War in Ukraine

[AM64]

I'm sure we all are smart enough to realize that maximization of short term profits at all costs is harmful in the long run. The issue is with creating and supporting a system where that very thing is encouraged and rewarded.

Moderation is the key word. Our business community sometimes turns cannibalistic. Stewardship should be the first thought of a CEO if there is to be a future; otherwise, it's like dumping piranha into a closed lake.

 

[norrislakevol]

Automation is great to the extent that it doesn't put people out of work because machines don't buy manufactured goods and services. I think we often put too much emphasis into the production side and neglect the impact of the employed consumer. If the industrial revolution taught us anything it that it's all a symbiotic relationship, and without the paid worker there is no consumer for the goods.

Absolutely, but one thing I have learned is that automation is not perfect. I can write the most beautiful PLC program you could think of for a machine, and somehow, someway someone or something will screw it up....meaning human intervention will be needed. The whole dream of a lights out factory is just that...a dream. What we can do though is create better paying jobs and be able to spit out more volume per paid person which would mean China is needed less.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Good post, and you're right. In the end, China will collapse and drag us down....at least temporarily with it. Short sighted ventures will never be rewarded long term.

I'm not sure where you and AM think the people are going to come from to onshore all this work. We are over a decade away from even sniffing being able to pull that kind of work back. Believe me, we look to hire skilled people every single day, they aren't there.

 

[82_VOL_83]

On one hand I agree, but on the other think of the demographics (like Portland, San Francisco, and others) that people in congress represent - and unfortunately some of those places come with quantity and definitely not quality. And, yes, I know you are right; but, damn, this country is a mess right now.

This is exactly right. One feeds the other.

 

[luthervol]

Moderation is the key word. Our business community sometimes turns cannibalistic. Stewardship should be the first thought of a CEO if there is to be a future; otherwise, it's like dumping piranha into a closed lake.

I agree it should be, but it's not.....because the system is not set up that way. The focus is almost entirely on the quarterly report.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Lol I was just joking about the stupid thing man. I don't think you're stupid, just throwing a little mud back at you is all.

Yes, agree 100 percent on the bolded. We actually aren't that far off in our views. Many people will have egg on their face when this all goes BOOM. It is BOTH sides that are to blame in the end. Both could have used long term thinking instead of short term gratification.

One thing that can fix at least some of this: More and better automation. I happen to be in that business as a controls engineer.

It takes skilled people to run that automation and capital to purchase it. Automation doesn’t bring jobs back but it does make up somewhat for lack of skilled workers. And yes, we are basically saying the same thing, I just think you can't change things until the playing field is leveled somewhat. Build the infrastructure to attract CEOs and stop taxing corps into oblivion and the work and capital will be there.

 

[AM64]

I'm not sure where you and AM think the people are going to come from to onshore all this work. We are over a decade away from even sniffing being able to pull that kind of work back. Belive me, we look to hire skilled people every single day, they aren't there.

In the 90s I was out of a job as an engineer and just one of many engineers who couldn't find another job. Employers were dumping some engineers in their 30s to avoid age discrimination issues. Fortunately I found other work which turned out to be more lucrative, but that went away, too. Fortunately I was in a position to retire, which I did, and we live well within our means. It's a two part issue and business played a big role; when demand came back I wasn't interested - if my skills still apply. I'm convinced we have a labor market that industry squandered, and people figured out ways to survive, sometimes with government safety nets. I see the hard times for employers to an extent like someone having had a skill or talent and neglecting it, and it's no longer available. Many of those unmotivated people you talk about may well have been good employees at one time. It's not just people either; you can't just reopen plants that businesses closed.

 

[Burhead]

The years of the US/NATO training Ukraine’s SF guys looks worth the investment. Along with the regular troops too.

 

[Burhead]

Ukraine may have just retaken Hostomel from the VDV.

 

[82_VOL_83]

And the reset will come. It will hurt everyone that isn't super rich, and even some of those will fall. This won't just just hurt us and China, it will crush the entire globe. There is no money left for bailouts anymore. No money left for rewarding failure and bad decisions.

You say that but as AM pointed out, currency is no longer tied to anything so there is plenty to go around. Take a look at what has happened to small business and education over the last two years. I have two small town HS teachers in my family. The education system for a majority of the country is gone. It is not recoverable. There is no coming back without radical change and when you look at that clown show in DC, ask yourself if you really think that is going to happen.

 

[norrislakevol]

It takes skilled people to run that automation and capital to purchase it. Automation doesn’t bring jobs back but it does make up somewhat for lack of skilled workers. And yes, we are basically saying the same thing, I just think you can't change things until the playing field is leveled somewhat. Build the infrastructure to attract CEOs and stop taxing corps into oblivion and the work and capital will be there.

Well yes....sort of. I spend a lot of time thinking up ways for lower skilled employees to run that automation without breaking things. It does help. Some automation is cheaper than a lot of people think. It really depends on how far you want to go with it.

Yup!! We are already one of the highest corporate taxed countries in the developed world.

 

[norrislakevol]

You say that but as AM pointed out, currency is no longer tied to anything so there is plenty to go around. Take a look at what has happened to small business and education over the last two years. I have two small town HS teachers in my family. The education system for a majority of the country is gone. It is not recoverable. There is no coming back without radical change and when you look at that clown show in DC, ask yourself if you really think that is going to happen.

No it won't happen until catastrophe happens. I sure as hell hope I am wrong though.

 

[AM64]

It takes skilled people to run that automation and capital to purchase it. Automation doesn’t bring jobs back but it does make up somewhat for lack of skilled workers. And yes, we are basically saying the same thing, I just think you can't change things until the playing field is leveled somewhat. Build the infrastructure to attract CEOs and stop taxing corps into oblivion and the work and capital will be there.

That's the quandary - do you have automation and fewer more technical jobs that pay better or do you accept the need for more labor intensive minimum wage jobs? People have to have income to consume. You can tax and redistribute and have the unmotivated class of people you mentioned, or have more workers across the board. Our problem now is that we displaced workers and there is little motivation for many to work if they can get by without. Seems like that was lack of stewardship both on the part of industry and government, and it put us in a bad spot.

 

[norrislakevol]

Ukraine may have just retaken Hostomel from the VDV.

The question is, how much blood is Putin willing to spill of his own people? To what end now?

 

[82_VOL_83]

Absolutely, but one thing I have learned is that automation is not perfect. I can write the most beautiful PLC program you could think of for a machine, and somehow, someway someone or something will screw it up....meaning human intervention will be needed. The whole dream of a lights out factory is just that...a dream. What we can do though is create better paying jobs and be able to spit out more volume per paid person which would mean China is needed less.

First half is dead on, second half is there already however, there are no employees to hire. I live this **** every single day.

 

[Burhead]

The question is, how much blood is Putin willing to spill of his own people? To what end now?

I don’t know but the Russian airborne must be an endangered species at this point.

 

[volfanhill]

Ukraine’s NATO Membership 'Will Not Take Place': German Chancellor | ZeroHedge

“I also made it clear in Moscow and in my visit that this option [Ukraine’s membership of NATO] is not on the table and will not take place,” he said during an interview with German public broadcaster ZDF.

“I said publicly that we all know that Ukraine’s NATO membership is not on the alliance’s agenda today,” he added. “That was understood by the American president, that [was] also understood by the French president.”

Scholz said he shares Russian President Vladimir Putin’s security concern and clarified to Putin that Ukraine will not be allowed to join NATO.

“The Russians were worried about the control issue of their security. [Putin was worried] that NATO has a military setup and rockets in Ukraine targeting Russian territory. That is why we tried to make it clear that this will not occur,” he elaborated.

Why are you so scared of an independent nation deciding who they should align with? What lesson does that tell you about Russia?

 

[82_VOL_83]

I don’t know but the Russian airborne must be an endangered species at this point.

I don't believe that we have seen the A Team yet.

 

[Burhead]

I don't believe that we have seen the A Team yet.

Perhaps but they’ve committed the VDV and 4th Guards Tank to the action which are tip of the spear formations along with SSO units. I could be wrong but I don’t think the 2nd Guards Motor Rifles have been deployed which is a sister unit of the 4th Guards.

 

[Burhead]

The naval task force that was preparing to assault Odessa is returning to port after missing the weather window. Weather won’t permit another attempt until midweek.

 

[CagleMtnVol]

The naval task force that was preparing to assault Odessa is returning to port after missing the weather window. Weather won’t permit another attempt until midweek.

They didn't have a James Stagg!

 

[Paper_Towel]

The naval task force that was preparing to assault Odessa is returning to port after missing the weather window. Weather won’t permit another attempt until midweek.

 

[Burhead]

Russia declaring a cease fire around Mariupol at 10am Moscow time to allow civilians to leave.

 

[Weezer]

Why are you so scared of an independent nation deciding who they should align with? What lesson does that tell you about Russia?

I keep going back and forth between whether his head is up his ass or Putin's ass.

 

[Paper_Towel]