Trump to sign national security funding bill, then declare State of Emergency

#777
#777
InVOLuntary said:
If the dems were for a wall Luther would be for the wall. This has nothing to do with the end results. He's admitted it 100% that it's totally because Trump wants it that he's against it.

Pick out Luther here:

NPC-crowd-485x282.jpg
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Only partially true as stated.
It's not that Trump wanted a wall, it's the way he knowingly used the "wall" to symbolize bigotry, hatred, divisiveness, and warped nationalism to the cheering glee of his base.
He bastardized the concept of having a wall for border security. All you wall lovers should realize he will end up causing the exact opposite of what he promised. And the wall is not the only issue where that will be true.
 
#778
#778
Tell you what, I'm going to move into fantasy land for a couple of minutes and see @ClearwaterVol has a valid argument.

So, tell me, how will this mandatory jailing be enforced in regards to hiring illegal aliens?
 
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#780
#780
luthervol said:
WTH? You didn't even ask a question.
You overreact to being wrong.......so much for practice makes perfect.
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Orange_Crush said:
You're an irrational, reactionary, emotional lemming. I don't care to go through every national emergency ever instituted, so I'll let you do it to support your claim that no president has instituted a national emergency to do his job at odds with congressional support or preferences. Actually, that's what they were created to do. Once you've shown that no president has ever done so, you can claim it set a precedent. Then we can discuss whether it would be a bad president to set. Then, you could really to change the powers given the Presidents because they give him powers you think shouldn't be given.
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Apparently I gave you too much credit, I apologize and amend. I'll take that as a "No. I have no interest in supporting my claims."
 
#781
#781
luthervol said:
He hasn't built an inch. Maybe a little replacement, but I think that's it so far.
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Trump's wall: How much has been built so far?
😘
“In the months that followed, the CBP said it has replaced about 14 miles of scrap metal barrier with a "bollard-style wall" in San Diego, built two miles of "primary wall" in California and 20 miles of "new border wall" in Santa Teresa, New Mexico.
And in December 2018, the CBP contracted the US Army Corps of Engineers to construct up to 14 miles of "secondary wall" and up to 15 miles of primary pedestrian replacement wall in San Diego, Yuma, and El Centro Sectors.”
 
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#783
#783
luthervol said:
Only partially true as stated.
It's not that Trump wanted a wall, it's the way he knowingly used the "wall" to symbolize bigotry, hatred, divisiveness, and warped nationalism to the cheering glee of his base.
He bastardized the concept of having a wall for border security. All you wall lovers should realize he will end up causing the exact opposite of what he promised. And the wall is not the only issue where that will be true.
Click to expand...

And how did he do that? Cause he said bad people were coming across? You're just a mindless robot that latches on to whatever the racist left tells you. Liberals/Democrats are the biggest racist on the planet. Sad thing is, many of them are brain washed and don't even realize it. Case in point, you.
 
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#784
#784
InVOLuntary said:
And how did he do that? Cause he said bad people were coming across? You're just a mindless robot that latches on to whatever the racist left tells you. Liberals/Democrats are the biggest racist on the planet. Sad thing is, many of them are brain washed and don't even realize it. Case in point, you.
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This isn’t an argument. It’s a rant.
 
#786
#786
Orange_Crush said:
So you're saying that it will act as a deterrent but not be 100% effective? What is your expectation of border control? What is your definition of "effective"? Being "not for open borders", what % effectiveness will make an investment worthwhile in closing the border?

I'm only being slightly sarcastic for effect, but know that the underlying point is a genuine question. What will you consider effective? Land mines? Sniper towers? A wire run with AIDS infected Dobermans?

You've seemed to admit that a wall will slow illegal entry down, (apparently vastly aiding border security personnel) and deterring MANY (most) illegal entry., and be so much of a deterrent that it will take damage as criminals try to get past it. So it will be helpful to hear what amount of deterrence becomes worthwhile in your view.

PS: There have been over 30 National Emergencies declared by the previous 3 or 4 presidents. Trump didn't set a precedent.
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I'll be the first to admit my views on a border wall are conflicted. As in any situation, you try to measure the good against the bad, and I guess I see more that could go wrong than I do right.
 
#787
#787
Orange_Crush said:
Apparently I gave you too much credit, I apologize and amend. I'll take that as a "No. I have no interest in supporting my claims."
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Almost an actual apology? I'll consider that progress.

You claimed Trump's actions weren't precedent setting with absolutely nothing to support your claim. You were called out on it and still showed no interest in supporting your claim. No biggie.
 
#788
#788
luthervol said:
Almost an actual apology? I'll consider that progress.

You claimed Trump's actions weren't precedent setting with absolutely nothing to support your claim. You were called out on it and still showed no interest in supporting your claim. No biggie.
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LOL, he apologized for thinking you were smarter than you are.
 
#789
#789
Weezer said:
I'll be the first to admit my views on a border wall are conflicted. As in any situation, you try to measure the good against the bad, and I guess I see more that could go wrong than I do right.
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That's where I am, too.

America, at one time, had reasonable immigration controls (i think). What happened? ..and why can we not return to things that worked in the past? If we cant go back, is it really necessary to spend the money on a wall?
 
#790
#790
Weezer said:
I'll be the first to admit my views on a border wall are conflicted. As in any situation, you try to measure the good against the bad, and I guess I see more that could go wrong than I do right.
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Like I said before, I don't like the idea of a border wall but to me it's black and white. You either have a wall or you have an open border. We can't police a border as long as our southern one with Mexico with people. Add to that even if you did it with guards, once their big toe hit's american soil, it's too late. They are now our responsibility to house, feed, cloth, provide healthcare and educate their children. Like I've said before, many uninformed Americans believe you just load them up on a school bus and take them back to the border and watch them cross back over. It doesn't work that way.
 
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#791
#791
InVOLuntary said:
And how did he do that? Cause he said bad people were coming across? You're just a mindless robot that latches on to whatever the racist left tells you. Liberals/Democrats are the biggest racist on the planet. Sad thing is, many of them are brain washed and don't even realize it. Case in point, you.
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He has absolutely demonized those crossing the border. Not sure how that can be argued after reviewing his speeches on the matter
 
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#793
#793
AirVol said:
Trump's wall: How much has been built so far?
😘
“In the months that followed, the CBP said it has replaced about 14 miles of scrap metal barrier with a "bollard-style wall" in San Diego, built two miles of "primary wall" in California and 20 miles of "new border wall" in Santa Teresa, New Mexico.
And in December 2018, the CBP contracted the US Army Corps of Engineers to construct up to 14 miles of "secondary wall" and up to 15 miles of primary pedestrian replacement wall in San Diego, Yuma, and El Centro Sectors.”
Click to expand...
From the links within the article you provided. Both are replacing fencing.
www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-border-fence-20180226-story.html
Meanwhile, the Border Patrol last week touted a new 30-foot structure replacing a little over two miles of decades-old barriers in Calexico as part of “the border wall.” News media announced the development as the first installation of Trump’s wall.
www.elpasotimes.com/story/news/immigration/2018/09/20/construction-trump-border-wall-begin-el-paso-border-patrol/1366414002/
A new border wall will replace fencing south of Downtown El Paso, Border Patrol officials said.
Construction of the wall will begin in the “Chihuahuita” neighborhood and continue east for four miles, the officials said.
Chihuahuita is El Paso’s oldest neighborhood with about 100 people currently living in the area. The southern boundary of the neighborhood is the border fence separating El Paso from Juárez.
 
#794
#794
McDad said:
That's where I am, too.

America, at one time, had reasonable immigration controls (i think). What happened? ..and why can we not return to things that worked in the past? If we cant go back, is it really necessary to spend the money on a wall?
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That's a question I've pondered as well. I think as countries south of our border have deteriorated and become more "third world" the incentive to come to the US to escape conditions in their own country has increased. Also, in the past when you came here, you didn't get the benefits that they receive now giving them more reason to come here. Then you have the criminal element that there is more opportunity here as well.
 
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#796
#796
luthervol said:
Almost an actual apology? I'll consider that progress.

You claimed Trump's actions weren't precedent setting with absolutely nothing to support your claim. You were called out on it and still showed no interest in supporting your claim. No biggie.
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You still don't want to deal with the specifics? It's strange that you keep saying I'm wrong. You said he'd set a precedent. I asked for you to prove it. You've waved your arms and refused to do so. And I'm wrong?

Like I said, you're an irrational emotional breakdown.
 
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#797
#797
kiddiedoc said:
Errr... Not a great analogy. There really isn't a medically-indicated use for cigarettes. Opioids remain one of the most effective agents for short-term and post-op pain relief.
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Sorry for the late bump, but is there an alternative to opioids? I have fought that beast before, and I don't look forward to going more rounds in the future with it.
 
#798
#798
InVOLuntary said:
That's a question I've pondered as well. I think as countries south of our border have deteriorated and become more "third world" the incentive to come to the US to escape conditions in their own country has increased. Also, in the past when you came here, you didn't get the benefits that they receive now giving them more reason to come here. Then you have the criminal element that there is more opportunity here as well.
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It's a thought worth exploring. I don't know if central and south American countries have become worse. Perhaps the US has become that much better by comparison. Or, maybe the fear of what happens if caught here illegally is no longer on their minds.
 
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#800
#800
InVOLuntary said:
He's demonized the criminal element of those that are crossing the border. Is he wrong? Are there not criminals coming across the border? You libs hear what you want to hear.
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The laziness of calling everyone a lib who dares have a different opinion is truly tiresome. Especially from someone who recently ranted about "mindless robot that latches on to whatever"

Sure there is a small number of criminals coming across. There are plenty of criminals who are born here too. There will always criminals in society that no wall will ever fix. Even those sworn to protect have criminal elements inside them.

The wall is completely useless without real immigration reform. That is the true emergency but it doesn't make the headlines like Trump's Magical Maginot line
 
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