Vaccine or not?

[hUTch2002]

Unvaccinated Wimbledon Champ Novak Djokovic Out of US Open

“The U.S. Open does not have a vaccination mandate in place for players, but it will respect the U.S. government's position regarding travel into the country for unvaccinated non-U.S. citizens.

The CDC requires foreign travelers to the United States to be fully vaccinated before getting on their flights, according to the agency.”

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/djokovic-tennis-us/2022/07/20/id/1079677/

As stupid as the rule is I agree with following it for everyone. Athletes don’t get exceptions if Bob from England doesn’t. Kudos to Djokovic, who is chasing history to be the GOAT, now not playing in a major for the second time this year due to this. He absolutely would’ve won in Australia and likely would in NY too. He’s not compromising his values for the sake of his tennis legacy though. Good for him.

 

[hUTch2002]

Had them around my waist and ribs , they are in my top 3 things that I never want to go through again .

The other 2 being a Celine Dion concert and another game with Pruitt as coach?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

You can put me in this group. I understand that vaccines have a very important role BUT, after the bastardization of the Covid shot, who knows when they will try and slip ma a micky

Exactly my concern.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

It’s interesting that we don’t hear from the folks claiming that “businesses can do whatever they want” in terms of vax requirements. I’m sorry but if a company says you have to ingest poison to keep your job then that company should be taken down to its knees.

All the alphabet agencies need to be gutted down to the studs.

It's still at least one in here that does.

 

[Jxn Vol]

It's still at least one in here that does.

Yep. I hope he gets dragged with work comp claims due to vax injury.

 

[ButchPlz]

It's still at least one in here that does.

I think you and I have agreed that these mandates show the failures of "libertarian" ideas.

 

[hog88]

It’s interesting that we don’t hear from the folks claiming that “businesses can do whatever they want” in terms of vax requirements. I’m sorry but if a company says you have to ingest poison to keep your job then that company should be taken down to its knees.

All the alphabet agencies need to be gutted down to the studs.

Dumb take. However I fully support people boycotting any business that has policies antithetical to their beliefs.

 

[hog88]

It's still at least one in here that does.

Who’s that? I haven’t seen anyone here claim that they have instituted vax requirements in their business.

 

[Jxn Vol]

Dumb take. However I fully support people boycotting any business that has policies antithetical to their beliefs.

Dumb take huh. Well you are entitled to your opinion. And I’m entitled to tell you where you can shove that opinion. Like I said earlier. I hope work comp vax injury claims bury the businesses that held these folks hostage to keep their jobs.

Also now that more information comes out I hope that people supporting these mandates see just how stupid they were. Even posters on VN. Step up and admit how stupid your positions were.

 

[hog88]

Dumb take huh. Well you are entitled to your opinion. And I’m entitled to tell you where you can shove that opinion. Like I said earlier. I hope work comp vax injury claims bury the businesses that held these folks hostage to keep their jobs.

Also now that more information comes out I hope that people supporting these mandates see just how stupid they were. Even posters on VN. Step up and admit how stupid your positions were.

Another dumb take on your part. Sorry you hate the idea of people having the freedom to make decisions.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Get your shots, folks.

Naw. I'll keep my blood pure thanks

 

[Jxn Vol]

Another dumb take on your part. Sorry you hate the idea of people having the freedom to make decisions.

Sorry you don’t see how the government has used business to push an agenda. So your take is dumb and you can sit and spin on it.

 

[hog88]

Sorry you don’t see how the government has used business to push an agenda. So your take is dumb and you can sit and spin on it.

I do see that and I’m absolutely opposed to any of the.gov vax mandates but I support the freedom of choice and that includes a business being able to set it’s own employment policies.

 

[marcusluvsvols]

These are my covid experiences from 5 different sites in Virginia. I’ll try to address each point you made.
Patients were indeed cut off from visitation if they had covid. The families weren’t even allowed on the unit. All visitation was cut from covid units. The only way they could get updated was from nurses and an occasional call from a physician.
Tube feeds were started and the sooner the better. Unfortunately with pts on fentanyl, propofol and horse tranquilizer ketamine the gastrointestinal system is so suppressed that we ended up with pts getting an ileus. The gut just stopped moving. I have had a pt who was ventilated family member try to feed them chicken. The public can be dumb.

Remdesivir and Vanco definitely can harm the kidneys. Steroids do not. Vancomycin is dosed by the pharmacy according to a persons glomerular filtration rate. I personally would not take remdesivir if it was free. Most pts who were admitted to ICUs had already completed their remdesivir run in a step down unit and ended up coming to the ICU anyway. More than half already had acute kidney injury.

We have standard treatment pathways endorsed by the NIH. Covid was new and the conventional treatment for the resulting damage to the endothelial lining of the lungs, the ARDS protocol, did not ventilate the pts adequately. We ended up ventilating people at levels unused before. Pts who were sedate and had natural respiratory drives often made it impossible to ventilate them. So they were paralyzed, treated for pain and sedated. 3 drugs and sometimes 5 has to be added to ventilate them. I take issue with the statement on preceded they made about it being a powerful sedative. We can actually extubate people on precedex, so it’s not.

The CDC and NIH absolutely interfered with the physician pt relationship. I watched it happen for 2 years. They thwarted early ambulatory treatment by decrying HCQ and ivermectin or anything but REMDESIVIR. ($$$$) cost benefit to pt was negative but it was big bucks for hospitals and big pharma. The research industry took a big hit in confidence publishing studies treating people who were past the window of opportunity with helpful drugs well into not recovering then proclaiming
“ see, it doesn’t work”. ex. The VA study.
Physicians licenses were threatened and ties were cut to hospitals. This happened in several states with Michigan being the most prominent in my memory because it affected physicians groups I knew to be rock solid practitioners. Paul Merik from sentara being another example. I worked with the man and find him highly credible. He’s not going to waste a brilliant career and position as medical director for ICU speaking nonsense. He was flat out denied the right to treat as needed. So much for science.

DNR orders. You can have the ethics committee get involved with various levels of involvement. When a pt is vent dependent but their settings are too high they can’t have a tracheostomy and go to a long term facility. 14 days is the benchmark for a trach due to concerns with tracheal erosion from the ET tube. When a pt is vented for 21 days you have to have 2 physicians determine that the pt is no longer viable. I only saw 2 physicians that were brave enough to make those calls and override a family wish with too do everything. With 4 or 5 systems not showing any recovery but getting worse every day, I think they made the proper calls.

Lack of community education and lack of practitioner communication caused untold amount of grief. If you can’t see your loved one the practitioner should spend time explaining what the pt is experiencing in depth. This is where the medical community failed with the tremendous loads we were given. Some failed much worse than others. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been screamed at on the phone because I was the nurse who happened to follow 2 others who didn’t take time to properly inform the family of what’s happening. Chinese telephone. We disseminate information to the POA and they incorrectly tell the family. Happened hundreds of times. So we get blasted because the POA shouldn’t be the POA. It sounds like the people in the article suffered both issues.
I’ve taken some crap over not being shotted up. I handed it back when they took a week off with covid and 4 shots. They deserved the flack back. It has been evident that the federal gov and cdc bypassed safety information and lied about the shot efficacy and those who believed them occasionally felt some moral high ground without being able to explain the shot to me or it’s possible side effects. Meh. Go get your shot and leave me out of it.
The CDC has changed its guidance so many times I have whiplash. Should there be repercussions for government intimidation of physicians? Should there be consequences for the massive shut downs that screwed the economy because of bad science? Should there be repercussions for pushing a shot that was nothing but smoke and mirrors?

Hey NGV. Thanks for another good post.

Without typing a novel, this is what happened to my FIL...an otherwise healthy 60yo carpenter who worked with his hands right up until the day before he was hospitalized...with my wife going to the hospital and speaking with DRs abd being as close to him as she could all day every day for 37 days:

Admitted with covid. No remdesivir or other antivirals. Knocked out and vented..

21 days not being allowed to see him even for a moment...despite my wife begging DRs, admin, lots of crying etc. No drugs given in this time to treat the actual illness. Feed tube inserted etc.

Day 21 wife gets in...stays at hospital every possible moment from then on reading to him, praying, playing music from church etc. DRs treat secondary infections from feeding tube etc, wife records his DR on audio refusing to feed my FIL anymore on about day 31...plays recording for hospital admin...gets new DRs. New Dr is a female Christian lady who is still friends with my wife today. She is sympathetic but guidelines are same. FIL still sedated and receiving no treatment other than fighting secondary infections.

Day 37 my FIL dies. Wrecks my wife of course and her entire family. Very codependent tightnit group. The only treatment he received in 37 days in hospital was paralytic/sedatives and a ventilator. Zero drugs were ever given to fight covid or help him recover. They took him in, locked us out for 21 days, knocked him out and said "hopefully his body will beat this on its own from this comatose state." It did not obviously.

My MIL got the bill and it is over 1 million dollars because they did not have medical insurance. She will never be able to repay that, especially without her husband of 40 years .

 

[Orangeburst]

Hey NGV. Thanks for another good post.

Without typing a novel, this is what happened to my FIL...an otherwise healthy 60yo carpenter who worked with his hands right up until the day before he was hospitalized...with my wife going to the hospital and speaking with DRs abd being as close to him as she could all day every day for 37 days:

Admitted with covid. No remdesivir or other antivirals. Knocked out and vented..

21 days not being allowed to see him even for a moment...despite my wife begging DRs, admin, lots of crying etc. No drugs given in this time to treat the actual illness. Feed tube inserted etc.

Day 21 wife gets in...stays at hospital every possible moment from then on reading to him, praying, playing music from church etc. DRs treat secondary infections from feeding tube etc, wife records his DR on audio refusing to feed my FIL anymore on about day 31...plays recording for hospital admin...gets new DRs. New Dr is a female Christian lady who is still friends with my wife today. She is sympathetic but guidelines are same. FIL still sedated and receiving no treatment other than fighting secondary infections.

Day 37 my FIL dies. Wrecks my wife of course and her entire family. Very codependent tightnit group. The only treatment he received in 37 days in hospital was paralytic/sedatives and a ventilator. Zero drugs were ever given to fight covid or help him recover. They took him in, locked us out for 21 days, knocked him out and said "hopefully his body will beat this on its own from this comatose state." It did not obviously.

My MIL got the bill and it is over 1 million dollars because they did not have medical insurance. She will never be able to repay that, especially without her husband of 40 years .

.

 

[Jxn Vol]

I do see that and I’m absolutely opposed to any of the.gov vax mandates but I support the freedom of choice and that includes a business being able to set it’s own employment policies.

Well that’s exactly what you are for. Businesses becoming the enforcement arm of the government. When it goes against life liberty and the pursuit of happiness for an individual I hope it buries you.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Hey NGV. Thanks for another good post.

Without typing a novel, this is what happened to my FIL...an otherwise healthy 60yo carpenter who worked with his hands right up until the day before he was hospitalized...with my wife going to the hospital and speaking with DRs abd being as close to him as she could all day every day for 37 days:

Admitted with covid. No remdesivir or other antivirals. Knocked out and vented..

21 days not being allowed to see him even for a moment...despite my wife begging DRs, admin, lots of crying etc. No drugs given in this time to treat the actual illness. Feed tube inserted etc.

Day 21 wife gets in...stays at hospital every possible moment from then on reading to him, praying, playing music from church etc. DRs treat secondary infections from feeding tube etc, wife records his DR on audio refusing to feed my FIL anymore on about day 31...plays recording for hospital admin...gets new DRs. New Dr is a female Christian lady who is still friends with my wife today. She is sympathetic but guidelines are same. FIL still sedated and receiving no treatment other than fighting secondary infections.

Day 37 my FIL dies. Wrecks my wife of course and her entire family. Very codependent tightnit group. The only treatment he received in 37 days in hospital was paralytic/sedatives and a ventilator. Zero drugs were ever given to fight covid or help him recover. They took him in, locked us out for 21 days, knocked him out and said "hopefully his body will beat this on its own from this comatose state." It did not obviously.

My MIL got the bill and it is over 1 million dollars because they did not have medical insurance. She will never be able to repay that, especially without her husband of 40 years .

Just unbelievably sad, tragic, and reprehensible on so many levels.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

Remember also that even the branded vaccines remain EUA only for younger children.
I.e.: any complications -- your girls can't have children in the future, they develop myocarditis, blood clots, later autoimmune conditions, ADE.... no legal ramifications.

Oh, and by the way, there is no evidence that the shots reduce the risk of hospitalization or death in healthy children, the rates of which without mRNA shots are 0.0% and 0.00%, respectively.

I think the worst part is they will all get away scot free. It makes me angry.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

Hey NGV. Thanks for another good post.

Without typing a novel, this is what happened to my FIL...an otherwise healthy 60yo carpenter who worked with his hands right up until the day before he was hospitalized...with my wife going to the hospital and speaking with DRs abd being as close to him as she could all day every day for 37 days:

Admitted with covid. No remdesivir or other antivirals. Knocked out and vented..

21 days not being allowed to see him even for a moment...despite my wife begging DRs, admin, lots of crying etc. No drugs given in this time to treat the actual illness. Feed tube inserted etc.

Day 21 wife gets in...stays at hospital every possible moment from then on reading to him, praying, playing music from church etc. DRs treat secondary infections from feeding tube etc, wife records his DR on audio refusing to feed my FIL anymore on about day 31...plays recording for hospital admin...gets new DRs. New Dr is a female Christian lady who is still friends with my wife today. She is sympathetic but guidelines are same. FIL still sedated and receiving no treatment other than fighting secondary infections.

Day 37 my FIL dies. Wrecks my wife of course and her entire family. Very codependent tightnit group. The only treatment he received in 37 days in hospital was paralytic/sedatives and a ventilator. Zero drugs were ever given to fight covid or help him recover. They took him in, locked us out for 21 days, knocked him out and said "hopefully his body will beat this on its own from this comatose state." It did not obviously.

My MIL got the bill and it is over 1 million dollars because they did not have medical insurance. She will never be able to repay that, especially without her husband of 40 years .

I’m so sorry Marcus. I’m sorry for your wife and your MIL too. This is what I saw played out again and again and again. Even when they switched to remdesivir and later ventilation. Still the same result.
The human cost of all this, the families, it’s just sickening.

 

[VolinWayne]

Hey NGV. Thanks for another good post.

Without typing a novel, this is what happened to my FIL...an otherwise healthy 60yo carpenter who worked with his hands right up until the day before he was hospitalized...with my wife going to the hospital and speaking with DRs abd being as close to him as she could all day every day for 37 days:

Admitted with covid. No remdesivir or other antivirals. Knocked out and vented..

21 days not being allowed to see him even for a moment...despite my wife begging DRs, admin, lots of crying etc. No drugs given in this time to treat the actual illness. Feed tube inserted etc.

Day 21 wife gets in...stays at hospital every possible moment from then on reading to him, praying, playing music from church etc. DRs treat secondary infections from feeding tube etc, wife records his DR on audio refusing to feed my FIL anymore on about day 31...plays recording for hospital admin...gets new DRs. New Dr is a female Christian lady who is still friends with my wife today. She is sympathetic but guidelines are same. FIL still sedated and receiving no treatment other than fighting secondary infections.

Day 37 my FIL dies. Wrecks my wife of course and her entire family. Very codependent tightnit group. The only treatment he received in 37 days in hospital was paralytic/sedatives and a ventilator. Zero drugs were ever given to fight covid or help him recover. They took him in, locked us out for 21 days, knocked him out and said "hopefully his body will beat this on its own from this comatose state." It did not obviously.

My MIL got the bill and it is over 1 million dollars because they did not have medical insurance. She will never be able to repay that, especially without her husband of 40 years .

Such a heartbreaking story!! I can't even phathom the anger and frustration of having to go through something like this. I have a few friends with similar stories. It truly feels like the majority of the policies and guidelines recommended by the CDC have never been about saving lives.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Such a heartbreaking story!! I can't even phathom the anger and frustration of having to go through something like this. I have a few friends with similar stories. It truly feels like the majority of the policies and guidelines recommended by the CDC have never been about saving lives.

At one point, when Covenant was not giving any monoclonal antibody last year despite the clear benefit to high risk individuals, I told the COS that the only explanation I could come up with is that they were actually trying to kill people.

 

[hog88]

Well that’s exactly what you are for. Businesses becoming the enforcement arm of the government. When it goes against life liberty and the pursuit of happiness for an individual I hope it buries you.

Are you illiterate or just stupid?

 

[VolinWayne]

At one point, when Covenant was not giving any monoclonal antibody last year despite the clear benefit to high risk individuals, I told the COS that the only explanation I could come up with is that they were actually trying to kill people.

And as crasy as it sounds it certainly doesn't help at all when there are high profile individuals in the WEF that openly discuss population control.

 

[Jxn Vol]

Are you illiterate or just stupid?

Neither. Try again

 

[hog88]

Neither. Try again

It’s something because you obviously can’t understand that I abhor the .gov forcing mandates on business and people but support the right of business to make employment policies as they see fit.