Wars, genocide, reparations, etc (split from recruiting forum)

[drvenner]

A poll by the Washington Post in 2016 reported that 90% of Native Americans didn't find the name Redskins offensive. Granted that was before our society was told to look for ways to be offended. Are both polls accurate? It's hard to know the true numbers when you poll less than 0.001% of a specific demographic.

I did read about that. I am of the opinion that a significant portion find it offensive. Is it 50%? Don't know. I believe it's much higher than 10. There were also letters to the Washington owners and to the NFL commissioner. I respect your opinion but I honestly look at that term and can't see why it wouldn't be offensive.

 

[drvenner]

Hmmmm so you have polled the vast majority of Native Americans and asked them personally? Cool story bro.

No, but I can read and think introspectively. What connotation do you think the term has for native Americans?

 

[volbeast33]

Yeah...that was overboard...sorry. You are definitely not a nobody.

The constant trashing of our country, and the incessant bitching about how much more money the men's sports make than them, when female sports are not profitable, or are barely profitable in most cases, by a lot of these female athletes has poisoned me to a degree, and that is truly not fair to the good ones.

This world we live in now just...it really gets to me, that is not an excuse..just the truth. I feel like the world we live in hates me, and I hate it back.

I apologize to you and the other common sense ladies of VN for having offended you...I love you guys, but the other ones (the w*** guys and gals, or whatever they identify as today) can kiss my crusty old A double S.

 

[Jackcrevol]

George was very prescient.

his political views, definitely were.

 

[creekdipper]

And gave the biggest business in America unmatched marketing

So Ike was bought off by Sam Walton?

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

I'll just leave this here ....

 

[EasternVol]

So the government thought ok if we are going to start another unnecessary war that kills our best for greedy reasons we need to step up the faith based propaganda...

And it worked...till 1975.

It worked after 1975 too.
It's interesting how so many in Europe turned away from religion post WWII but we didn't.

 

[Volsdeep4]

Well said. There is a reason native Americans were driven against their will to Oklahoma as it is a god forsaken place.

Every decent human in their heart of hearts has always known "redskins" was derogatory and ugly. Unfortunately Natives have such a small voice for change.

Reservation Dogs is an amazing show by the way everyone should watch it. It's just good.

You say this as the man in your picture took more land from native Americans than anyone.

 

[bignewt]

You say this as the man in your picture took more land from native Americans than anyone.

cool story

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

You say this as the man in your picture took more land from native Americans than anyone.

It was a totally different world...ignorant people have a hard time understanding that.

 

[SSVol]

It was a totally different world...ignorant people have a hard time understanding that.

I absolutely hate how society evaluates historical figures against today's standard of right and wrong. Bad is bad and good is good, and we should call it what it is, but context absolutely matters.

 

[Big Orange#1]

I absolutely hate how society evaluates historical figures against today's standard of right and wrong. Bad is bad and good is good, and we should call it what it is, but context absolutely matters.

Yeah it was conquered land, like all land has been throughout history.

 

[Big Orange#1]

I absolutely hate how society evaluates historical figures against today's standard of right and wrong. Bad is bad and good is good, and we should call it what it is, but context absolutely matters.

Cause it makes them feel good that they can judge everyone in the past from a modern ethical framework.

 

[Volsdeep4]

It was a totally different world...ignorant people have a hard time understanding that.

I understand that it was different times. I get it. I’m not ignorant to the fact of that was common practice. Pretty much every nationality, color and religion has at one time been subject to slavery or turmoil.
I just found it funny dude was talking about redskins being derogatory and this and that. At the same time had Roosevelt as his avi.

 

[bignewt]

I understand that it was different times. I get it. I’m not ignorant to the fact of that was common practice. Pretty much every nationality, color and religion has at one time been subject to slavery or turmoil.
I just found it funny dude was talking about redskins being derogatory and this and that. At the same time had Roosevelt as his avi.

Dude? Or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

As for ole Teddy...I can respect and honor his feats and ideals while also saying Redskins is an ignorant moniker. As has been mentioned our modern lens allows a clarity they did not have in the 19th century.

 

[UTProf]

his political views, definitely were.

Unfortunately, I don't think he was prescient at all but by that I mean I don't think he saw our decline. I think he saw the way things were and had been since we came into existence and the way they continue to be. It's been that way since time immemorial. There was never a golden era we fell from and the only golden time we'll get is one we make for ourselves if we ever decide to get off our rears and change things but the past few centuries say that's highly unlikely to ever happen.

 

[Devo182]

Yeah it was conquered land, like all land has been throughout history.

I mean, I get your general point, but did the Native Americans conquer the Americas (conquer = conquering other humans to get it)?

Or Africans in Africa? Or the Chinese or Indians? Maybe there was some degree, but surely there are natives to every land, as well. Natives didn't conquer. But many were conquered.

We do have to accept it as historical fact in vast parts of the world. Doesn't mean it was ever ethical. The whole manifest destiny crap was nothing short of nazi murderism.

 

[SugarCC]

Dude? Or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

As for ole Teddy...I can respect and honor his feats and ideals while also saying Redskins is an ignorant moniker. As has been mentioned our modern lens allows a clarity they did not have in the 19th century.

His dudeness, or...duder.

 

[OrangeBlood4life]

I mean, I get your general point, but did the Native Americans conquer the Americas (conquer = conquering other humans to get it)?

Or Africans in Africa? Or the Chinese or Indians? Maybe there was some degree, but surely there are natives to every land, as well. Natives didn't conquer. But many were conquered.

We do have to accept it as historical fact in vast parts of the world. Doesn't mean it was ever ethical. The whole manifest destiny crap was nothing short of nazi murderism.

Natives didnt conquer other natives?

 

[Devo182]

Natives didnt conquer other natives?

Not when originally getting there. This seems obvious.

Why I left in, "there was to some degree" there. Ofc they fought in due time. Just talking...the lands were originally not conquered lands.

Wouldn't that have to be true of all land, minus the original lands in Ethiopia? All lands were originally not conquered.

I was responding to, "ALL" lands were conquered. No they were not.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I understand that it was different times. I get it. I’m not ignorant to the fact of that was common practice. Pretty much every nationality, color and religion has at one time been subject to slavery or turmoil.
I just found it funny dude was talking about redskins being derogatory and this and that. At the same time had Roosevelt as his avi.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with having Teddy as his avi...I hate this f'n stupid .

TR was a remarkable president that did a lot of really great things for my country and for working people. Judging his morality by today's standards is saf.

Edit: Not calling you stupid...I just really hate this crap.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I absolutely hate how society evaluates historical figures against today's standard of right and wrong. Bad is bad and good is good, and we should call it what it is, but context absolutely matters.

I do too.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Yeah it was conquered land, like all land has been throughout history.

Like how ignorant people go on and on about the Black Hills being so "sacred" to the Sioux....the Sioux walloped and took the Black Hills from the Cheyenne that actually were from there in...wait for it....1776.

And no telling who the Cheyenne took them from or when. The Indian tribes were always trying to kill each other.

Almost nobody acknowledges these facts.

 

[Devo182]

Like how ignorant people go on and on about the Black Hills being so "sacred" to the Sioux....the Sioux walloped and took the Black Hills from the Cheyenne that actually were from there in...wait for it....1776.

And no telling who the Cheyenne took them from or when. The Indian tribes were always trying to kill each other.

Almost nobody acknowledges these facts.

I'd say it's acknowledged quite a bit. We're literally discussing the savage warrior stereotype here...there's literally no other stereotype of them than that of fighting...no?

But I agree the idea one tribe is home, here or there, in modern terms, is silly. We're talking people that were here first 13,000+ years ago. No doubt lands have changed hands many times...and the winners and losers morphed from one tribe to another type over those thousands of years. That's a vast amount of time.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Yeah it was conquered land, like all land has been throughout history.

I have a lot of Celtic (Manx) DNA....I suppose I am supposed to hate the Italians, the Norse, the Anglo-Saxon and every other peoples leaders going back to Cro-Magnon times that kicked my ancestors ass? I'm sure they probably did some kicking ass along the way too.