War in Ukraine

#64,678
#64,678
Orangeburst said:
I am sure the CCP took notice.
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Not necessarily. The Kinzhal isn’t really a hypersonic missile as what is usually characterized as such today. It has no real maneuver capability. It’s an air launched version of the Iskander I believe. They are just ballistic missiles which have been able to reach hypersonic speeds for a very long time. (ETA: the Kinzhal is purported to be VERY fast, MACH 10. That is faster than the MACH 6-7 published speed of the Iskander) The bald dwarf just ran his mouth and overhyped the weapon and its capability. Think of this weapon as a much newer more capable version of a SCUD 🤷‍♂️
 
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#64,680
#64,680
NorthDallas40 said:
Not necessarily. The Kinzhal isn’t really a hypersonic missile as what is usually characterized as such today. It has no real maneuver capability. It’s an air launched version of the Iskander I believe. They are just ballistic missiles which have been able to reach hypersonic speeds for a very long time. (ETA: the Kinzhal is purported to be VERY fast, MACH 10. That is faster than the MACH 6-7 published speed of the Iskander) The bald dwarf just ran his mouth and overhyped the weapon and its capability. Think of this weapon as a much newer more capable version of a SCUD 🤷‍♂️
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Lack of maneuverability would seem to be the weakness in the hypersonic concept. As velocity increases, you're going to need more control surface to turn the thing and that means drag - seems like some contradictory forces at work. Pilots over N Vietnam were shot down by SAMs, but more often they lured the SAM into an intercept and then turned more quickly than the SAM could turn - a lot of times they did run out of speed and airspace to defeat the third or fourth SAM that targeted them. Hypersonic missiles seem to be defeatable given enough warning, but the speed cuts down on warning time. Lack of maneuverability of a hypersonic missile does seem to play into a Patriot's favor somewhat - assuming the Patriot is along the hypersonic missile's flight path and the lock comes early enough.
 
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#64,682
#64,682
AM64 said:
Lack of maneuverability would seem to be the weakness in the hypersonic concept. As velocity increases, you're going to need more control surface to turn the thing and that means drag - seems like some contradictory forces at work. Pilots over N Vietnam were shot down by SAMs, but more often they lured the SAM into an intercept and then turned more quickly than the SAM could turn - a lot of times they did run out of speed and airspace to defeat the third or fourth SAM that targeted them. Hypersonic missiles seem to be defeatable given enough warning, but the speed cuts down on warning time. Lack of maneuverability of a hypersonic missile does seem to play into a Patriot's favor somewhat - assuming the Patriot is along the hypersonic missile's flight path and the lock comes early enough.
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So I’m just pointing out the Achilles heel of this particular claimed hypersonic missile. China’s DF-ZF hypersonic glide vehicle is another whole different ballpark. The Kinzhal largely moves in a predictable path with very minor preprogrammed moves so as to disguise its impact point from what I understand. That’s very different from the HGV maneuvering to avoid intercept.

Putin Lied When He Called Russia’s Kinzhal Missiles ‘Hypersonic.’ We Unraveled the Truth
 
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#64,684
#64,684
NorthDallas40 said:
So I’m just pointing out the Achilles heel of this particular claimed hypersonic missile. China’s DF-ZF hypersonic glide vehicle is another whole different ballpark. The Kinzhal largely moves in a predictable path with very minor preprogrammed moves so as to disguise its impact point from what I understand. That’s very different from the HGV maneuvering to avoid intercept.

Putin Lied When He Called Russia’s Kinzhal Missiles ‘Hypersonic.’ We Unraveled the Truth
Click to expand...

I have to admit my thinking was a bit flawed in that I was considering things like hypersonic air to air missiles, air to ground, or air defense missiles as more point to point and not ballistic type trajectories ... with the thought process impeded by a cat who thinks it's more important for her to see my screen than me. So I was thinking really of ultra-fast air to air and SAM type missiles with conventional guidance systems and was excluding ballistic missiles from my thinking, and just boiled it down to turning things gets more complicated when they go faster.
 
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#64,689
#64,689
Storm Shadow strike hits Russian general(s?).

Apparently England warned Putin months ago that if he didn't withdraw from Ukraine, they'd be giving Ukraine some longer ranged missiles to help extricate the Russians. Now Ukraine has Storm Shadow missiles and they're using them to great effect.







Apparently, we have also provided the Ukrainians with cheap dummy missiles designed to suck up all the AA near a target thereby allowing the real missile (in this case 3 Storm Shadows) to arrive without interception.



Here's a pretty cool video on how all this works together...

MALD Operational Scenario & Capabilities

Russia, obviously, may be incapable of stopping the Storm Shadow cruise missiles.

Hitting C&C nodes is likely part of the shaping operations UKR in advance of their counteroffensive.

All in all, I think Russia is about to learn how its 20th century army will fare against 21st century technology.
 
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#64,695
#64,695
Are those copters going down in flames or just mechanically failing? While their systems are less sophisticated I can't imagine the quality of Russian maintenance. You know it has to seriously suck and that's not taking into account potential damage from AAA defenses.

But I was also thinking how effective it would be to mess with their fueling systems and introduce pollutants. That's when you see planes falling from the air for no apparent reason.
 
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#64,699
#64,699
For those better versed in military capabilities.

Couple it be possible to interfere with Anti Aircraft missile systems and confuse them into targeting friendlies? Could that explain what's happening?
 
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