Vaccine or not?

[Orangeslice13]

I think there is enough evidence of other drugs working too but here comes an antidepressant and boom teh .gov jumps all over that.

Again……
Ivermectin can’t be proven to work in several studies. this drug which is cheap and has minimal side effects can be proven to work. You say there are others, and I don’t doubt it as it would only buster support for my point, but I don’t know about their cost or side effects.
And the push is for the drug that doesn’t work. It’s maddening really.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Published means squat now.

Again I get that you’re trying to debate this but you’re making my points for me.

 

[whodeycin85]

It says it’s not a study. It’s guestamates based on general information. It even says that in the link. The Vandy study is an investigation into actual cases and causation not just deaths within a timeframe

Where does it say that...if i missed it my bad

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

This is published. It’s just as much you guys ignoring it as anyone.

I've known about this treatment for several months along with several others. The Ivermectin deal is one I've talked about the most because I actually know people that have taken it and I know of at least two doctors within my circle that have been prescribing it and have had no issues.

 

[hog88]

Again……
Ivermectin can’t be proven to work in several studies. this drug which is cheap and has minimal side effects can be proven to work. You say there are others, and I don’t doubt it as it would only buster support for my point, but I don’t know about their cost or side effects.
And the push is for the drug that doesn’t work. It’s maddening really.

Sorry but I don't trust the "studies" everything was and still is politicized. I know some people that have went the ivermectin route and it worked for them, whether it did or not who knows they might have gotten better in 3-4 days without it. But don't expect me to trust a study pushing an antidepressant.

 

[whodeycin85]

It says it’s not a study. It’s guestamates based on general information. It even says that in the link. The Vandy study is an investigation into actual cases and causation not just deaths within a timeframe

You have a link to the vanderbilt study

 

[hog88]

Again I get that you’re trying to debate this but you’re making my points for me.

I'm not trying to debate this. I would simply caution anyone from taking an antidepressant and no I don't trust the study.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Sorry but I don't trust the "studies" everything was and still is politicized. I know some people that have went the ivermectin route and it worked for them, whether it did or not who knows they might have gotten better in 3-4 days without it. But don't expect me to trust a study pushing an antidepressant.

The medical and scientific communities have shown that they cannot be trusted. The very fact that we have them moving the goalposts seems like every 30 days and they still push the efficacy of masks should be enough to make us cynical.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Sorry but I don't trust the "studies" everything was and still is politicized. I know some people that have went the ivermectin route and it worked for them, whether it did or not who knows they might have gotten better in 3-4 days without it. But don't expect me to trust a study pushing an antidepressant.

If it’s flawed then attack the methodology. If something works then you should be able to reproduce the results in a study. double blind studies are not easy to fake and are obvious when they are.
But sure, let’s make these decisions on our feelings

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Again……
Ivermectin can’t be proven to work in several studies. this drug which is cheap and has minimal side effects can be proven to work. You say there are others, and I don’t doubt it as it would only buster support for my point, but I don’t know about their cost or side effects.
And the push is for the drug that doesn’t work. It’s maddening really.

Slice, they can't even bring themselves to endorse getting vitamin D levels up and taking zinc as a practical prophylaxis. Imagine how many lives could have been saved just by promoting that cheap alternative as opposed to the jabs?

That is why people are cynical about some of these studies and taking any of their advice.

 

[hog88]

If it’s flawed then attack the methodology. If something works then you should be able to reproduce the results in a study. double blind studies are not easy to fake and are obvious when they are.
But sure, let’s make these decisions on our feelings

I'm not making decisions based on feelings. I've made my decision based on the fact that I've seen alternatives work yet the "studies" say they don't and along comes one with a drug that the .gov wishes everyone to be on and it's the magic bullet.

Well maybe I am going off feelings since trust is a feeling and I don't trust anything coming out of our .gov now.

 

[AshG]

I've not seen fluvoxamine mentioned as any kind of magic bullet, and its only mentions on a .gov site say it hasn't seen enough human trials for consideration.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

I'm not making decisions based on feelings. I've made my decision based on the fact that I've seen alternatives work yet the "studies" say they don't and along comes one with a drug that the .gov wishes everyone to be on and it's the magic bullet.

Well maybe I am going off feelings since trust is a feeling and I don't trust anything coming out of our .gov now.

I've been of the opinion that with a novel virus, we should have left every option open and made them available to the people. Slice and others seem to think that Ivermectin is at best a placebo. Fine. If taking a placebo along with other items gets more people treated, I don't see the harm in it. Especially when you consider that we are out here mandating an experimental jab with no long term data on side effects.

If chicken s^^t and cow snot were shown to work on a few people, I've seen enough to know that there are people out here that would try it if they see results.

We are losing lives needlessly over a preferred pathway that govt and Big Pharma (same thing) want us to use.

 

[hog88]

I've been of the opinion that with a novel virus, we should have left every option open and made them available to the people. Slice and others seem to think that Ivermectin is at best a placebo. Fine. If taking a placebo along with other items gets more people treated, I don't see the harm in it. Especially when you consider that we are out here mandating an experimental jab with no long term data on side effects.

If chicken s^^t and cow snot were shown to work on a few people, I've seen enough to know that there are people out here that would try it if they see results.

We are losing lives needlessly over a preferred pathway that govt and Big Pharma (same thing) want us to use.

I absolutely do believe that any cheap, effective treatment would have been fought tooth and nail during the whole of 2020.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

I've not seen fluvoxamine mentioned as any kind of magic bullet, and its only mentions on a .gov site say it hasn't seen enough human trials for consideration.

About the time I had heard about this option, there were also some people talking about nicotine having some correlation to lower infection rates and using niacin... along with several others.

There are more options than those I mentioned and they need to be pursued. If we can push these vaccines with them going through the proper trials, then why are we quick to dismiss other alternatives because of them not having any studies or going through the process?

 

[kiddiedoc]

From the current UpToDate info:

Fluvoxamine – Data suggest that the antidepressant fluvoxamine may reduce progression to severe disease in early, mild COVID-19, although trials indicating benefit are hampered by methodologic issues, reducing certainty about any effect. Although potentially promising, additional data are needed to inform the utility of fluvoxamine before recommending its widespread use outside a clinical trial

I will try to link the actual studies over lunch.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I'm not making decisions based on feelings. I've made my decision based on the fact that I've seen alternatives work yet the "studies" say they don't and along comes one with a drug that the .gov wishes everyone to be on and it's the magic bullet.

Well maybe I am going off feelings since trust is a feeling and I don't trust anything coming out of our .gov now.

Government isn’t the only ones producing studies.
And if they were it would not pass peer review if it was crap. There are plenty of people doing work that are interested in what actually works. Besides that, I’m way more interested in methodology than who’s doing it.
Double blind isn’t something that’s easy to fake. It’s interesting that the miracle drug can’t even get by a simple data collection.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I've not seen fluvoxamine mentioned as any kind of magic bullet, and its only mentions on a .gov site say it hasn't seen enough human trials for consideration.

Correct. And I’m not pushing it as a magic bullet either. Just pointing out it has promise and is actually showing to work as opposed to the miracle drug that is repeatedly showing to be placebo
Edit: in fact I left the name out because it wasn’t the point I was making. Someone else brought up the name.

 

[hog88]

Government isn’t the only ones producing studies.
And if they were it would not pass peer review if it was crap. There are plenty of people doing work that are interested in what actually works. Besides that, I’m way more interested in methodology than who’s doing it.
Double blind isn’t something that’s easy to fake. It’s interesting that the miracle drug can’t even get by a simple data collection.

Climate Change studies have been "peer reviewed".

Hey, I hope it works and helps put an end to this madness.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Climate Change studies have been "peer reviewed".

Hey, I hope it works and helps put an end to this madness.

And a lot is thrown out as garbage. regardless of how it’s reported. That doesn’t mean you can’t read it yourself and draw your own conclusion

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Climate Change studies have been "peer reviewed".

Hey, I hope it works and helps put an end to this madness.

Not to mention, even if a doctor were to try to come out with data that runs counter to the narrative, they can be threatened with having their license revoked in some of these states.

These guys would likely imprison Galileo if given the opportunity.

 

[GroverCleveland]

No, we get extra points for employees getting hurt and man if ya get one killed you make the bonus round.

It is why I like hiring Mexicans. They will actually bring in the replacement and train 'em for you.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Not to mention, even if a doctor were to try to come out with data that runs counter to the narrative, they can be threatened with having their license revoked in some of these states.

These guys would likely imprison Galileo is given the opportunity.

Naw, the shift is happening now. Optimist prime is the beginning of endemic status for this thing. The powers that be are positioning themselves to take credit for the end of it. They’re switching off of pretending it’s going to continue

 

[hog88]

And a lot is thrown out as garbage. regardless of how it’s reported. That doesn’t mean you can’t read it yourself and draw your own conclusion

I will read with a cynical eye.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I will read with a cynical eye.

That’s what I do.
This current conversation is the drug you picked. I left the name out on purpose. There have been 3-4 in the last couple weeks that released information as promising. It didn’t matter to me which one we talked about. My point remains.
Nobody on either side seems to be concerned with what actually works