Will Rand Paul plunge the world into catastrophic depression?

[IPorange]

If China wants their money, tell them to come take it.

We're better than that. We just have to quit spending like drunken sailors and start working for an honest living again.

 

[MG1968]

We're better than that. We just have to quit spending like drunken sailors and start working for an honest living again.

Reagan had a great retort to that line when he said that to compare that to Congress was a disservice to drunken sailors, because they, at least, were spending their own money.

 

[myrobbins7]

We're better than that. We just have to quit spending like drunken sailors and start working for an honest living again.

Yeah, tell that to this lady ....YouTube - Obama Is Going To Pay For My Gas And Mortgage!!!

 

[azVolFan]

There are actually more splits than that.

The ruling against polygamy was because of external political pressure, not internal conflict. The fundamental Mormons consider others liberal compromisers for giving in.

My point is just when you think of Mormons, it's one lead in SLC and the others are not the same group. Splits occur is religion, it's inevitable. You are right about political pressure being the thing that changed the polygamy practice. I don't know for sure but I'll bet there were no laws against polygamy until Mormons did it and the other Christians didn't like it. Polygamy was OK in the Old Testament and then not OK in the New Testament and brought back in the Book of Mormon. It's not like Mormons invented it.

 

[bam15]

Ya, I've been fighting off a cold.

You must be a traveler from another dimension, gsvol. This board has always been overwhelmingly conservative.
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Overwhelmingly is an understatement.

 

[azVolFan]

Again, you complain about Beck, Hannity, etc. scaring everyone with rhetoric and yet you post this drivel.

Liberal scare tactics and SEIU beat-downs are acceptable. Didn't you hear? :bash:

 

[sjt18]

I am all but certain that there were laws against polygamy before the Mormons in most states. They aren't the only religion that practices polygamy. The founders were aware of Islam. Many if not most of the American Indian tribes practiced polygamy.

 

[arTfuldodger]

Abolish the FED. No income Tax!!! Paul(Ron) for 2012!!
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[gsvol]

his dad, like gsvol, wants to abolish the fed. one tea party policy that is really ****ing stupid. No chance in hell we default. I'm not even sure that's legal. Isn't in California.

No, not wanting to free ourselves from the economic slavery of central banking money supply is ****ing stupid!

So true believers can't be senators?
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Ever notice they sidestep the issue to attack the person??

 

[gasguy98]

i've never heard beck say he thinks he's balanced. nor have I seen any admission by msnbc that their news coverage is liberal. you dont' see the difference between the commentators and the actual news?

That creep o'donnell went on a tyrade not long ago about how he is a socialist:

YouTube - MSNBC Anchor O'Donnell: "I Am A Socialist. I Live To The Extreme Left Of You Mere Liberals!"

 

[lawgator1]

If Paul or some combo of TPers gets up there and seriously blocks a raise in the debt ceiling to make a point, I wonder how many of you conservatives will be so proud of that, as you live out of your cars on crumbling infrastructure highways, with hordes of hungry villagers banging on the windshield and trying to eat your dog..

Hey, this fear mongering thing with no evidence is pretty fun ! And easy ! Maybe Beck is on to something.

Let me try something else.... "Hey, buy crap."

Let's see if anyone bites.
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[droski]

yeah because surely nothing in the federal budget could be cut except the roads and education. no waste in other departments. . .

 

[droski]

No, not wanting to free ourselves from the economic slavery of central banking money supply is ****ing stupid!

yes because the ability to manipulate the money supply has only resulted in the most stable economic era in the history of the world. great idea to get rid of it.

 

[gsvol]

Rand Paul refers to being enslaved to debt and that the country cannot spend more than it takes in.

The only way that the country can service its debt, and we are scheduled to need to deal with it around March, is to legislatively raise the debt ceiling. Even very conservative Senators have recognized this but have voted to raise it.

This country has never defaulted on its debt.

But Rand Paul speaks in terms suggesting he might individually filibuster the act to raise the ceiling. If he does, when we hit midnight on that day, we will default.

And if that happens you can have all the gold coins and seeds you want from Glenn Beck. Won't help.

So why even have a ceiling at all???

You cap and tade guys want drastic action on the flimsiest of science about projected temperatures a century from now.

Elementary mathematics shows us without doubt that insanely adhering to the present system of money supply for another century would mean than one hundred percent of all US wages taxed at a one hundred percent rate wouldn't service the debt.

What would you propose we do then???

Call in economic advisors from Zimbabwe??

 

[gsvol]

Anything that makes LG uncomfortable politically makes me very happy.

"If Congress has the right under the Constitution to issue paper money, it was given to be used by themselves, not to be delegated to individuals or corporations."
Andrew Jackson, circa 1840, who succeeded in ending a central bank charter and completely retired the national debt within three years.

The last year we paid $440,000,000,000.00 just in debt service and went even further in debt.

It Is Now Mathematically Impossible To Pay Off The U.S. National Debt

"Most Americans have no real understanding of the operation of the international money lenders. The accounts of the Federal Reserve System have never been audited. It operates outside the control of Congress and manipulates the credit of the United States"
— Senator Barry Goldwater (Rep. AR)

I'm for a debt ceiling. And since when have pesky laws stopped the cali's from doing anything.

The debt ceiling is a joke, every time we set a ceiling we just come along and raise it again.

"Some people think the Federal Reserve Banks are the United States government's institutions. They are not government institutions. They are private credit monopolies which prey upon the people of the United States for the benefit of themselves and their foreign swindlers"
— Congressional Record 12595-12603 — Louis T. McFadden, Chairman of the Committee on Banking and Currency (12 years) June 10, 1932

"The regional Federal Reserve banks are not government agencies. ...but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations."
— Lewis vs. United States, 680 F. 2d 1239, 9th Circuit 1982

"The Federal Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities..."
— Lewis vs. United States, 9th Circuit 1992

"People who will not turn a shovel full of dirt on the project (Muscle Shoals Dam) nor contribute a pound of material, will collect more money from the United States than will the People who supply all the material and do all the work. This is the terrible thing about interest ...

But here is the point: If the Nation can issue a dollar bond it can issue a dollar bill. The element that makes the bond good makes the bill good also. The difference between the bond and the bill is that the bond lets the money broker collect twice the amount of the bond and an additional 20%. Whereas the currency, the honest sort provided by the Constitution pays nobody but those who contribute in some useful way. It is absurd to say our Country can issue bonds and cannot issue currency.

Both are promises to pay, but one fattens the usurer and the other helps the People. If the currency issued by the People were no good, then the bonds would be no good, either. It is a terrible situation when the Government, to insure the National Wealth, must go in debt and submit to ruinous interest charges at the hands of men who control the fictitious value of gold. Interest is the invention of Satan."
— THOMAS A. EDISON

"It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
— Henry Ford

 

[gsvol]

yes because the ability to manipulate the money supply has only resulted in the most stable economic era in the history of the world. great idea to get rid of it.

You don't really expect anyone to buy that crap do you??

For over 150 years the American Republic experienced nothing close to the total collapse and long lasting monetary troubles of the great depression.

The great depression began 15 years after the creation and empowerment of the Federal Reserve System of money supply.

"From now on, depressions will be scientifically
created."
— Congressman Charles A. Lindbergh Sr. , 1913, who accurately foretold to the American people what would be happening.

"Let me end my talk by abusing slightly my status as an official representative of the Federal Reserve. I would like to say to Milton and Anna: Regarding the Great Depression. You’re right, we did it. We’re very sorry."
Ben Bernanke, chairman of the federal reserve board, speaking on the occasion of Milton Friedman's nintieth birthday.

Today we again face another man made monetary crisis and to continue down the same road without major changes is pure insanity, or just plain ignorance.

"We are completely dependant on the commercial banks.
Someone has to borrow every dollar we have in circulation, cash or credit. If the banks create ample synthetic money we are prosperous; if not, we starve. We are absolutely without a permanent money system....

It is the most important subject intelligent persons can investigate and reflect upon.

It is so important that our present civilization may collapse unless it becomes widely understood and the defects remedied very soon."

— Robert H. Hamphill, Atlanta Federal Reserve Bank

Bank Failure - Failed Bank List 2010, 2009, 2008, 2007| FDIC Bank Failures

2007 - 2010 Bank Failure.Since the start of the financial crisis in 2007, there have been 311 bank failures with assets totaling a staggering $640.0 billion, deposits totaling $451.9 billion, and at an estimated cost to the FDIC’s Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) of $73.82 billion.

And if you claim or even believe the Dudd finance reform bill did anything to aleviate the problem then you are daft, the thing that sticks out about that bill is that is further strengthens to federal reserve powers while not addressing the problems at all that contributed to the current crisis.

When banks fail, the FDIC is appointed as receiver. Depositors are protected up to the FDIC insurance limit, currently at $250,000. In most cases, the FDIC arranges for the branches and insured deposits to be transferred to another well capitalized bank, and banking services for the failed bank's customers generally continue uninterrupted.

And who is better capatalized than the international bankers who own the federal reserve and create money???

Dodd's Finance Reform Bill Would Strengthen Fed

As the Wall Street Journal pointed out, “the biggest winner in Dodd's bill appears to be the central bank. It would police previously unregulated sectors of the economy and would have a new division to write consumer protection policy.”

Senator Dodd’s 1,336-page monstrosity is being touted as the most ambitious overhaul of the financial regulations since the New Deal. It represents the first time ever that large swathes of previously unregulated financial activity will be subject to the suffocating scrutiny of the state. It will impose heavy punitive costs on the entire financial sector, and put a definitive end to financial privacy, a right to which Americans are apparently no longer entitled. And, as with all previous regulatory regimes, it will produce unintended consequences that will lead to further economic distortion and instability for generations yet unborn.

Would you at least agree that the federal reserve banks should be auditied??

 

[droski]

if you knew the history of the great depression you'd know the fed sat on it's hands during it (and btw is what he is talking about in the quote you posted) which is exactly the opposite of what bernake did this time around. for all your hysteria about the fed printing dollars and mortgaging our future the inflation rate is still at all time lows. doesn't seem to matter does it?

 

[bam15]

Two posts in a row with no cartoons. Has to be a record.

Regardless, Paul is going to get laughed out of Washington if even attempts to try half the ideas he is proposing.

Some of the ideas aren't bad, the rest are absolutely ridiculous.

 

[lumberjack4]

for all your hysteria about the fed printing dollars and mortgaging our future the inflation rate is still at all time lows. doesn't seem to matter does it?

Is that not in large part due to the fact that home prices have fallen through the floor over the past 2 years? Could that not skew the numbers to hide inflation that may exist is other market sectors?

 

[droski]

no the housing component of inflation is based off of rental income, not housing prices. the reason why inflation is so low is because wage inflation is zero or negative. but we still haven't seen a massive increase in prices of standard goods even with the commodity run recently (mostly because it's been non food).

 

[VolsNSkinsFan]

where is Ed to comment on this since he is a double major and his daddy is an economist?

I guess he sticks to things he knows lots about... Like Guns!

 

[gsvol]

if you knew the history of the great depression you'd know the fed sat on it's hands during it (and btw is what he is talking about in the quote you posted) which is exactly the opposite of what bernake did this time around. for all your hysteria about the fed printing dollars and mortgaging our future the inflation rate is still at all time lows. doesn't seem to matter does it?

If you knew the history of the great depression perhaps
you wouldn't have said:

the ability to manipulate the money supply has only resulted in the most stable economic era in the history of the world.

So you admit you were wrong to say that??

Just because Bernanke is doing the opposite now
doesn't remove us from the economic stabilty promised
by the fed. For one Bernanke takes his marching orders
from the BIS.

Another is because while the great depression was
triggered by the market collapse, the bubble created
by easy credit that led up to the crash was caused
by fed policy and the fed bought plenty of bonds from
Roosevelt so he could fund projects like farm cooperatives
in his attempt to mimic Stalin's farming collectives.

Furthermore hyperinflation caused by the central bankers
in Germany brought down the government of the Weimer
Republic and led (whether by chance or design) to a
fascist nazi government led by Adolph Hitler to fill that
power vacuum.

As for hysteria, it seems impossible to have a sane,
rational, intelligent discussion on this matter in
particular on this board, just look at the title of this
thread for reference.

So what if the inflation rate is low, the point is that
we don't need a private corporation over which we
have no control in control of money supply when we
fought a revolution against the greatest empire on
Earth to gain our independence from such a system
in the beginning.

"Whoever controls the volume of money in any country
is absolute master of all industry and commerce."
— James A. Garfield, President of the United States

Two posts in a row with no cartoons. Has to be a record.

Regardless, Paul is going to get laughed out of Washington if even attempts to try half the ideas he is proposing.

Some of the ideas aren't bad, the rest are absolutely ridiculous.

His opponents no doubt will play to the ignorance of
the American people, ACLG comes along with some
chicken little scare tactic opposing Paul while side
stepping the real issues as you do but perhaps what
Paul proposes might avert a world wide depression
instead of bringing it on.

For one thing these international bankers can transfer
vast sums anywhere in the world at will without any
scrutiny on the part of the US government or public
knowledge, example A:

RIGHT BEFORE THE ELECTION OF PRESIDENT HUSSEIN: "A $550 Billion Electronic Run on the Banks" - Atlas Shrugs

Rand's dad got nearly a hundred more congressmen to
co-sponsor his 'federal reserve transparency act of
2009' than necessary to pass it but when nutcrunching
time came, it didn't pass.

Given that the Federal reserve has never been audited
would it not make sense that we have a look into it's
inner workings?? Just so that we can make intelligent
choices instead of depending on a elite few to do so
on our behalf??

Another point is that America has the second highest
corporate taxes in the world and after twenty years
of economic stagnation the number one country, Japan,
is moving in the opposite direction on corporate
taxation.

While that is going on the federal reserve banks enjoy
tax exempt status, does that make sense to you??

 

[droski]

"So you admit you were wrong to say that??"

i fail to see how i've been proven wrong. mistakes made by the fed in the 20s hardly lend credence to the argument that the fed isn't the primary reason we've had sustained economic success since WWII. i.e. if i didn't use my gun does that mean it can't kill someone?

 

[gsvol]

"So you admit you were wrong to say that??"

i fail to see how i've been proven wrong. mistakes made by the fed in the 20s hardly lend credence to the argument that the fed isn't the primary reason we've had sustained economic success since WWII. i.e. if i didn't use my gun does that mean it can't kill someone?

Because you said:

"the ability to manipulate the money supply has only resulted in the most stable economic era in the history of the world. "

And I brought up the great depression which was the
greatest transfer of wealth in American history since
we displaced the native Americans.

Now you say 'the most stable economic era in history
since WWII??'

I submit we have suffered greatly from inflation in that
era because it takes ten times the money or more to
purchase the same amount of goods now as it would
have then!!! This inflation has far outstripped most
gains made by the average American citizen.

"Every Congressman, every Senator knows precisely
what causes inflation...but can't, [won't] support the
drastic reforms to stop it [repeal of the Federal Reserve
Act] because it could cost him his job."
— Robert A. Heinlein, Expanded Universe

(Perhaps our illustrious junior senator form Tennessee,
Corker, may not understand since he asked Bernanke;
"so you propose to nationalize all the banks in America?"
and Bernanke relied with a smile; "no, we meant to
privatize them!")

I misspoke when I said:

"Just because Bernanke is doing the opposite now
doesn't remove us from the economic stabilty promised
by the fed. For one Bernanke takes his marching orders
from the BIS."

I meant to say:

Just because Bernanke is doing the opposite now
still doesn't guarantee the economic stability supposedly
guaranteed by the fed system because plan B may
have the opposite outcome, ie; hyperinflation, as the
tight money policy during the depression and furthermore
if that is the solution to the problem, then why didn't the
fed figure that out then sooner rather than later?

Not only that we certainly have no guarantee that the
bubble may not still burst and we are indeed plunged into
a worldwide depression as ACLG warns may yet happen.

"The few who understand the system, will either be so
interested from it's profits or so dependant on it's
favors, that there will be no opposition from that class."
— Rothschild Brothers of London, 1863 (oft repeated
by smug central bankers.)

I submit you are just interested in benefiting from the
profits to be gained from this system rather that discussing
how the system actually works or what is best for
the future of our nation.

One doesn't need a gun to kill someone.

I am still of the opinion that we the American people
would be far better served to use Constitutional means
to control money supply rather than continue to submit
that authority to the control of anonymous international
banking interests, nothing you have said so far even
faintly convinces me otherwise.

At the bare minimum we need some oversight of the
actual details of what is happening within central banking
circles, would you not at least agree on that??

 

[gsvol]

because it's gotta be paid back eventually.

Why should the most prosperous nation in the world
also be the biggest debtor in the world?? That doesn't
make any sense unless one has some knowledge about
how the monetary system works.

"Most Americans have no real understanding of the
operation of the international money lenders. The
accounts of the Federal Reserve System have never
been audited. It operates outside the control of
Congress and manipulates the credit of the United
States"
— Senator Barry Goldwater (Rep. AR)

"The modern Banking system manufactures money
out of nothing. The process is perhaps the most
astounding piece of sleight of hand that was ever
invented. Banks can in fact inflate, mint and unmint
the modern ledger-entry currency."
— MAJOR L .L. B. ANGUS:

"By this means government may secretly and
unobserved, confiscate the wealth of the people,
and not one man in a million will detect the theft."
— John Maynard Keynes (the father of 'Keynesian
Economics' which our nation now endures) in his
book "THE ECONOMIC CONSEQUENCES
OF THE PEACE" (1920).

"To expose a 15 Trillion dollar rip-off of the American
people by the stockholders of the 1000 largest
corporations over the last 100 years will be a tall
order of business."
— Buckminster Fuller

"The Federal Reserve banks, while not part of the
government..."
— United States budget for 1991 and 1992 part 7,
page 10

"When you or I write a check there must be sufficient
funds in out account to cover the check, but when the
Federal Reserve writes a check there is no bank deposit
on which that check is drawn. When the Federal
Reserve writes a check, it is creating money."
— Putting it simply, Boston Federal Reserve Bank

"Every circulating Federal Reserve Note represents a
one dollar debt to the Federal Reserve system."
— Money Facts, House Banking and Currency Committee

The Federal Reserve system pays the U.S. Treasury
020.60 per thousand notes --a little over 2 cents each
- without regard to the face value of the note. Federal
Reserve Notes, incidentally, are the only type of
currency now produced for circulation. They are printed
exclusively by the Treasury's Bureau of Engraving and
Printing, and the $20.60 per thousand price reflects the
Bureau's full cost of production. Federal Reserve Notes
are printed in 01, 02, 05, 10, 20, 50, and 100 dollar
denominations only; notes of 500, 1000, 5000, and
10,000 denominations were last printed in 1945."
—Donald J. Winn, Assistant to the Board of Governors
of the Federal Reserve system

"History records that the money changers have used
every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means
possible to maintain their control over governments by
controlling money and it's issuance."
— President James Madison

"The Power of financial capitalism had far reaching plan,
nothing less than to create a world system of financial
control in private hands able to dominate the political
system of each country and the economy of the world
as a whole.

This system was to be controlled in a feudalistic fashion
by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by
secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and
conferences.

The apex of the system was to be the Bank for
International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a
private bank owned and controlled by the world's
central banks, which were themselves private
corporations.

Each central bank sought to dominate its government
by its ability to control treasury loans, to manipulate
foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic
activity in the country, and to influence co-operative
politicians by subsequent rewards in the business
world."

Carrol Quigley, Tragedy and Hope, 1966 - [Bill Clinton's
mentor and Georgetown University professor,] (the only
mentor Slick Willy mentioned by name when he thanked
his mentors for helping him become president.)

Quigley was for this system, he just thought more
people should know about it and how it worked, he
was voted 'most influntial professor' by the student
body for 28 straight years.

My argument is that at a bare minimum the American
people deserve to be able to look at the books of those
corporations that have so much influence over every
aspect of politics, economy, industry and foreign policy
among many other things in this country.

Otherwise we are blindfolded and trying to play pin the
tail on the donkey and it's our ass that is the donkey!!

easy there IP. They are providing a very cheap labor force and little more. They run a serious tightrope here if they let the American protectionists roll into any real voice. We hammer them with tariffs over their bullshiz exchange rate and they bite the bullet just as badly as we do.

yup. i remember thinking he was pretty resonable for a carter guy. there was a time when msnbc was the only alternative to cnn and they seemed to be trying to get the moderate viewer. no longer.