War in Ukraine

#51,901
#51,901
DonjoVol said:
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Chance for Peace speech - Wikipedia

Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter with a half-million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people. . . . This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.
 
#51,903
#51,903
MG1968 said:
As you’ve pointed out, ad nauseum, Russia is not the Soviet Union, thus someone is getting rich at someone’s expense.
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Possibly... matter of fact very likely. So what? The point is that it is quite obvious and can't be disputed that the US MIC is far more bloated and corrupt than any other country's military industry.
 
#51,905
#51,905
Rasputin_Vol said:
These two paragraphs pretty much nail down the main catalyst for this war in Ukraine. The US and the MIC see this as an opportunity to peddle more arms.
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So I guess that means Pootin is the top salesman for the West in this whole fiasco since the “special military operation” is completely of his design and initiation Moe?
 
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#51,906
#51,906
Rasputin_Vol said:
I would think their MIC is devoted to making weapons of war, not enriching executives and shareholders.
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Apparently they really suck at it then since it’s been getting blown up as fast as it gets in theater Moe. They’re having to roll back to when they knew how to make equipment and bust out the T-62’s
 
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#51,907
#51,907
Rasputin_Vol said:
Possibly... matter of fact very likely. So what? The point is that it is quite obvious and can't be disputed that the US MIC is far more bloated and corrupt than any other country's military industry.
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Hang on Moe. Just three posts back you were claiming the Sovie… er Russian MIC was all about making weapons of war. FFS can’t you stick on message for more than a few minutes?
Rasputin_Vol said:
I would think their MIC is devoted to making weapons of war, not enriching executives and shareholders.
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#51,908
#51,908
Rasputin_Vol said:
Possibly... matter of fact very likely. So what? The point is that it is quite obvious and can't be disputed that the US MIC is far more bloated and corrupt than any other country's military industry.
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Here’s another question or two for you Moe since you’re all informed on the DoD procurement process.

Are contractors free to charge whatever price they want for their goods and services or are instead the delivered products clamped at a maximum profit margin with the requirement that the contractor open all the books to the Defense Contracts Auditing Agency for validation that there is no price gouging?

Is the government allowed to choose whatever supplier they desire or are they required by law to competitively bid each and every production contract and required to choose the best cost value choice?
 
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#51,910
#51,910
Rasputin_Vol said:
Kherson Kherson Kherson
MH-17
"f*** the EU.."
Kerch Bridge
Article 5
85k Russians dead
Stealing chips from washing machines/refrigerators/televisions
Institute for the Study of War
"Ruble will be rubble"
Million Man Ukrainian army
McDonalds/IKEA/Coca Cola/H&M/Louis Vuitton
Long lines at ATMs
Eggs
Russia running out of missiles/drones
Russia can't fight in winter/frostbite
Polish Mig-29s
Javelina
Azovstal "evacuation"
Stingers
No fly zones
40 mile caravan outside of Kyiv
Switchblade drones
Ghost of Kiev
Obese General
Kremlin Coup
Blood Cancer
Parkinsons
HIMARS
A-10 Warthogs
Abrams tanks
I saw it on the evening news
It must be true if it's on Twitter
40 Billion will bring Russia to its knees
Snake Island
Meat grinder
Game changers
Ukrainian Nazis are no big deal
Lukashenko's breath mints
Tooth Fairy
Soviet Union still exists
Trailer Park of the world
Pootin
Pootin Stooges
Larry Moe Curly
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I love how you include HIMARS, Switchblades, and 85k dead. All things true and currently rocking your countrymen's faces while they sleep and cower in their hastily dug fox holes/graves.

Also, thanks for including my "Trailer park of the world" talking point that I created as it shows I've gotten to you. It must burn your ass to have Westerners who have been to Russia speak the truth of that sh!thole.

And to haunt your nightmares paid Russia trollsky's..I present to you HIMARS:
q28f1xrkkj2a1.jpg
 
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#51,911
#51,911
NorthDallas40 said:
Yep. Clearly the West gave your Commie buddies way more credit than they were due, at least in the current era. It’s been great watching Russia show the world what an incompetent paper tiger they are right Curly? 😂

Edit to bold that current era in my reply. While they clearly aren’t a threat to most developed countries in a conventional war for some reason Finland and Sweden still want to join the party 🤣🤣🤣🤣
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Somebody needs to kick Turkey's butt up around their ears and get Finland and Sweden in NATO before they get tired of the debacle and decide it's not worth the effort.
 
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#51,912
#51,912
DonjoVol said:
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So who is determining specifications for weapons systems ... and why ... and based on what rationale? The AF, for example, is still trying to build a flying Swiss Army knife in spite of the fact that virtually every preceding multipurpose plane has been less than advertised. When they do manage to get something like a real air superiority fighter (F-16), somebody turns it into a bomber. When has the military ever put out specs and didn't keep changing them during development? It seems a lot less a military/industrial alliance than the wrong people involved in defining needs and development. Imagine trying to keep F-35s flying from remote airfields at the end of a long, tenuous logistics chain ... the definition of insanity.
 
#51,913
#51,913
Rasputin_Vol said:
Chance for Peace speech - Wikipedia

Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter with a half-million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people. . . . This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.
Click to expand...

Socialism is not our job nor our philosophy. The defense industry likely does more to provide jobs than a lot of other sectors. Other than military hardware, what do we still build in this country? We assemble cars, build some commercial aircraft, and we still apparently build some appliances ... and car mats.
 
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#51,914
#51,914
AM64 said:
Somebody needs to kick Turkey's butt up around their ears and get Finland and Sweden in NATO before they get tired of the debacle and decide it's not worth the effort.
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Turkey is just flexing while they can with whatever perceived leverage thru have. Since Pootin has his hands full with Ukraine at the moment I’d guess there is no imminent danger to either country. Hungary has already indicated they will consent. Erdogan is trying to act like BMOC and flex while he can.
 
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#51,915
#51,915
AM64 said:
Socialism is not our job nor our philosophy. The defense industry likely does more to provide jobs than a lot of other sectors. Other than military hardware, what do we still build in this country? We assemble cars, build some commercial aircraft, and we still apparently build some appliances ... and car mats.
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Lol. So you took that one sentence out of that speech and went on a small rant about what you think is "socialism".

Socialism is what Hitler advocated for and likely what the current neo Nazi Bandera followers want in Ukraine.
 
#51,916
#51,916
AM64 said:
Socialism is not our job nor our philosophy.
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And interventionalist military was also not our job nor our philosophy.

Says a lot that you would focus on that one sentence and twist it into a opportunity to get on your soap box and virtue signal. I have no doubt that Eisenhower's intention was to promote socialism.
 
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#51,917
#51,917
Rasputin_Vol said:
And interventionalist military was also not our job nor our philosophy.

Says a lot that you would focus on that one sentence and twist it into an opportunity to get on your soap box and virtue signal. I have no doubt that Eisenhower's intention was to promote socialism.
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We signed a commitment to intervene if Ukraine was attacked Moe. They were indeed attacked… by one of the other signatories. Guess which one? Womp womp 🤡
 
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#51,918
#51,918
AM64 said:
So who is determining specifications for weapons systems ... and why ... and based on what rationale? The AF, for example, is still trying to build a flying Swiss Army knife in spite of the fact that virtually every preceding multipurpose plane has been less than advertised. When they do manage to get something like a real air superiority fighter (F-16), somebody turns it into a bomber. When has the military ever put out specs and didn't keep changing them during development? It seems a lot less a military/industrial alliance than the wrong people involved in defining needs and development. Imagine trying to keep F-35s flying from remote airfields at the end of a long, tenuous logistics chain ... the definition of insanity.
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From what I have been able to understand, the MIC develops their weapons systems based on profit margins and marketing rather than specific mission needs in the field. In your effort to bite our heads off and attack us for pointing out the corruption of the MIC, you should be standing with us in demanding a change in how we do things. Seems like you have a perfectly good understanding of what the problems are.
 
#51,919
#51,919
Rasputin_Vol said:
From what I have been able to understand, the MIC develops their weapons systems based on profit margins and marketing rather than specific mission needs in the field. In your effort to bite our heads off and attack us for pointing out the corruption of the MIC, you should be standing with us in demanding a change in how we do things. Seems like you have a perfectly good understanding of what the problems are.
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Your understanding is crap. The contractor community develops products based on the requirements defined in the formal RFP, request for proposal, package. The government is not allowed to attempt to procure a product or system without a written defined need.

The contractor community has the option to invest their own internal money into a product or use their IR&D money which is a standard percentage of contract money returned to contractors to develop products. There are rules on IR&D money as it is government sourced however. However any front end money spent is focused on a defined need document generated by the PMO, program management office, in the government.

You have zero damn idea how the process works and continue to make idiotic screeching claims of obvious corruption 🤡
 
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#51,920
#51,920
Rasputin_Vol said:
And interventionalist military was also not our job nor our philosophy.

Says a lot that you would focus on that one sentence and twist it into a opportunity to get on your soap box and virtue signal. I have no doubt that Eisenhower's intention was to promote socialism.
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I guess the founding fathers were promoting socialism as well when they wrote the preamble to the constitution.
 
#51,922
#51,922
NorthDallas40 said:
Another stupid hot take on a very long and growing list of idiotic stupid hot takes Curly 🤡
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It was a joke Proctor. But from the idiocy I've seen posted from you and your crowd, it wouldn't surprise me to see you all highlight a couple of phrases from the preamble and claim they were promoting socialism.
 
#51,923
#51,923
DonjoVol said:
It was a joke Proctor. But from the idiocy I've seen posted from you and your crowd, it wouldn't surprise me to see you all highlight a couple of phrases from the preamble and claim they were promoting socialism.
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No it was an idiotic hot take that you’re now trying to aw shucks pass off as a joke. And even tried once again to do so in your idiotic last sentence.
 
#51,925
#51,925
DonjoVol said:
It was a joke you idiot. Perhaps you should learn to have a life outside Volnation.
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Oh I’ve got plenty of life outside VolNation. But I’ve still got plenty of time left over to mock your idiotic hot takes and illogical conclusions drawn from otherwise fairly straight forward points made by other coherent posters.
 
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