Vaccine or not?

[Orangeslice13]

No we haven’t lost over 700k to unvaccinated COVId

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

You need to make your rounds then. Lots of opinionated blowhards in this forum. Most of them are Trumpers

What’s being Trumpers have to do with anything?

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

View attachment 402848

Sorry but CDC said so

 

[Orangeslice13]

Sorry but CDC said so

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Ya,
I’m capable of reading studies and drawing my own conclusions.

I guess that is the $64000 question: Where is the "good data"? Are we to the point where we have to come to terms with the notion that the FDA, CDC and most of these other "sources" of data are simply leading us along on a narrative to keep us pacified? Merck attacked its own product (Ivermectin) and didn't even make an attempt to see if it could be used as an effective treatment for COVID. But yet, they have a new drug coming out that is getting all of this ink that is supposed to be a game changer, and it turns out that it is very similar to Ivermectin. Just yesterday, I posted a story where J&J and Moderna were begging to get their boosters approved by the FDA, but the FDA argued that their original shots were fully effective for the variants, and therefore boosters weren't needed. These companies, in return, came out and actually sh*tted on their own vaccines and said that they lose effectiveness after 6 months... that's why they need the boosters approved.

To me, it is clear that the drug companies will do whatever they can to sell their latest and greatest drug, even if it is at the expense of one of their other products if the potential to turn a profit is out there. Merck can't make any money on Ivermectin and J&J and Moderna need to get in on this booster scam.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

I guess that is the $64000 question: Where is the "good data"? Are we to the point where we have to come to terms with the notion that the FDA, CDC and most of these other "sources" of data are simply leading us along on a narrative to keep us pacified? Merck attacked its own product (Ivermectin) and didn't even make an attempt to see if it could be used as an effective treatment for COVID. But yet, they have a new drug coming out that is getting all of this ink that is supposed to be a game changer, and it turns out that it is very similar to Ivermectin. Just yesterday, I posted a story where J&J and Moderna were begging to get their boosters approved by the FDA, but the FDA argued that their original shots were fully effective for the variants, and therefore wasn't needed. These companies, in return, came out and actually sh*tted on their own vaccines and said that they loose effectiveness after 6 months... that's why they need the boosters approved.

To me, it is clear that the drugs companies will do whatever they can to sell their latest and greatest drug, even if it is at the expense of one of other products if the potential to turn a profit is out there. Merck can't make any money on Ivermectin and J&J and Moderna need to get in on this booster scam.

It seems that people want to hang their hat on clinical studies as if they are infallible and the gold standard. I believe it used to be that way. But it’s not been that way for quite some time. I mean here is something from 2015


Big Pharma & Clinical Trials - Funding, Influence & Corruption

 

[Orangeslice13]

I guess that is the $64000 question: Where is the "good data"? Are we to the point where we have to come to terms with the notion that the FDA, CDC and most of these other "sources" of data are simply leading us along on a narrative to keep us pacified? Merck attacked its own product (Ivermectin) and didn't even make an attempt to see if it could be used as an effective treatment for COVID. But yet, they have a new drug coming out that is getting all of this ink that is supposed to be a game changer, and it turns out that it is very similar to Ivermectin. Just yesterday, I posted a story where J&J and Moderna were begging to get their boosters approved by the FDA, but the FDA argued that their original shots were fully effective for the variants, and therefore wasn't needed. These companies, in return, came out and actually sh*tted on their own vaccines and said that they loose effectiveness after 6 months... that's why they need the boosters approved.

To me, it is clear that the drugs companies will do whatever they can to sell their latest and greatest drug, even if it is at the expense of one of other products if the potential to turn a profit is out there. Merck can't make any money on Ivermectin and J&J and Moderna need to get in on this booster scam.

You do know that you don’t have to just read the conclusion and take their word for it don’t you?

 

[C1500]

Ya,
I’m capable of reading studies and drawing my own conclusions. I don’t really give a **** what either side is trying to spin it into.
For example you know I’ve spent some time on biblical study. I have no respect for those who have the commentary Bibles. If you need someone to tell you what you just read says then you’re not someone I’m interested in hearing an opinion from.

Having said that….a 68 year old who lived 5 houses down from me died today from Covid. He was not vaccinated and he’d had Covid before about 8-9 months ago. If I’d had been him I would not have gotten the vaccine either. The data doesn’t support Vac after infection IMO. So at some point you just have to make the best decision for yourself, do what you think is right to protect yourself and move on.

Welcome to the U.S. school system.

 

[InVOLuntary]

This is where it gets sticky for me.

What does a business typically have to do change the terms of employment? And that's not employment status. Not saying they cant be fired. I just see issues with a business suddenly saying employees get paid less, or have to work longer hours for same pay.

The employer should have that ability. The employees aren't slaves, they're free to move on.

 

[DynaLo]

View attachment 402848

Seriously? I’ve posted the actual numbers from the CDC on here in response to at least one of your previous posts.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Seriously? I’ve posted the actual numbers from the CDC on here in response to at least one of your previous posts.

Again….you do realize you don’t have to read their conclusion and take their word for it don’t you?
It’s interesting that you guys like to quote the CDC who I don’t trust as a source. Some of their studies survive peer review but more than half don’t,so…..

 

[Orangeslice13]

@Rasputin_Vol quoted a post of mine from September 21. I really like Ras so I will converse with him. I’m over the political hackery on this issue so don’t be shocked if I don’t give a **** what you post or think.
Shalom

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

View attachment 402848

I'm wondering when they do these comparisons of vaccinated deaths vs unvaccinated deaths, are the people including all of the people that died in 2020 in the unvaccinated data pool? Wouldn't a more fair comparison be to start when the vaccines began to roll out and then do a comparison of the vaccinated vs the unvaccinated? I think it unfairly skews the numbers in one direction to include 2020 numbers when no one last year would have been vaccinated. So we are basically starting the clock almost 9-10 months earlier on the unvaccinated and only counting vaccinated deaths starting in January 2021.

 

[C1500]

quote the CDC who I don’t trust as a source.

You can't trust any outlet anymore. Both sides spread **** like wild fire. I was looking for something to help my wife's cousin with a report. I couldn't find one major outlet that didn't twist every small detail of the story.

 

[DynaLo]

Again….you do realize you don’t have to read their conclusion and take their word for it don’t you?
It’s interesting that you guys like to quote the CDC who I don’t trust as a source. Some of their studies survive peer review but more than half don’t,so…..View attachment 402850

Well, what I posted from them was the annual cause of death stats so if they lied about Covid deaths on it then they lied about all the other causes of death to make the breakdowns equal the final total annual death number.

I don’t trust them very much either but their causes of annual deaths is normally pretty solid info as it can be easily cross checked to the American Heart Association, the American Cancer Society and other similar organizations.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I'm wondering when they do these comparisons of vaccinated deaths vs unvaccinated deaths, are the people including all of the people that died in 2020 in the unvaccinated data pool? Wouldn't a more fair comparison be to start when the vaccines began to roll out and then do a comparison of the vaccinated vs the unvaccinated? I think it unfair scews the numbers in one direction to include 2020 numbers when no one last year would have ben vaccinated. So we are basically starting the clock almost 9-10 months earlier on the unvaccinated and only counting vaccinated deaths starting in January 2021.

you can find every comparison imaginable if you look around. I like following the different state numbers that compare month by month. It’s interesting to see the trends develop over time.
It’s also interesting to see if there’s consistency from state to state. If there’s a difference is that reporting that’s different or is it something else going on like average age of the population.

but yes…both sides of this debate like to screw the data out of context to say what they want it to say.

 

[Septic]

Not walking anything back Gilligan. I stand by what I said. You spout ridiculous BS daily. Now go pet some Biden leg hair.

Good, I was worrying you were going to try and walk it back again - watching you desperately try and maintain your dignity after your online tough guy fit of rage is what I was counting on.

It appears as if you think repeating something about Biden's leg hair is supposed to get a reaction, we get it - you think it's a clever dig. It wasn't funny the first or fifteenth time you shoehorned it in, move on and try something else.

Tell me how I'd get my ass beat again, your tough guy talk is far more entertaining.

 

[Orangeslice13]

You can't trust any outlet anymore. Both sides spread **** like wild fire. I was looking for something to help my wife's cousin with a report. I couldn't find one major outlet that didn't twist every small detail of the story.

The CDC has been outed recently for ignoring the Lyme disease problem. Why is a matter of debate but they intentionally ignore the problem

 

[Sea Ray]

He can just learn to code.

Does that pay $34mill/yr?

 

[C1500]

Not walking anything back Gilligan. I stand by what I said. You spout ridiculous BS daily. Now go pet some Biden leg hair.

Good, I was worrying you were going to try and walk it back again - watching you desperately try and maintain your dignity after your online tough guy fit of rage is what I was counting on.

It appears as if you think repeating something about Biden's leg hair is supposed to get a reaction, we get it - you think it's a clever dig. It wasn't funny the first or fifteenth time you shoehorned it in, move on and try something else.

Tell me how I'd get my ass beat again, your tough guy talk is far more entertaining.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Well, what I posted from them was the annual cause of death stats so if they lied about Covid deaths on it then they lied about all the other causes of death to make the breakdowns equal the final total annual death number.

I don’t trust them very much either but their causes of annual deaths is normally pretty solid info as it can be easily cross checked to the American Heart Association, the American Cancer Society and other similar organizations.

I’m trying not to be rude to you. But you’re trying to engage in an argument/debate that I don’t care to have/defend/argue.
CDC is straight political motivated garbage IMO and I don’t care to defend that position. Sorry

 

[Jxn Vol]

Good, I was worrying you were going to try and walk it back again - watching you desperately try and maintain your dignity after your online tough guy fit of rage is what I was counting on.

It appears as if you think repeating something about Biden's leg hair is supposed to get a reaction, we get it - you think it's a clever dig. It wasn't funny the first or fifteenth time you shoehorned it in, move on and try something else.

Tell me how I'd get my ass beat again, your tough guy talk is far more entertaining.

Gilligan oh Gilligan, if you run your mouth like you do on here in the real world I have no doubt you would piss off the wrong people and get your tail kicked. Nothing more. Nothing less. Is that simple enough for you?

 

[Septic]

View attachment 402857

My experience is that guys who talk about wanting to meet at the waffle house, have no intention of showing up. They'll just talk about another man's leg hair in hopes that the sheer amount of cringe will force you to stay away.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Again the thing that has me rattled today is the death of a friend to Covid who had Covid previously 9 months ago.

 

[Septic]

Gilligan oh Gilligan, if you run your mouth like you do on here in the real world I have no doubt you would piss off the wrong people and get your tail kicked. Nothing more. Nothing less. Is that simple enough for you?

What's this Gilligan gambit you're employing? Are you Ginger?

Are we roleplaying?

What's your safe word? You'll need one.