Will we ever have an elite program?

#151
#151
Billy D is back to recruiting at a high level. I think he got complacent. He has a good group this year and they are much better than most people thought they would be.

He is beating some elite programs in recruiting.
 
#152
#152
crazyguy said:
Florida has won in march and I wouldn't call them an elite program. It takes a decade to become an elite team...I believe others around the country would agree.
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1994 Final Four
1999 Sweet 16
2000 Runner Up
2006-2007 National Champions

By your own definition, Florida is an elite program. Since 1990, only Duke (3) and UNC(3) have more than Florida's (2)NC. Only Duke (5), UNC (8), Michigan State(5), and Kansas (5) have more than Florida's (4) Final Four Appearances during the same time frame. Florida has exactly the same number of NC and Final Four appearances as Kentucky during the last 20 years.
 
#153
#153
Florida does not have the season by season of success for the past 20 years of any of the elite programs. Two National championships back to back schew the long term elite status of this program according to the way you define it.
 
#154
#154
BasketvolsFan said:
Florida does not have the season by season of success for the past 20 years of any of the elite programs. Two National championships back to back schew the long term elite status of this program according to the way you define it.
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I would say a Final Four trip every 5 years would trump a "season by season" of success. The fact is, over the last 20 years only 2 programs have won more National Titles, and only 4 have been to more Final Fours. Last time I checked, Final Fours and NC are the barometer of ultimate success for a basketball season.

I realize that your being a UT basketball fan, you believe that somehow UT's recent run of Sweet 16s, Conference Championships, and head to head record against Florida, somehow trumps the Gators accomplishments. If the argument is the Gators are not one of the Elite programs of the last 20 years because they've been to "ONLY" 4 Final Fours, then your own criteria deems Volunteer basketball as irrelevant nationally and a far, far reach from evening sniffing Elite status.
 
#155
#155
Calisking,

Most UT fans would agree with you that UT is a far far reach from Elite Status. For the first time in the history of our school if 2011 is as strong as 2010, we will have reached Elite recruiting, to go with Elite attendance. We are paying top 20 salary, and we are expecting better than top 20 results. If Bruce Pearl gets 1 Final Four and 1 Elite 8 in the next few years we will be happy.

The reason people here do not respect Billy D is not just that we keep beating them, it is that we would be furious if our coach won a N.C. much less two and then quit making the tournament. We share some of the flaws of KY fans, we grow accustomed to a baseline. The baseline now is 2 wins in the NCAA tournament but we want more! If we get an Elite 8 we will be clamoring for a Final 4, if we get that there will be clamoring for a NC. It is a beast that cannot be fed, and if we get results that mean that we are one of the top 10-16 teams in the country year after year, Bruce Pearl will be stunned at how unacceptable that is to a fanbase that has no history to justify an expectation of more.
 
#156
#156
BasketvolsFan said:
After seeing a half-full arena and about 1/3 of the student section filled last night, I couldn't help but wonder if we will ever develop an elite program with this type of fan support. The elite programs fill it up for every game. Unfortunately, the team intensity matched the crowd.
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Still Football Season my man!!! Sorry...
 
#158
#158
MikeHamiltonFan said:
Calisking,

Most UT fans would agree with you that UT is a far far reach from Elite Status. For the first time in the history of our school if 2011 is as strong as 2010, we will have reached Elite recruiting, to go with Elite attendance. We are paying top 20 salary, and we are expecting better than top 20 results. If Bruce Pearl gets 1 Final Four and 1 Elite 8 in the next few years we will be happy.

The reason people here do not respect Billy D is not just that we keep beating them, it is that we would be furious if our coach won a N.C. much less two and then quit making the tournament. We share some of the flaws of KY fans, we grow accustomed to a baseline. The baseline now is 2 wins in the NCAA tournament but we want more! If we get an Elite 8 we will be clamoring for a Final 4, if we get that there will be clamoring for a NC. It is a beast that cannot be fed, and if we get results that mean that we are one of the top 10-16 teams in the country year after year, Bruce Pearl will be stunned at how unacceptable that is to a fanbase that has no history to justify an expectation of more.
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How do you not respect a coach who has played for 3 total NC and won 2 of them in 9 year span? That's a deep run every 3 years. What more would a non blue blood program want?
 
#159
#159
CALISKING said:
How do you not respect a coach who has played for 3 total NC and won 2 of them in 9 year span? That's a deep run every 3 years. What more would a non blue blood program want?
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Steve Fisher played for 3 National Titles in 5 years. Don't see people deifying him.
 
#160
#160
CALISKING said:
How do you not respect a coach who has played for 3 total NC and won 2 of them in 9 year span? That's a deep run every 3 years. What more would a non blue blood program want?
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I used to disagree with those criticizing Donovan, but he hasn't been impressive in following up his title seasons.
 
#161
#161
This.

IndubitablyOrange said:
Consider the context of last night for students:

Finals begin the next day (now today)
Semester projects and papers are soon due
Students value keeping scholarships and staying in school over watching UT v ETSU live when they can have it on in their dorm or apartment.

Unless you have solid attendance stats for "elite" programs showing full attendance regardless of time of year and opponent, I think there are legit reasons for the lack of students last night.

We have the second largest arena in college basketball, when students are not there it is much easier to notice.
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#162
#162
If you would have told me back in the Buzz days that the new coach would have UT being a consistent top 10 team, achieving a #1 ranking, winning the SEC and reaching the Sweet 16 a couple of times, I wouldnt have believed it. Some of you youngsters dont even see the TREMENDOUS strides and successes we have already had under Bruce Pearl. He is the best thing that has happened to the program since Bernard King.
 
#163
#163
CALISKING said:
I would say a Final Four trip every 5 years would trump a "season by season" of success. The fact is, over the last 20 years only 2 programs have won more National Titles, and only 4 have been to more Final Fours. Last time I checked, Final Fours and NC are the barometer of ultimate success for a basketball season.

I realize that your being a UT basketball fan, you believe that somehow UT's recent run of Sweet 16s, Conference Championships, and head to head record against Florida, somehow trumps the Gators accomplishments. If the argument is the Gators are not one of the Elite programs of the last 20 years because they've been to "ONLY" 4 Final Fours, then your own criteria deems Volunteer basketball as irrelevant nationally and a far, far reach from evening sniffing Elite status.
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You somehow want to make your argument by talking about UT being an elite program. That was not part of the discussion about Florida. We all agree that UT is not an elite program---hopefully some day. I think most of the entire world would not consider Florida as one of the elite basketball programs for the past 20 years. Not even making the tournament for the past two seasons says enough about elite status. I didn't even make a comment about Pearl owning Donavan even when he was winning championships because that does not make UT an elite program.
 
#164
#164
We will be an elite program after we put together more 20+ win seasons. Doing it for 5 straight years won't make you an elite program, it just puts you on the map. You must build on that to be an elite program. Tennessee fans (and I'm a TN fan) are so impatient.
 
#165
#165
n2motorsports said:
We will be an elite program after we put together more 20+ win seasons. Doing it for 5 straight years won't make you an elite program, it just puts you on the map. You must build on that to be an elite program. Tennessee fans (and I'm a TN fan) are so impatient.
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20+ win seasons doesn't make you elite. You have to have success in the post season to reach elite status. That has escaped us so far.
 
#167
#167
DaytonLawVol said:
He is the best thing that has happened to the program since Bernard King.
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That's almost like saying the crap I took today was better than the crap I took the other day. Doesn't change the fact that Pearl has had about the same success in March that Jerry Green had.
 
#168
#168
SGMVols said:
That's almost like saying the crap I took today was better than the crap I took the other day. Doesn't change the fact that Pearl has had about the same success in March that Jerry Green had.
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Bruce Pearl has had equal or better success than Jerry Green in each year he has been coach compared to each year Green was coach. And oh yeah, theres that Conference Championship thing and a 190-76 record compared to Green's 161-106 record. When did you start watching Tennessee basketball? 2006? Who the hell do you think we are all of a sudden, UCLA?
 
#169
#169
DaytonLawVol said:
Bruce Pearl has had equal or better success than Jerry Green in each year he has been coach compared to each year Green was coach. And oh yeah, theres that Conference Championship thing and a 190-76 record compared to Green's 161-106 record. When did you start watching Tennessee basketball? 2006? Who the hell do you think we are all of a sudden, UCLA?
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I think most of us think Pearl is better than Green, but to date, Green accomplished the same feats that Pearl has accomplished. Green won an SEC championship and went to a Sweet 16.
 
#170
#170
DaytonLawVol said:
Bruce Pearl has had equal or better success than Jerry Green in each year he has been coach compared to each year Green was coach. And oh yeah, theres that Conference Championship thing and a 190-76 record compared to Green's 161-106 record. When did you start watching Tennessee basketball? 2006? Who the hell do you think we are all of a sudden, UCLA?
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I never said anything about regular season. I said that IN MARCH (you know, the games that matter most) the two are about equal.
 
#171
#171
kiffinator13 said:
I think most of us think Pearl is better than Green, but to date, Green accomplished the same feats that Pearl has accomplished. Green won an SEC championship and went to a Sweet 16.
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But Green never got us a #1 ranking for 24 hours! :crazy:
 
#172
#172
DaytonLawVol said:
Bruce Pearl has had equal or better success than Jerry Green in each year he has been coach compared to each year Green was coach. And oh yeah, theres that Conference Championship thing and a 190-76 record compared to Green's 161-106 record. When did you start watching Tennessee basketball? 2006? Who the hell do you think we are all of a sudden, UCLA?
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The relativist argument is really weak justification for inability to win big games.
 
#173
#173
BigPapaVol said:
The relativist argument is really weak justification for inability to win big games.
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"Bruce Pearl: He's Better Than A Bunch Of Guys We Fired." For some strange reason, I don't think the marketing staff is going to build an ad blitz around that.
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#175
#175
Bruce Pearl, he is better than any Tennessee mens basketball coach in the lifetime of the people on here who do not cry about him all day and long for slow ball BK style.
 
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