War in Ukraine

[AM64]

only gonna get worse. this war isn't a tenth of the terrors that multiple governments will have at their disposal in the next 10-20 years

This war is a blessing in disguise IF we are actually paying attention. The football equivalent would be the year everybody first faces an offense like Tennessee is putting on the field or when the Wishbone was first used - it's catchup for everybody else. The good thing for us is that somebody else is fighting it and we are seeing how a lot of our weaponry does and doesn't work. We are also getting schooled on some cheap new innovations that make our stuff too expensive to use, and we're getting a look at how multimillion dollar tanks aren't working ... this isn't the battleground where Blitzkrieg worked ... where tanks were almost invincible.

Air superiority that would allow the use of planes like the A-10 and attack helicopters might change things, but there would have to be a lot of preparation for that, and it would mean expanding the war into Russia. That's another lesson perhaps in futility. How do you gain air superiority against effective air defenses unless you are willing to expand the war into a country threatening the use of nuclear weapons. We laugh at the Russians for their crude moves, but their use of minefields and covering artillery and threat of nuclear attack are both very successful plays.

 

[Burhead]

I'd be interested what the cheerleaders in this thread have to say about this?

I turned it off after he said Russian soldiers have treated Ukrainian POWs fairly and humanly that is a lie. Not worth listening to any garbage he spits out after that. There is ample evidence that Ukrainian POWs have been tortured and executed by Russian forces from the very start.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

As long as "losing badly" means refusing to roll over and die; then, yes, Ukraine is losing badly. Still fighting and regaining lost territory two years into a three day special operation is absolutely the definition of "losing badly" or even better "refusing to lose".

They are not going to change the outcome. They are only delaying the inevitable and losing more men in the process.

Your definition of losing is ridiculous when they are losing tens hundreds of thousands KIA and wounded and lost a significant number that moved to Poland, Germany, UK etc.

The US has destroyed yet another country and started a refugee crisis (Ukraine, Afghanistan, Syria, Libya)

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

This war is a blessing in disguise IF we are actually paying attention. The football equivalent would be the year everybody first faces an offense like Tennessee is putting on the field or when the Wishbone was first used - it's catchup for everybody else. The good thing for us is that somebody else is fighting it and we are seeing how a lot of our weaponry does and doesn't work. We are also getting schooled on some cheap new innovations that make our stuff too expensive to use, and we're getting a look at how multimillion dollar tanks aren't working ... this isn't the battleground where Blitzkrieg worked ... where tanks were almost invincible.

Air superiority that would allow the use of planes like the A-10 and attack helicopters might change things, but there would have to be a lot of preparation for that, and it would mean expanding the war into Russia. That's another lesson perhaps in futility. How do you gain air superiority against effective air defenses unless you are willing to expand the war into a country threatening the use of nuclear weapons. We laugh at the Russians for their crude moves, but their use of minefields and covering artillery and threat of nuclear attack are both very successful plays.

What good is all of this alleged intel going to do if we don't have the industrial base to support it? You can't just s#!t out machinists, technicians STEM Majors and factory floors.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

The good thing for us is that somebody else is fighting it and we are seeing how a lot of our weaponry does and doesn't work.

Also, notice that you willing acknowledge that we are using the Ukrainians as our crash test dummies.

 

[NorthDallas40]

I see the bald dwarf’s evening shift has clocked in.

 

[clarksvol00]

I think @Rasputin_Vol has most of us on ignore at this point. He couldn't possibly stand up to the sheer numbers of beat downs he'd subject himself to, so he's culled the field to manage his workload.

I'm in the club.

 

[tnmarktx]

I turned it off after he said Russian soldiers have treated Ukrainian POWs fairly and humanly that is a lie. Not worth listening to any garbage he spits out after that. There is ample evidence that Ukrainian POWs have been tortured and executed by Russian forces from the very start.

I'm more interested in the 400,000 Ukrainian troops killed. Another British military official had claimed 350,000 and that was months ago. Yet most on here proclaim the Ukraine is winning...

 

[lawgator1]

They are not going to change the outcome. They are only delaying the inevitable and losing more men in the process.

Your definition of losing is ridiculous when they are losing tens hundreds of thousands KIA and wounded and lost a significant number that moved to Poland, Germany, UK etc.

The US has destroyed yet another country and started a refugee crisis (Ukraine, Afghanistan, Syria, Libya)

Wait, the UNITED STATES has destroyed Ukraine? Sorry but that's delusional. Putin is trying. He made succeed, though at a cost hundreds of times higher than he planned.

Especially when one factors into the equation a larger and more resolved NATO.

 

[tnmarktx]

 

[Velo Vol]

Also, notice that you willing acknowledge that we are using the Ukrainians as our crash test dummies.

In the sense that we saw another vehicle plowing into the Ukraine car, and we gave it some airbags, and we're seeing how well they work.

 

[NorthDallas40]

I'm more interested in the 400,000 Ukrainian troops killed. Another British military official had claimed 350,000 and that was months ago. Yet most on here proclaim the Ukraine is winning...

Well Russia invaded. They couldn’t reach the capital. And they’ve stalled out and been giving up ground ever since. Ukraine still exists as a sovereign nation 18 months into a war everyone thought would be over in a week. That looks a lot like winning right now to me.

 

[Burhead]

I'm more interested in the 400,000 Ukrainian troops killed. Another British military official had claimed 350,000 and that was months ago. Yet most on here proclaim the Ukraine is winning...

Please quote that British military official.

 

[tnmarktx]

Well Russia invaded. They couldn’t reach the capital. And they’ve stalled out and been giving up ground ever since. Ukraine still exists as a sovereign nation 18 months into a war everyone thought would be over in a week. That looks a lot like winning right now to me.

Almost double the casualties seems like winning to you? Do you think Ukraine has an infinite number of troops. Last time I heard they had up to a million and already half are gone. In 18 months, when they're all gone, will they still be winning?

 

[NorthDallas40]

Almost double the casualties seems like winning to you? Do you think Ukraine has an infinite number of troops. Last time I heard they had up to a million and already half are gone. In 18 months, when they're all gone, will they still be winning?

Almost double the casualties? You get that from Macgregor did ya? It’s their fight and their country to defend. So it’s their choice. And yeah they’ve taken back 50% of what they lost so you bet it looks like they’re winning right now. That would appear to be the real metric that matters.

 

[NorthDallas40]

LMAO

Russians sinking ferries to “drone proof” Kerch bridge

https://www.marinelog.com/news/russ...s-sinking-ferries-to-drone-proof-kerch-bridge

 

[Velo Vol]

Another stooge has entered the chat.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

The Case for American-Led Peace in Ukraine

A Russian victory on these terms is a significant setback for the United States. The reputational damage to American competence and the NATO alliance would be colossal, as the best of NATO hardware and training has already gone into the Ukrainian military, and Russia would be able to make the claim that it stood alone against the West—and won. The Sino-Russian relationship would also strengthen. Finally, the cheap and effective weapons Russia uses to win the war, such as the Lancet, will flow to every regime opposed to American leadership around the world.

Therefore, it is imperative that the idea of a peace settlement amenable to all parties in the conflict—including Russia—takes hold and is seriously pursued in Washington. Influential American figures are already engaged in Track 1.5 diplomacy with their counterparts in Russia. These efforts should be encouraged, expanded, and form the basis for sustained engagement in peace negotiations. Only then will the United States be able to focus entirely on containing China, which is of paramount importance to American security and prosperity.

 

[MontyPython]

I'm more interested in the 400,000 Ukrainian troops killed. Another British military official had claimed 350,000 and that was months ago. Yet most on here proclaim the Ukraine is winning...

SMH. Putting your BS statistics aside... help me understand. It seems you're suggesting that:

"The side with the most casualties loses a war"

Do us all a favor and update the Wiki WWII page. For some reason it says Russia won, not Germany.

For that matter, kindly update the Vietnam War page, as well. For some reason it says Vietnam won, not the US.

For that matter, kindly update the Afghanistan War page, as well. For some reason it says the Taliban won, not the US.

Etc.

Etc.

Etc.

 

[evillawyer]

Presumably this is NOT the one from the other day where there was visual confirmation

 

[MontyPython]

The best of NATO hardware has already gone into the Ukrainian military

 

[MontyPython]

Oh, come on Lavrov!

 

[clarksvol00]

Thought problem for the day... If you have ignored everyone else in the thread, why do you continue to post in thread?

 

[Septic]

Thought problem for the day... If you have ignored everyone else in the thread, why do you continue to post in thread?

The fascinating thing about @Rasputin_Vol is that not only does he duck tough questions, it's that he also lives outside of reality and facts.

So he's got that going for him, which is nice.

 

[evillawyer]

View attachment 571679

Dear Lord, where does he get this trash? We've basically provided antiquated surplus. No modern fighter jets, no modern bombers, no long-range missiles, no modern drones.