Why the Heisman Trophy is Horse----

#51
#51
mikey said:
If you think that the best player in football has to come from the national champion then I'd say your description of the errand makes it a perfect errand for you.
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The best player in college football cannot make mistakes that directly cause their team to lose. Peyton Manning is guilty of making those mistakes in 1997 while Charles Woodson was not. I doubt you will find any stats on Hornung in which he made mistakes that attributed to Notre Dame losses.
 
#52
#52
therealUT said:
The best player in college football cannot make mistakes that directly cause their team to lose. Peyton Manning is guilty of making those mistakes in 1997 while Charles Woodson was not. I doubt you will find any stats on Hornung in which he made mistakes that attributed to Notre Dame losses.
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Point #1: I think Woodson should have won the Heisman.
Point #2: You don't think Woodson made any mistakes?
Point #3: In the course of a 2-8 season, you think Hornung made no mistakes?

:crazy:
 
#53
#53
mikey said:
Point #1: I think Woodson should have won the Heisman.
Point #2: You don't think Woodson made any mistakes?
Point #3: In the course of a 2-8 season, you think Hornung made no mistakes?

:crazy:
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"Mistakes that directly cause their team to lose."

I know that Woodsen made none of them in 1997. Hornung made plenty of mistakes, but I do not believe that any of them led directly to Notre Dame losses.
 
#54
#54
therealUT said:
"Mistakes that directly cause their team to lose."

I know that Woodsen made none of them in 1997. Hornung made plenty of mistakes, but I do not believe that any of them led directly to Notre Dame losses.
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No one mistake in a game leads directly to a loss. Losses due to mistakes are just that...due to mistakes accumulated throughout the game. You are assuming that a QB throwing a pick directly lost the game. What about the RB who may have fumbled earlier in the game or the lineman who may have jumped and took his team out of FG range or the DB who may have gotten the late hit that put the other team IN FG range...and I'd guess in a 2-8 season Hornung probably made a key mistake.
 
#55
#55
Johnny Majors:
108 rushes, 549 yards
36 of 59 for 552 yards passing
0 ints
10 PRs, 86 yards
6 KRs, 135 yards

Paul Hornung:
94 rushes, 420 yards
59 of 111, 917 yards
2 ints
4 PRs, 63 yards
16 KRs, 496 yards
 
#56
#56
therealUT said:
Johnny Majors:
108 rushes, 549 yards
36 of 59 for 552 yards passing
0 ints
10 PRs, 86 yards
6 KRs, 135 yards

Paul Hornung:
94 rushes, 420 yards
59 of 111, 917 yards
2 ints
4 PRs, 63 yards
16 KRs, 496 yards
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Hornung's stats on a bad team were better than Majors on a good team...so you're proving my point for me now? It wasn't a stat game then. If the two had swapped teams what would the stats have been?:question:
 
#57
#57
mikey said:
Hornung's stats on a bad team were better than Majors on a good team...so you're proving my point for me now? It wasn't a stat game then. If the two had swapped teams what would the stats have been?:question:
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If you had put Hornung in that UT backfield, Majors would have never had a football career past his playing days at UT.
 
#58
#58
therealUT said:
If you had put Hornung in that UT backfield, Majors would have never had a football career past his playing days at UT.
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So...you're saying that the best player won the Heisman even though he was on a bad team...which means we agree. Which is the way it's supposed to be.:thumbsup:
 
#59
#59
mikey said:
So...you're saying that the best player won the Heisman even though he was on a bad team...which means we agree. Which is the way it's supposed to be.:thumbsup:
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Yes. I would say that the only recent winners in which I feel were not the best players, were Jason White, Chris Weinke, and Ron Dayne.
 
#60
#60
mikey said:
If you think that the best player in football has to come from the national champion then I'd say your description of the errand makes it a perfect errand for you.
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I would ask you to find where I said that. Alas, I never have, so I'll just let you continue on your little mindless Manningite rant.
 
#61
#61
hatvol96 said:
I would ask you to find where I said that. Alas, I never have, so I'll just let you continue on your little mindless Manningite rant.
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"Did Georgia win a National Title in '98? No. What did Bailey do to defeat Tennessee in '98? Nothing."

I take that to mean you think that Champ Bailey shouldn't have been considered because he didn't win a NC. As far as the Manningite comment...I think I said Woodson SHOULD have won...read more closely before you try to attack with a sad attempt at cute language.
 
#62
#62
therealUT said:
Yes. I would say that the only recent winners in which I feel were not the best players, were Jason White, Chris Weinke, and Ron Dayne.
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Personally, I believe Eddie Goerge over Tommie Frazier was ca ca...but how about Toretta over Faulk, Detmer over Ismail and Bo Jackson BARELY beating Chuck Long. Those 3 are just absurd.
 
#63
#63
mikey said:
"Did Georgia win a National Title in '98? No. What did Bailey do to defeat Tennessee in '98? Nothing."

I take that to mean you think that Champ Bailey shouldn't have been considered because he didn't win a NC. As far as the Manningite comment...I think I said Woodson SHOULD have won...read more closely before you try to attack with a sad attempt at cute language.
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No, that expains why ESPN didn't go on and on about Champ Bailey. Georgia was irrelevant.
 
#64
#64
hatvol96 said:
No, that expains why ESPN didn't go on and on about Champ Bailey. Georgia was irrelevant.
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...as are your contributions to this dicussion, my friend...as are your contributions...you've made no point whatsoever.:disappointed:
 
#65
#65
mikey said:
...as are your contributions to this dicussion, my friend...as are your contributions...you've made no point whatsoever.:disappointed:
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It's called the injection of logic. I'm not surprised you're unfamiliar with the concept. Why don't you now start another intellectually stimulating thread discussing ESPN's vendetta against UT?
 
#66
#66
hatvol96 said:
It's called the injection of logic. I'm not surprised you're unfamiliar with the concept. Why don't you now start another intellectually stimulating thread discussing ESPN's vendetta against UT?
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:lolabove:
...and where, exactly did you inject logic?
 
#72
#72
mikey said:
You're the one trying to be Shakespeare on a football board genius.
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No, I'm simply using my spare time to enlighten the huddled masses. By the way, if you're a teacher, why are you on here so much during school hours? Quit wasting tax dollars and teach somebody.
 
#74
#74
mikey said:
Personally, I believe Eddie Goerge over Tommie Frazier was ca ca...but how about Toretta over Faulk, Detmer over Ismail and Bo Jackson BARELY beating Chuck Long. Those 3 are just absurd.
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I can't exactly say any of those are absurd. Bo won. Toretta played much stiffer competition than Faulk could ever hope to see. Ismail really was not all that great, just very, very fast. Detmer on the other hand was incredible and single handedly took BYU on his back for one of the greatest comebacks in college football history.
 
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