entitled society. The college football agreement has always been, go to school, go to practice, stay out of trouble. In return you got a free upper education, free room and board, food,treated differently than an average student (bmoc) You were an Amateur athlete who was NOT entitled to be paid. If you don’t like that agreement, that’s fine, DON’T play. Stay home on the couch,smoke dope,eat Cheetos,play video games, maybe even sling some crack rock or meth on a side hustle.You’re not entitled to the university’s money, the “man’s” money, the boss’s money,the owner’s money. Not entitled to food stamps free phone,free healthcare. My parents and grandparents generation were embarrassed to ask for anything free. Today it is demanded

The problem with that is that what you are describing has nothing to do with today’s NIL. Not one single athlete in an NIL deal has received a cent of money from the university.

 

[Butch s]

Negative. Not demanded. It's offered.

Athletic scholarships and special treatment was started by schools who wanted to win, not students who just grew up in it.

All the perks, the fancy equipment, the money under the table, etc, etc was started by schools who wanted to win and attract elite kids with "bells and whistles," not the kids.

These are freaking 18yo kids coming out of high school with talent and SCHOOLS are offering this.

This school offers this, that school offers more, this other school offers even more....... and you blame the kids?

Not blaming the kids. They have been taught the art of entitlement by a certain part of society

 

[Butch s]

The problem with that is that what you are describing has nothing to do with today’s NIL. Not one single athlete in an NIL deal has received a cent of money from the university.

Did not say that. I was responding to the question of referencing wokeness. Try a little reading comprehension