U.S. Navy Not Fit For War

[USAFgolferVol]

So a roundabout is less costly than a 4 way stop?

They're less costly than traffic lights, which are usually the alternative. At least much more so than 4-way stops

 

[0nelilreb]

Take out or GPS satellites and we're done.

Ha ! not just military wise , this country would come to a screeching halt literally .

 

[0nelilreb]

They're less costly than traffic lights, which are usually the alternative. At least much more so than 4-way stops

F! Roundabouts.. they are stupid and the people that decide how they are designed, where to put them , and the signs that they need around them are just as stupid .

 

[Grand Vol]

The problem is they are politicizing the military. We are setting ourselves up for failure in any future major war (hell we can't even win against insurgents).

Nobody ever wins against insurgents. Don't care what the manual says; as long as they are willing to die for their cause and have a support base (willingly or unwillingly) no true insurgency will ever be defeated.

 

[VolStrom]

They're less costly than traffic lights, which are usually the alternative. At least much more so than 4-way stops

Have you ever seen the construction that takes place to create a roundabout? No way on earth it costs less than a 4 way stop or traffic lights.

 

[YankeeVol]

Nobody ever wins against insurgents. Don't care what the manual says; as long as they are willing to die for their cause and have a support base (willingly or unwillingly) no true insurgency will ever be defeated.

Wasn't really the point, just a side note.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

F! Roundabouts.. they are stupid and the people that decide how they are designed, where to put them , and the signs that they need around them are just as stupid .

Ok

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

If this is the case, then maybe we should do all that we can to avoid war.

You do know what is running the country don't you?

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Have you ever seen the construction that takes place to create a roundabout? No way on earth it costs less than a 4 way stop or traffic lights.

Yes, I have seen the construction and know the costs. Have you seen the costs of installing traffic lights and the construction required to add turn lanes?

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

To play your card.

NUNNAYER BIZNIS!

LOL. You can't win with that one Philecia.

 

[0nelilreb]

Ok

If you’ve ever tried to get a super load that’s 20’ wide, 107’ long , 17’ tall, and weighing in at over 100k lbs through one of those, you’d understand why I said that .

 

[VolStrom]

Yes, I have seen the construction and know the costs. Have you seen the costs of installing traffic lights and the construction required to add turn lanes?

Who said anything about adding turn lanes?

 

[GreyWolf1129]

My cousin retired in 1998, sailed boats out of Kings Bay.

Your cousin and I probably passed by one another. I rode the 627, 693, 657, 676, and finished on the 734 (USS Tennessee, of course). Loved the Attack boats; not so much the Boomers. I was on the 734 from late '96 to January of '00 when I retired.

And ND40 knows more than he should, based on his posts. Yes, it's inertial navigation when submerged, but those units have to have a solid fix (GPS, or there are a couple of other ways I don't remember) from time to time. ND40: read up on "Fix Expansion". If you can find anything online, that will help explain it.

I do remember when the Naval Academy stopped teaching Celestial Navigation. Mid 90's? I said then that it was a mistake, and that we had all of our eggs in the "GPS basket". I made sure my guys (enlisted navigation) maintained the skill set. Lo and behold, a few years back the USNA started teaching it again. They finally realized how vulnerable the GPS constellation was, and that if push ever came to shove the U.S. Navy would be high and dry with an officer and enlisted corps that had no idea how to do things the old way.

Like I said, glad I got out when I did. While it's probably still a bad idea to screw with a 3rd flight 688, or a Seawolf class, or a Virginia class sub, that's mainly because of the technology. In terms of "warrior mindset", the United States Submarine Force lost that mentality over two decades ago. I am not alone in my opinion among those of us who rode boats.

Shame. There was a time when the mere rumor of a U.S. sub in the area was enough to make certain bad actors go the other way.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Your cousin and I probably passed by one another. I rode the 627, 693, 657, 676, and finished on the 734 (USS Tennessee, of course). Loved the Attack boats; not so much the Boomers. I was on the 734 from late '96 to January of '00 when I retired.

And ND40 knows more than he should, based on his posts. Yes, it's inertial navigation when submerged, but those units have to have a solid fix (GPS, or there are a couple of other ways I don't remember) from time to time. ND40: read up on "Fix Expansion". If you can find anything online, that will help explain it.

I do remember when the Naval Academy stopped teaching Celestial Navigation. Mid 90's? I said then that it was a mistake, and that we had all of our eggs in the "GPS basket". I made sure my guys (enlisted navigation) maintained the skill set. Lo and behold, a few years back the USNA started teaching it again. They finally realized how vulnerable the GPS constellation was, and that if push ever came to shove the U.S. Navy would be high and dry with an officer and enlisted corps that had no idea how to do things the old way.

Like I said, glad I got out when I did. While it's probably still a bad idea to screw with a 3rd flight 688, or a Seawolf class, or a Virginia class sub, that's mainly because of the technology. In terms of "warrior mindset", the United States Submarine Force lost that mentality over two decades ago. I am not alone in my opinion among those of us who rode boats.

Shame. There was a time when the mere rumor of a U.S. sub in the area was enough to make certain bad actors go the other way.

Were you in in '89-'91?

 

[Orangeburst]

Your cousin and I probably passed by one another. I rode the 627, 693, 657, 676, and finished on the 734 (USS Tennessee, of course). Loved the Attack boats; not so much the Boomers. I was on the 734 from late '96 to January of '00 when I retired.

And ND40 knows more than he should, based on his posts. Yes, it's inertial navigation when submerged, but those units have to have a solid fix (GPS, or there are a couple of other ways I don't remember) from time to time. ND40: read up on "Fix Expansion". If you can find anything online, that will help explain it.

I do remember when the Naval Academy stopped teaching Celestial Navigation. Mid 90's? I said then that it was a mistake, and that we had all of our eggs in the "GPS basket". I made sure my guys (enlisted navigation) maintained the skill set. Lo and behold, a few years back the USNA started teaching it again. They finally realized how vulnerable the GPS constellation was, and that if push ever came to shove the U.S. Navy would be high and dry with an officer and enlisted corps that had no idea how to do things the old way.

Like I said, glad I got out when I did. While it's probably still a bad idea to screw with a 3rd flight 688, or a Seawolf class, or a Virginia class sub, that's mainly because of the technology. In terms of "warrior mindset", the United States Submarine Force lost that mentality over two decades ago. I am not alone in my opinion among those of us who rode boats.

Shame. There was a time when the mere rumor of a U.S. sub in the area was enough to make certain bad actors go the other way.

That is badass you were on the USS Tennessee. I have a hat. I had a friend I worked with on the USS Alabama when I lived in Alabama in the 90's. Like they select your boat basis where you are from.

 

[0nelilreb]

Your cousin and I probably passed by one another. I rode the 627, 693, 657, 676, and finished on the 734 (USS Tennessee, of course). Loved the Attack boats; not so much the Boomers. I was on the 734 from late '96 to January of '00 when I retired.

And ND40 knows more than he should, based on his posts. Yes, it's inertial navigation when submerged, but those units have to have a solid fix (GPS, or there are a couple of other ways I don't remember) from time to time. ND40: read up on "Fix Expansion". If you can find anything online, that will help explain it.

I do remember when the Naval Academy stopped teaching Celestial Navigation. Mid 90's? I said then that it was a mistake, and that we had all of our eggs in the "GPS basket". I made sure my guys (enlisted navigation) maintained the skill set. Lo and behold, a few years back the USNA started teaching it again. They finally realized how vulnerable the GPS constellation was, and that if push ever came to shove the U.S. Navy would be high and dry with an officer and enlisted corps that had no idea how to do things the old way.

Like I said, glad I got out when I did. While it's probably still a bad idea to screw with a 3rd flight 688, or a Seawolf class, or a Virginia class sub, that's mainly because of the technology. In terms of "warrior mindset", the United States Submarine Force lost that mentality over two decades ago. I am not alone in my opinion among those of us who rode boats.

Shame. There was a time when the mere rumor of a U.S. sub in the area was enough to make certain bad actors go the other way.

That’s some fascinating info that I didn’t know , and I live in Norfolk . Subs and sub folks are ummm… a little different , and there isn’t a lot of info passed around about stuff even here .

 

[AshG]

I never really understood this. I've had several family proudly serve. My grandfather, who was rather outspoken racist, even said that "none of that **** mattered when you were trying to kill the enemy before they killed you." If you're all brothers and sisters in the trenches, why not focus on that?

 

[0nelilreb]

I never really understood this. I've had several family proudly serve. My grandfather, who was rather outspoken racist, even said that "none of that **** mattered when you were trying to kill the enemy before they killed you." If you're all brothers and sisters in the trenches, why not focus on that?

Mine was the same way , a ww2 vet and very racist except when it came to trying not to be killed . Just goes to show how stupid people get when their azz isn’t on the line and how quickly they will embrace each other when it is .

 

[GreyWolf1129]

Were you in in '89-'91?

Yep. '89 to '91 I was in Charleston. 657 boat, then to the 676 boat sometime in '91. I don't remember the exact dates, but I made the Med 2-92 run on Billfish (SSN 676). We left in early May of '92, and came back in November.

I did 7 years straight sea duty from 1985 to 1993. Math is 8, but it worked out to just over 7 years on afloat commands.

Went to the 657 in '85, the 676 in "91, and then to shore duty in Kings Bay in '93. That's how I ended up in Georgia.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

If you’ve ever tried to get a super load that’s 20’ wide, 107’ long , 17’ tall, and weighing in at over 100k lbs through one of those, you’d understand why I said that .

I'm sure that's a bitch

 

[Impossible Girl]

'Every officer is up to speed on Diversity Training. Not so much ship handling': Scathing official report finds US Navy is not fit for war because of risk averse, politically correct, control-freak top brass

A scathing new report commissioned by members of Congress has claimed that the Navy's surface warfare forces have systemic training and leadership issues, including a focus on diversity that overshadows basic readiness skills.

The report prepared by Marine Lt. Gen. Robert Schmidle and Rear Adm. Mark Montgomery, both retired, came in response to recent Naval disasters, including the burning of the USS Bonhomme Richard in San Diego, two collisions involving Navy ships in the Pacific and the surrender of two small craft to Iran.

The report found that a staggering 94 percent of the subjects believed the recent Naval disasters were 'part of a broader problem in Navy culture or leadership.'

'I guarantee you every unit in the Navy is up to speed on their diversity training. I'm sorry that I can't say the same of their ship handling training,' said one recently retired senior enlisted leader.

A fire is seen on board USS Bonhomme Richard (LHD 6) at Naval Base San Diego, July 12, 2020 in San Diego. The $750 million ship had to be scrapped due to fire damage

The report focused on issued within the Navy's surface warfare forces, as opposed to submarine and aviation, and suggested that issues in the surface fleet could be unique due to better funding and training for submarine and aviation units.

One of the key issues raised by the officers interviewed for the report was a concern that Navy leaders spend more time focusing on diversity training than on developing warfighting capacity and key operational skills.

'Sometimes I think we care more about whether we have enough diversity officers than if we'll survive a fight with the Chinese navy,' lamented one lieutenant currently on active duty.

'It's criminal. They think my only value is as a black woman. But you cut our ship open with a missile and we'll all bleed the same color,' she added.

One recent destroyer captain said: 'where someone puts their time shows what their priorities are. And we've got so many messages about X, Y, Z appreciation month, or sexual assault prevention, or you name it. We don't even have close to that same level of emphasis on actual warfighting.'

'The non-combat curricula consume Navy resources, clog inboxes, create administrative quagmires, and monopolize precious training time. By weighing down sailors with non-combat related training and administrative burdens, both Congress and Navy leaders risk sending them into battle less prepared and less focused than their opponents,' the report added.

'The Navy treats warfighting readiness as a compliance issue,' said one career commander. 'You might even use the term compliance-centered warfare as opposed to adversary-centered warfare or warfighter-centered warfare.'

Navy is in disarray and focusing more on diversity training than warfighting, report says | Daily Mail Online

There you go. Turn the military into a social experiment and this is what happens.

 

[Orangeburst]

Yep. '89 to '91 I was in Charleston. 657 boat, then to the 676 boat sometime in '91. I don't remember the exact dates, but I made the Med 2-92 run on Billfish (SSN 676). We left in early May of '92, and came back in November.

I did 7 years straight sea duty from 1985 to 1993. Math is 8, but it worked out to just over 7 years on afloat commands.

Went to the 657 in '85, the 676 in "91, and then to shore duty in Kings Bay in '93. That's how I ended up in Georgia.

You in Georgia now?

 

[NorthDallas40]

Your cousin and I probably passed by one another. I rode the 627, 693, 657, 676, and finished on the 734 (USS Tennessee, of course). Loved the Attack boats; not so much the Boomers. I was on the 734 from late '96 to January of '00 when I retired.

And ND40 knows more than he should, based on his posts. Yes, it's inertial navigation when submerged, but those units have to have a solid fix (GPS, or there are a couple of other ways I don't remember) from time to time. ND40: read up on "Fix Expansion". If you can find anything online, that will help explain it.

I do remember when the Naval Academy stopped teaching Celestial Navigation. Mid 90's? I said then that it was a mistake, and that we had all of our eggs in the "GPS basket". I made sure my guys (enlisted navigation) maintained the skill set. Lo and behold, a few years back the USNA started teaching it again. They finally realized how vulnerable the GPS constellation was, and that if push ever came to shove the U.S. Navy would be high and dry with an officer and enlisted corps that had no idea how to do things the old way.

Like I said, glad I got out when I did. While it's probably still a bad idea to screw with a 3rd flight 688, or a Seawolf class, or a Virginia class sub, that's mainly because of the technology. In terms of "warrior mindset", the United States Submarine Force lost that mentality over two decades ago. I am not alone in my opinion among those of us who rode boats.

Shame. There was a time when the mere rumor of a U.S. sub in the area was enough to make certain bad actors go the other way.

I’m familiar with the interval position fix updates and augmentation methods to the navigator on airborne platform but not going into that even.

I try to be very careful and only post what I know to be in the public domain. Even if it’s common knowledge within my engineering community if I can’t find a web page on it I try to avoid posting specifics.

Plus with a sub it’s fairly common knowledge what the primary nav method has to be. Inertial. However how they sweeten that up and how often they do it is none of my damn business

 

[GreyWolf1129]

That is badass you were on the USS Tennessee. I have a hat. I had a friend I worked with on the USS Alabama when I lived in Alabama in the 90's. Like they select your boat basis where you are from.

Yeah, I picked the Tennessee for my final tour. So....Jeannette Rudy...Rudy's Farms...used to fly in a LearJet loaded with sausage right before we deployed. She also commissioned Old Timer knives to do a knife for the crew. There were 350 of them made, and I have one. It is engraved with the USS Tennessee (BB-43 and SSBN-734) logos. I have no idea what it's worth, but it ain't for sale at any price.

There is a guitar in the Offcrew Office (or used to be) signed by anybody that is anybody in country music. From Porter Wagner to Tim McGraw, that guitar is covered in ink. Probably priceless.

If you look at the original USS Tennessee patch, the running joke among the crew was that it was "A submarine coming out of a toilet".

And the galley? (Crew's Mess)......Tennessee Galley Authority. And Lord, they turned out some great chow.

Now you've got me dredging up old...very old...memories.

 

[GreyWolf1129]

You in Georgia now?

Yep.