What are your thoughts on Marijuana legalization?

[Volunteer_Kirby]

Thought I'd revive this thread here.


Over 11% of inmates in the federal penitentiaries are merely there because they wanted to have some fun. What crime could this be? Possession, selling and trafficking Marijuana. Some may be fine with this happening, but I'm not, I've seen this :censored: up people's lives and personally I'm angry about how the situation is being dealt with. Recreation Marijuana use should be made as legal as alcohol.

A few more arguments about the legalization of Marijuana.

1 - In America right now, marijuana distribution and usage is one of the most often committed crimes. Huge amounts of funding go to anti-marijuana law enforcement. From a strictly financial standpoint, marijuana should be made legal because the government would save large amounts of money in law enforcement. This cash could then be spent on more dangerous drugs, rehabilitation programs, and education.

2 - If marijuana were legal, a tax could be placed on it. The market for marijuana is gigantic. Thus the United States government could collect even more money. This money could also be spent on more serious drugs, rehabilitation programs and education. You might argue that marijuana taxation is an unachievable aspiration because, if marijuana were legal, those who wanted it could grow it themselves. I would argue that people as a whole would be far to lazy to grow anything for themselves; the human race doesn't mind spending outrageous amounts of money for services and products they could produce themselves for free. A perfect example of this is the restaurant business. Food is 200% to 900% less expensive if you cook it yourself, and yet people still go out to dinner and lunch.

3 - If alcohol is legal, then marijuana should be legal for the following reason: People under the influence of alcohol can have a tendency to well.. you know the deal. People under the influence of marijuana have no detrimental tendencies produced solely from smoking Marijuana. A person high can still achieve what they do normally, that's not a big deal (to me) to most people if they understand. This is excluding beginner tokers. :happy:

4 - If cigarettes are legal, then marijuana should be legal because; a) Cigarettes are chemically addictive. Marijuana is not. b) Some people smoke up to forty cigarettes daily often causing terrible lung damage. While smoking marijuana can cause damage to the lungs, nobody ever smokes forty joints a day. Thus there are usually fewer lung problems associated with smoking weed.

5 - If cigarettes and alcohol are legal, marijuana should be legal because hundreds of thousands of people die each year solely from smoking cigarettes and drinking alcohol. Today, the total number of people who have died solely from smoking weed is a whopping 0. :question:

6 - Right now, marijuana is considered the number one "gateway drug" (which isn't true if you've done any research regarding Marijuana.) Among those 21 and over, alcohol is not considered a gateway to other more harmful drugs, because the most harmful other drugs (other than inhalants) are illegal; and drinking, for adults, is not. Thus if marijuana were made legal, it would cease to be a gateway into more harmful illegal substances. Right? If only Politicians would have the balls to step forward now and admit they have been wrong for so many years. :fool:

I'd rather not argue the real effects of cannabis, research is out there if you're interested. It's no where as bad as some of you may have been led to believe. I don't believe it's appropriate to use the threat of the law to provoke us and stop people from using it.

Now I'm not necessarily in favor of more people using weed, but I just don't see how taking money or liberty from those that do is helping.


EDIT: Ironically, my post count is (1)420 :rock:

 

[vader]

Testify, Kirby, testify.

 

[All Vol!]

Thought I'd revive this thread here.


Over 11% of inmates in the federal penitentiaries are merely there because they wanted to have some fun. What crime could this be? Possession, selling and trafficking Marijuana. Some may be fine with this happening, but I'm not, I've seen this :censored: up people's lives and personally I'm angry about how the situation is being dealt with. Recreation Marijuana use should be made as legal as alcohol.

A few more arguments about the legalization of Marijuana.

1 - In America right now, marijuana distribution and usage is one of the most often committed crimes. Huge amounts of funding go to anti-marijuana law enforcement. From a strictly financial standpoint, marijuana should be made legal because the government would save large amounts of money in law enforcement. This cash could then be spent on more dangerous drugs, rehabilitation programs, and education.

2 - If marijuana were legal, a tax could be placed on it. The market for marijuana is gigantic. Thus the United States government could collect even more money. This money could also be spent on more serious drugs, rehabilitation programs and education. You might argue that marijuana taxation is an unachievable aspiration because, if marijuana were legal, those who wanted it could grow it themselves. I would argue that people as a whole would be far to lazy to grow anything for themselves; the human race doesn't mind spending outrageous amounts of money for services and products they could produce themselves for free. A perfect example of this is the restaurant business. Food is 200% to 900% less expensive if you cook it yourself, and yet people still go out to dinner and lunch.

3 - If alcohol is legal, then marijuana should be legal for the following reason: People under the influence of alcohol can have a tendency to well.. you know the deal. People under the influence of marijuana have no detrimental tendencies produced solely from smoking Marijuana. A person high can still achieve what they do normally, that's not a big deal (to me) to most people if they understand. This is excluding beginner tokers. :happy:

4 - If cigarettes are legal, then marijuana should be legal because; a) Cigarettes are chemically addictive. Marijuana is not. b) Some people smoke up to forty cigarettes daily often causing terrible lung damage. While smoking marijuana can cause damage to the lungs, nobody ever smokes forty joints a day. Thus there are usually fewer lung problems associated with smoking weed.

5 - If cigarettes and alcohol are legal, marijuana should be legal because hundreds of thousands of people die each year solely from smoking cigarettes and drinking alcohol. Today, the total number of people who have died solely from smoking weed is a whopping 0. :question:

6 - Right now, marijuana is considered the number one "gateway drug" (which isn't true if you've done any research regarding Marijuana.) Among those 21 and over, alcohol is not considered a gateway to other more harmful drugs, because the most harmful other drugs (other than inhalants) are illegal; and drinking, for adults, is not. Thus if marijuana were made legal, it would cease to be a gateway into more harmful illegal substances. Right? If only Politicians would have the balls to step forward now and admit they have been wrong for so many years. :fool:

I'd rather not argue the real effects of cannabis, research is out there if you're interested. It's no where as bad as some of you may have been led to believe. I don't believe it's appropriate to use the threat of the law to provoke us and stop people from using it.

Now I'm not necessarily in favor of more people using weed, but I just don't see how taking money or liberty from those that do is helping.


EDIT: Ironically, my post count is (1)420 :rock:

These are all popular arguments of the pothead. I'm not calling you one, but I've heard this stuff time and time again from those who are looking for any argument to defend marijuana use because they like to smoke it. The only one you left out is "God put it here; it's natural, so it must be ok to smoke it." Hardee-har-har. :lolabove:

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

Actually, you did just call me a pot head, given you said 'these are popular arguments of a *ahem* pot head'. It's obviously directed towards my post (Everything okay up there? You seem a little slow). The reason they are 'popular arguments' is because they are valid as far as I can see. It's not like you were trying to prove me wrong. And I still don't see the point of your post, I know I smoke marijuana, ganja, the reefer, whatever you want to call it, so if this was an attempt to down-grade the post or points in the post itself (which was about the legalization of marijuana, in case you forgot) you failed.

But just so I don't leave out a point, here it goes:

Genesis Chapter 1 Verse 11

And God said “Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed,”

Genesis Chapter 1 verse 29.

And God said behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth and every tree, in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed: to you shall it be for meat.

 

[All Vol!]

I fail to see how either of these verses constitutes anything close to proof of God's thumbs-up to getting high?

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

It was sarcasm. :fool:

Not sure where you are getting this stuff, All Vol, did I even say that those verses gave God's thumbs-up to getting high? No.

Now, please, do me a favor and:stop:

 

[BigPapaVol]

Thought I'd revive this thread here.


Over 11% of inmates in the federal penitentiaries are merely there because they wanted to have some fun. What crime could this be? Possession, selling and trafficking Marijuana. Some may be fine with this happening, but I'm not, I've seen this :censored: up people's lives and personally I'm angry about how the situation is being dealt with. Recreation Marijuana use should be made as legal as alcohol.

A few more arguments about the legalization of Marijuana.

1 - In America right now, marijuana distribution and usage is one of the most often committed crimes. Huge amounts of funding go to anti-marijuana law enforcement. From a strictly financial standpoint, marijuana should be made legal because the government would save large amounts of money in law enforcement. This cash could then be spent on more dangerous drugs, rehabilitation programs, and education.

2 - If marijuana were legal, a tax could be placed on it. The market for marijuana is gigantic. Thus the United States government could collect even more money. This money could also be spent on more serious drugs, rehabilitation programs and education. You might argue that marijuana taxation is an unachievable aspiration because, if marijuana were legal, those who wanted it could grow it themselves. I would argue that people as a whole would be far to lazy to grow anything for themselves; the human race doesn't mind spending outrageous amounts of money for services and products they could produce themselves for free. A perfect example of this is the restaurant business. Food is 200% to 900% less expensive if you cook it yourself, and yet people still go out to dinner and lunch.

3 - If alcohol is legal, then marijuana should be legal for the following reason: People under the influence of alcohol can have a tendency to well.. you know the deal. People under the influence of marijuana have no detrimental tendencies produced solely from smoking Marijuana. A person high can still achieve what they do normally, that's not a big deal (to me) to most people if they understand. This is excluding beginner tokers. :happy:

4 - If cigarettes are legal, then marijuana should be legal because; a) Cigarettes are chemically addictive. Marijuana is not. b) Some people smoke up to forty cigarettes daily often causing terrible lung damage. While smoking marijuana can cause damage to the lungs, nobody ever smokes forty joints a day. Thus there are usually fewer lung problems associated with smoking weed.

5 - If cigarettes and alcohol are legal, marijuana should be legal because hundreds of thousands of people die each year solely from smoking cigarettes and drinking alcohol. Today, the total number of people who have died solely from smoking weed is a whopping 0. :question:

6 - Right now, marijuana is considered the number one "gateway drug" (which isn't true if you've done any research regarding Marijuana.) Among those 21 and over, alcohol is not considered a gateway to other more harmful drugs, because the most harmful other drugs (other than inhalants) are illegal; and drinking, for adults, is not. Thus if marijuana were made legal, it would cease to be a gateway into more harmful illegal substances. Right? If only Politicians would have the balls to step forward now and admit they have been wrong for so many years. :fool:

I'd rather not argue the real effects of cannabis, research is out there if you're interested. It's no where as bad as some of you may have been led to believe. I don't believe it's appropriate to use the threat of the law to provoke us and stop people from using it.

Now I'm not necessarily in favor of more people using weed, but I just don't see how taking money or liberty from those that do is helping.


EDIT: Ironically, my post count is (1)420 :rock:

I'll give it a try.

Those people are in jail because they intentionally broke a clearly written law. There need be no further discussion of your being angry about it. Those people with f'ed up lives clearly had the option not to break the law. Until the law changes, all of those breaking that law are wrong and should be punished accordingly.

1. This is just plain silly. We could save money by doing away with law enforcement altogether, but it makes as little sense as this argument does. Either way, it's against the law.

2. If legalized, taxation would definitely occur and this is the only argument for with any merit whatsoever. However, the tremendous pile of tax revenues of which you're dreaming is dramatically overblown. Just because everyone you know smokes weed, don't assume that it's normal. Either way, it's against the law.

3. To imply that marijuana is not mind altering and does not impact decision making is just worng. Otherwise, you're an idiot for paying the premium to use it. Either way, it's against the law.

4. Cigarettes do not cause the same mind alteration that weed does. If you're going to argue that it does, then you should stop this silly debate immediately and begin saving money by smoking cigs. Either way, it's against the law.

5. Can you back up that stat. Doesn't really matter, it's against the law.

6. Gateway would be removed, but the gateway to this argument in regards to more illicit drugs would be wide open. Where does that slippery slope end?

We could, and many do, make a similar stack of arguments about most laws. Picking and choosing which we agree to is not a right in America. Until the law changes, which is very unlikely, those who break it will deservedly be punished IAW that law.

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

I'll give it a try.

Those people are in jail because they intentionally broke a clearly written law. There need be no further discussion of your being angry about it. Those people with f'ed up lives clearly had the option not to break the law. Until the law changes, all of those breaking that law are wrong and should be punished accordingly.

1. This is just plain silly. We could save money by doing away with law enforcement altogether, but it makes as little sense as this argument does. Either way, it's against the law.

2. If legalized, taxation would definitely occur and this is the only argument for with any merit whatsoever. However, the tremendous pile of tax revenues of which you're dreaming is dramatically overblown. Just because everyone you know smokes weed, don't assume that it's normal. Either way, it's against the law.

3. To imply that marijuana is not mind altering and does not impact decision making is just worng. Otherwise, you're an idiot for paying the premium to use it. Either way, it's against the law.

4. Cigarettes do not cause the same mind alteration that weed does. If you're going to argue that it does, then you should stop this silly debate immediately and begin saving money by smoking cigs. Either way, it's against the law.

5. Can you back up that stat. Doesn't really matter, it's against the law.

6. Gateway would be removed, but the gateway to this argument in regards to more illicit drugs would be wide open. Where does that slippery slope end?

We could, and many do, make a similar stack of arguments about most laws. Picking and choosing which we agree to is not a right in America. Until the law changes, which is very unlikely, those who break it will deservedly be punished IAW that law.

I think you missed out on what this thread is getting at. LEGALIZATION of Marijauana. As is, we obviously know it's illegal, so everything in bold in 1-5 should not be taken into consideration -- We already know that's it's illegal.

1. It makes more sense than your example your listed. Do away with law enforcement all together? Come on, now you're just loosing credibility. The point of #1 was just listing a positive available option if Marijuana were legalized.

2. I don't believe it's tremendously overblown, first off, I really believe more people smoke weed than you think. A lot of people smoke now, but if it became legal don't you think plenty more people would get that psycho-babble, brain-washed bull **** out of their had that was encrypted into their head as children by the government and higher authorities? (Alright, I over-exaggerated that last comment a bit, but I think you see what I'm saying.)

3. Let's take a closer looker at what I saw saying.

People under the influence of marijuana have no detrimental tendencies produced solely from smoking Marijuana. A person high can still achieve what they do normally, that's not a big deal (to me) to most people if they understand.

You're saying I'm implying that it's not mind-altering. Please explain your comment and then while you're at it, explain why I'm an idiot (for putting my foot down and sticking up for what I believe?).

4. Please, I made a fair comparison. I never said weed causes the same mild-alteration as cigarettes. Let's go through this again. Cigarettes are chemically addictive, weed obviously is not. Due to an additive, this may cause some people to chain smoke (due to the crave), because, well, it's addictive. Chain smoking will usually lead to more damage to the lung. Simple as that. Weed, on the other hand is a natural plant (oh, I'm gonna get flamed for that), which is no more addictive than sugar or caffeine.

5. Here you go:

[SIZE=-1] An estimated 20% of adults age 20 to 40 years use illegal recreational drugs regularly. (5) The death toll from overdose was 7,000 in 1986 while 100,000 to 200,000 died from alcohol-related causes, (7) and 320,000 to 390,000 died from tobacco. (8) Tobacco is the hardest drug in terms of addictiveness. (9) Its popularity makes it the most serious drug-related threat to worldwide health. However, the biggest killer of all is overeating, believed to be responsible for 500,000 to 1,000,000 cardiovascular deaths each year. (10) Much effort and expense is being directed at a relatively minor problem, most of which comes from the aggression we are using to stop it![/SIZE]

 

[therealUT]

I'll give it a try.

Those people are in jail because they intentionally broke a clearly written law. There need be no further discussion of your being angry about it.

Shouldn't there be victims to these crimes? I have yet to see a victim of marijuana use. Assault, theft, vandalism, rape, murder, etc. all have clear victims.

But, like you said, 'it is against the law so these people deserve to be in jail.' Great argument.

 

[All Vol!]

It was sarcasm. :fool:

Not sure where you are getting this stuff, All Vol, did I even say that those verses gave God's thumbs-up to getting high? No.

Now, please, do me a favor and:stop:

I saw nothing in your post to indicate you were being sarcastic with the biblical references, and indeed, it seems most weed smokers who use that argument aren't kidding. But if you say so, I'll take your word for it.

Now, please, do ME a favor...go take another jug hit, eat a couple boxes of Little Debbies and lay down. :cool2:

 

[OWB]

go take another jug hit, eat a couple boxes of Little Debbies and lay down. :cool2:

Ah, the perfect day!

 

[All Vol!]

Ah, the perfect day!

Now I know what you mean by "Location: My Own Little World"

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

I thought the picture with the marijuana leaf next to the bible would be a dead give-away, my bad. :neener2:


And I would take you up on that offer, but I'm dry and the roads are too icy to drive.

 

[All Vol!]

I thought the picture with the marijuana leaf next to the bible would be a dead give-away, my bad. :neener2:


And I would take you up on that offer, but I'm dry and the roads are too icy to drive.

no, I took that as supportive imagery? Look dude, I used to 'partake' with the best of them. I was virtually all day/every day for years. Maybe this stems mainly from my personal experience and what I observed of fellow heads around me, but I really don't think recreational marijauna use provides anything of genuine benefit to anyone. Sure, it's relaxing, and the sensory enhancement feels fun for a while (tv, music and all that), but by and large, its users are, in my view, a more or less lazy, self-deceptive and unproductive lot. And after years of smoking the sh**, that is exactly how I came to feel. One of my favorite expressions came from a stand-up comic who said of marijuana, "There's a reason they call it dope." And it's true.
As for the legalization argument, I don't really think the world would come apart at the seams if it were legal, but I cannot support the argument at this time. eace2:

 

[therealUT]

no, I took that as supportive imagery? Look dude, I used to 'partake' with the best of them. I was virtually all day/every day for years. Maybe this stems mainly from my personal experience and what I observed fellow heads around me, but I really don't think recreational marijauna use provides anything of genuine benefit to anyone. Sure, it's relaxing, and the sensory enhancement feels fun for a while (tv, music and all that), but by and large, its users are, in my view, a more or less lazy, self-deceptive and unproductive lot. And after years of smoking the sh**, that is exactly how I came to feel. One of my favorite expressions came from a stand-up comic who said of marijuana, "There's a reason they call it dope." And it's true.
As for the legalization argument, I don't really think the world would come apart at the seams if it were legal, but I cannot support the argument at this time. eace2:

I will completely agree with you on your view of potheads and the effects of smoking marijuana. However, why should that make it illegal? Freedom means not only the freedom to succeed, but also the freedom to make stupid decisions and fail miserably. I never want my kids to smoke pot (or cigarettes, for that matter) however, when I sit them down and tell them why, my answer will not be "because it is against the law." Unfortunately, I have a feeling that the reason so many push to outlaw more and more substances (smoking anywhere, transfats, junk food at school, etc.), it is simply because some parents are too lazy and inept to explain to their children a solid reason for avoiding such substances and behaviors. Hence, the US government is filling that parenting role...something it was never established to do.

 

[All Vol!]

I will completely agree with you on your view of potheads and the effects of smoking marijuana. However, why should that make it illegal? Freedom means not only the freedom to succeed, but also the freedom to make stupid decisions and fail miserably. I never want my kids to smoke pot (or cigarettes, for that matter) however, when I sit them down and tell them why, my answer will not be "because it is against the law." Unfortunately, I have a feeling that the reason so many push to outlaw more and more substances (smoking anywhere, transfats, junk food at school, etc.), it is simply because some parents are too lazy and inept to explain to their children a solid reason for avoiding such substances and behaviors. Hence, the US government is filling that parenting role...something it was never established to do.

I think yours is a sound argument for the most part. However, the "freedom to make stupid decisions" cannot in anyway infringe on others' freedoms; there are some rather tangible considerations before I could personally support legalization. For example, if it were legalized, there would be a percieved need for designated public areas for consumption because contact-intoxication is real, and it would infringe on the rights of many. Also, I know from personal experience that it isn't too difficult, depending on the quality or strength of a given crop of marijuana, to get so high that your ability to responsibly operate a vehicle is seriously impaired - opening up a whole other line of considerations that go without saying. Its use would have to be seriously regulated and restricted in my view, in much the same way is alcohol. I concede there is (as argued by many) an obsurd contradiction in alcohol's being legal and marijuana's not. I assume the difference is that marijuana has long been associated with a subculture of 'undesirables', whereas alcohol has virtually always enjoyed broad social acceptance.
As far as parents' laziness and ineptitude in this matter is concerned, I have no argument.

 

[BigPapaVol]

Shouldn't there be victims to these crimes? I have yet to see a victim of marijuana use. Assault, theft, vandalism, rape, murder, etc. all have clear victims.

But, like you said, 'it is against the law so these people deserve to be in jail.' Great argument.

It is against the law to be in any way associated with the use, possession or distribution of marijuana. Victim or no, we have to enforce the laws on the books, otherwise we undermine our entire justice system. If the law calls for prison, why should we do something different. I was simply calling into question his being annoyed by people willfully breaking the law being punished. How is that a poor argument?

Who is the clear victim in contempt of court? How about tax evasion? How about bomb threats? How about being late to PT? How about general traffic violations? No victim means no enforcement? Now that's a cogent argument.

 

[BigPapaVol]

I I never want my kids to smoke pot (or cigarettes, for that matter) however, when I sit them down and tell them why, my answer will not be "because it is against the law." Unfortunately, I have a feeling that the reason so many push to outlaw more and more substances (smoking anywhere, transfats, junk food at school, etc.), it is simply because some parents are too lazy and inept to explain to their children a solid reason for avoiding such substances and behaviors. Hence, the US government is filling that parenting role...something it was never established to do.

Since you're uberdaddy, tell me what you're going to tell the kids. Are you going to teach them that the laws which prohibit victimless actions are purely window dressing and need not be followed. I don't actually care what you teach your kids, but I would hope while your at it, you'd teach them that laws are the basis of our freedom and should be followed.

"Listen to me realUT jr, it's OK to run stop signs when nobody else is around, because there is no victim." Now that's teaching.

 

[cd12]

Shouldn't there be victims to these crimes? I have yet to see a victim of marijuana use. Assault, theft, vandalism, rape, murder, etc. all have clear victims.

But, like you said, 'it is against the law so these people deserve to be in jail.' Great argument.

I usually don't post in these type threads but I will say there are a number of victims of marijuana abuse. Not to mention the hazzards for law enforcement who concentrate on the manufactoring and distribution level.

Fact is, it is against the law so yeah it will be enforced. If they ever change it, so be it but personally I think it would open pandoras box! And by the way some states already tax it. Get caught with a bunch and see just what they take from you.

Not arguing either side but to say its victimless compelled me to post!

 

[All Vol!]

crimedawg, thank God you showed up! You may want to arrest Volunteer Kirby; he buys and smokes pot.

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

:devilsmoke:

:machgun:All_Vol!

 

[justingroves]

no, I took that as supportive imagery? Look dude, I used to 'partake' with the best of them. I was virtually all day/every day for years. Maybe this stems mainly from my personal experience and what I observed of fellow heads around me, but I really don't think recreational marijauna use provides anything of genuine benefit to anyone. Sure, it's relaxing, and the sensory enhancement feels fun for a while (tv, music and all that), but by and large, its users are, in my view, a more or less lazy, self-deceptive and unproductive lot. And after years of smoking the sh**, that is exactly how I came to feel. One of my favorite expressions came from a stand-up comic who said of marijuana, "There's a reason they call it dope." And it's true.
As for the legalization argument, I don't really think the world would come apart at the seams if it were legal, but I cannot support the argument at this time. eace2:

I've never smoked it, because everyone I've ever seen do it acts the way you described.

 

[therealUT]

I usually don't post in these type threads but I will say there are a number of victims of marijuana abuse. Not to mention the hazzards for law enforcement who concentrate on the manufactoring and distribution level.

Fact is, it is against the law so yeah it will be enforced. If they ever change it, so be it but personally I think it would open pandoras box! And by the way some states already tax it. Get caught with a bunch and see just what they take from you.

Not arguing either side but to say its victimless compelled me to post!

It is victim-less.

 

[cd12]

So drug abuse claims no victims?

 

[therealUT]

So drug abuse claims no victims?

Drug abuse, in itself, claims no victims. If someone murders, steals, commits assault, etc. while they are under the influence of said drugs, then they have committed murder, theft, assault, etc. It matters not if they were under the influence of a drug when they committed said act.