Swains thoughts on 3 P's eligibility

[RiseToTheTop]

So, let me get this straight. You would rather have a person that is known to punch a woman repeatedly in the face in front of a group of people play for your team than be a little short at a position? Are you serious?

i didnt say that. i just said we better do something bc our RB depth is a joke. You cant get by on 2.

 

[joevol33]

Thanks for the info .... listen to Swain every morning but I missed this because he said it before I got in the car. Can't believe Pig has put himself I this spot again...ugh.

Pig is one of my favorites. I hope he's able to take care of things.

 

[butchna]

Mixon is a 5 star Paulk is a 3 star. If Paulk was an elite back not coming off a knee injury would he already be back on the team?

No...I think Butch has been pretty clear on that.

 

[KBVol]

Yes we are hurting at RB. Even if Hurd and Kamara can stay healthy we need someone to take the garbage carries. Bruce still says he's a RB so we would have Kelly and Bruce as long as they can learn the offense. Personally I really wanted to see what Evan Berry could do in the backfield until he really turned it up on defense.

Agree with all this...Hurd, Kamara, Kelly, Bruce...maybe RDV and/or Perry as well. That's not bad, though most of the depth is awfully young. Also, I was pining to see Evan at RB as well, until it became evident they just want him at safety because of how well he played this Spring. At least we get to see him tote the rock on KO returns.

 

[AboveAllNations]

Paulk has not been doing anything "on his own dime." He was dismissed from the team, but not from school, so the athletic scholarship he signed was still valid for the entire school year. He is still on scholarship and will be until the end of this semester.

If he wants to stay at that point, he will have to pay his own way. There is a scholarship available, we're at 84 if everyone qualifies, but I have heard nothing along the line of him being allowed to return.

As I said in another thread, this whole "he was cleared of charges" thing is BS. He was "cleared" because the victim did not press charges. That does not change the fact that he punched his then girlfriend in the face and had to be pulled off of her after striking her again and and again in front of a group of 20 people, most of whom are current student-athletes. They all gave statements to UT officials.

That's why Butch didn't wait for things to "play out" in this situation. He had no interest in whether Paulk was charged, he knew what happened from eyewitnesses.

The standard for playing football at Tennessee is higher than the legal system's standard, as it should be. It is a privilege, not a right.

I agree with you that Treyvon Paulk shouldn't be brought back onto the team, especially at a time when we have three other players still accused of rape. Unfortunately, Butch Jones never made it clear that he was dismissing Paulk permanently. Instead, Jones said in February that Paulk's status with the team is an "ongoing process," which now looks like more of a football decision than anything having to do with Treyvon Paulk's behavior or contrition. If you believe Swain, the only reason we're still stringing him along is because we're so thin at runningback. That's incredibly cynical for a program already receiving so much bad publicity for player misconduct.

At this point, the only thing that can save us face is if Paulk gets into trouble again. If he stays out of trouble, it'll look bad whether we take him back or not.

 

[RiseToTheTop]

I agree with you that Treyvon Paulk shouldn't be brought back onto the team, especially at a time when we have three other players still accused of rape. Unfortunately, Butch Jones never made it clear that he was dismissing Paulk permanently. Instead, Jones said in February that Paulk's status with the team is an "ongoing process," which now looks like more of a football decision than anything having to do with Treyvon Paulk's behavior or contrition. If you believe Swain, the only reason we're still stringing him along is because we're so thin at runningback. That's incredibly cynical for a program already receiving so much bad publicity for player misconduct.

At this point, the only thing that can save us face is if Paulk gets into trouble again. If he stays out of trouble, it'll look bad whether we take him back or not.

it happened in september and 6 months later Jones is saying its an ongoing process. Doesnt sound like a coach who is dead set on getting rid of a guy.

 

[volroadwarrior]

I agree with you that Treyvon Paulk shouldn't be brought back onto the team, especially at a time when we have three other players still accused of rape. Unfortunately, Butch Jones never made it clear that he was dismissing Paulk permanently. Instead, Jones said in February that Paulk's status with the team is an "ongoing process," which now looks like more of a football decision than anything having to do with Treyvon Paulk's behavior or contrition. If you believe Swain, the only reason we're still stringing him along is because we're so thin at runningback. That's incredibly cynical for a program already receiving so much bad publicity for player misconduct.

At this point, the only thing that can save us face is if Paulk gets into trouble again. If he stays out of trouble, it'll look bad whether we take him back or not

Using this logic: TAKE HIM BACK!!!!!!! What do we have to lose. The do gooders and holier than thou crowd are going to complain anyway. Hitting a woman is an assault and should be punished if it happened. Is kicking him off the team the right punishment? Or, should it be jail time? If it were serious enough he would be in jail and he is not.

 

[walkenvol]

Paulk has not been doing anything "on his own dime." He was dismissed from the team, but not from school, so the athletic scholarship he signed was still valid for the entire school year. He is still on scholarship and will be until the end of this semester.

If he wants to stay at that point, he will have to pay his own way. There is a scholarship available, we're at 84 if everyone qualifies, but I have heard nothing along the line of him being allowed to return.

As I said in another thread, this whole "he was cleared of charges" thing is BS. He was "cleared" because the victim did not press charges. That does not change the fact that he punched his then girlfriend in the face and had to be pulled off of her after striking her again and and again in front of a group of 20 people, most of whom are current student-athletes. They all gave statements to UT officials.

That's why Butch didn't wait for things to "play out" in this situation. He had no interest in whether Paulk was charged, he knew what happened from eyewitnesses.

The standard for playing football at Tennessee is higher than the legal system's standard, as it should be. It is a privilege, not a right.

If what you're saying is true, then the next thing we hear of Paulk should be which school he ends up at next. Odd however that all these folks continue to comment on his potential return...time will tell.

 

[walkenvol]

I agree with you that Treyvon Paulk shouldn't be brought back onto the team, especially at a time when we have three other players still accused of rape. Unfortunately, Butch Jones never made it clear that he was dismissing Paulk permanently. Instead, Jones said in February that Paulk's status with the team is an "ongoing process," which now looks like more of a football decision than anything having to do with Treyvon Paulk's behavior or contrition. If you believe Swain, the only reason we're still stringing him along is because we're so thin at runningback. That's incredibly cynical for a program already receiving so much bad publicity for player misconduct.

At this point, the only thing that can save us face is if Paulk gets into trouble again. If he stays out of trouble, it'll look bad whether we take him back or not.

So in your opinion, if a player is accused of assualt but never prosecuted then he should be permanently kicked out of the program? Sounds as if you want to be sexist and make it only accused assalt against a female though? What if it was against an alternative sexed individual? Appears to be a case of sliding ethics to me.

We had a accused/reformed sex offender on our team in 2010-14 who never caused any embarassment to the program. Who's to say Paulk's not reformed if indeed he was guilty in the first place as you assume since he was never arrested nor convicted?

I'd prefer to allow the coach to use his judgement concerning removing players from the team. IMO, TIFWIW, PETA

 

[armchair]

Is Paulk getting anger-management counseling or somesuch--is that part of the plan?

To say that we need Howard to get his academic act together is an understatement--he is crucial to UT's offense.

 

[08Vol]

Saw Pig this morning in Haslam, so at least we know he's trying.

Pig didn't come here to play school. It sounds like he isn't as interested in his class work as some of our other players, which makes sense since he has NFL written all over him.
As a student I didn't have to take science classes past my soph year bc my major was in the college of business. Pig's major is in football, professors should allow him, and all athletes wanting to go pro, some leniency on his classes

 

[UT_Dutchman]

So in your opinion, if a player is accused of assualt but never prosecuted then he should be permanently kicked out of the program? Sounds as if you want to be sexist and make it only accused assalt against a female though? What if it was against an alternative sexed individual? Appears to be a case of sliding ethics to me.

We had a accused/reformed sex offender on our team in 2010-14 who never caused any embarassment to the program. Who's to say Paulk's not reformed if indeed he was guilty in the first place as you assume since he was never arrested nor convicted?

I'd prefer to allow the coach to use his judgement concerning removing players from the team. IMO, TIFWIW, PETA

He was 12 years old when that incident occurred, I'm not condoning that kind of behavior, but he is not listed as a sex offender so that is bs you go call him one.

 

[KBVol]

Is Paulk getting anger-management counseling or somesuch--is that part of the plan?

To say that we need Howard to get his academic act together is an understatement--he is crucial to UT's offense.

Exactly how stupid is Pig Howard? Kid screws up last Spring semester, is away from the team, is invited back only after proving to the player's council and coaches that he is committed to the team, to his academics....then winds up being praised to the hilt, and rightfully so, after getting his ish together, having a great summer, fall camp and season. Despite his size, he's generally regarded as our best and most important WR, even to the point that many are now wondering if he might just get drafted in 2016 if he has another productive season in 2015....all that hard work and dedication....all that going for him....and now he may not be academically eligible?!? What. The. F??

 

[utvolpj]

Pig didn't come here to play school. It sounds like he isn't as interested in his class work as some of our other players, which makes sense since he has NFL written all over him.
As a student I didn't have to take science classes past my soph year bc my major was in the college of business. Pig's major is in football, professors should allow him, and all athletes wanting to go pro, some leniency on his classes

He blows his knee out and that football major won't be much use. Going to class is no different than attending practice and team meetings. It's a requirement to play ball

 

[AboveAllNations]

Hitting a woman is an assault and should be punished if it happened. Is kicking him off the team the right punishment? Or, should it be jail time? If it were serious enough he would be in jail and he is not.

So in your opinion, if a player is accused of assualt but never prosecuted then he should be permanently kicked out of the program?

Just because somebody isn't convicted or prosecuted of a crime doesn't mean they didn't do it. O.J. Simpson and Casey Anthony were acquitted of murder charges; would you feel comfortable hiring them to babysit your kids? Would you be violating their rights if you refused to hire them? Of course not.

Paulk apparently hit a woman repeatedly in front of a dozen witnesses and got lucky when the victim declined to press charges. However, as Deerpark12 pointed out, playing football at Tennessee is a privilege, not a right. Butch Jones is entitled to draw his own conclusions about what happened and, with the information available to him, he should have kicked Paulk permanently off the team. Unlike the situations involving Pearson or A.J. (who may or may not be legally and/or morally innocent), there doesn't appear to be any ambiguity about what Paulk did.

Sounds as if you want to be sexist and make it only accused assalt against a female though? What if it was against an alternative sexed individual? Appears to be a case of sliding ethics to me.

Yes, a football player committing violence against women is more serious than a fight between men or victimless "crimes" like underage drinking or marijuana use (wasn't that what got Da'Rick Rogers kicked off the team?). I'm all for leniency and second chances with respect to those less serious offenses, but it should be obvious at this point that college and pro football need to be more serious about combatting domestic violence.

Who's to say Paulk's not reformed if indeed he was guilty in the first place as you assume since he was never arrested nor convicted?

A suspension amounting to a redshirt year isn't a sufficiently serious punishment. Even if Paulk is genuinely sorry and reformed, he and every other domestic abuser need to be expelled to serve as a deterrent for everybody else (both on and off the team) that domestic abuse isn't acceptable. He can get a "second chance" on some other team.

 

[ItsAllVols]

I thought Micah Abernathy brother was taking his last year of eligibility from Cincinnati and coming here, or did something change?

 

[RiseToTheTop]

I thought Micah Abernathy brother was taking his last year of eligibility from Cincinnati and coming here, or did something change?

he is.....slot WR/RB. very good in space.

 

[Crazy Ivan]

Pig is one of my favorites. I hope he's able to take care of things.

Not only a VN favorite, Pig was also our leading receiver last season by far, both in total catches and total yardage, so not having him available next season would be a blow. Especially if VP is not able to return. Those are our 2 top slot receivers.

 

[walkenvol]

Just because somebody isn't convicted or prosecuted of a crime doesn't mean they didn't do it. O.J. Simpson and Casey Anthony were acquitted of murder charges; would you feel comfortable hiring them to babysit your kids? Would you be violating their rights if you refused to hire them? Of course not..

The thing we agree on here is I can decide whether or not to hire them vs Volnation or some other group make that decision for me.

playing football at Tennessee is a privilege, not a right. Butch Jones is entitled to draw his own conclusions about what happened and, with the information available to him, .

Once again we agree on this point, CBJ is the coach and knows the players and the facts better than anyone. We need to allow him to make these decision vs Volnation or some other group making the rules for him. We already have the NCAA, the government, and the university's rules in place.

Yes, a football player committing violence against women is more serious than a fight between men.

You're showing your true colors here as you don't believe in equality between the sexes. You view women as always being weak and requiring protection. Guess what, there aren't many males on the UT campus who could hold their own with most of these football players if the player decided to slap them around. How is it any worse of an assault based on what's in their jeans?

CBJ is ultimately responsible for the UT football program. If he allows a bunch of thugs to remain in the program it will eventually cost him his job. I think I will trust him to make the best call on who should stay and who should go instead of some politically correct do gooder group who wants to impose their ideas on everyone else. CBJ's been doing a pretty good job of it so far. :good!:

 

[whobethis16]

Pig didn't come here to play school. It sounds like he isn't as interested in his class work as some of our other players, which makes sense since he has NFL written all over him.
As a student I didn't have to take science classes past my soph year bc my major was in the college of business. Pig's major is in football, professors should allow him, and all athletes wanting to go pro, some leniency on his classes

Then he doesn't deserve a scholarship to get free education, dorm room, food, etc. That's the deal. Don't like it, tough.

 

[drylo]

Just because somebody isn't convicted or prosecuted of a crime doesn't mean they didn't do it. O.J. Simpson and Casey Anthony were acquitted of murder charges; would you feel comfortable hiring them to babysit your kids? Would you be violating their rights if you refused to hire them? Of course not.

Paulk apparently hit a woman repeatedly in front of a dozen witnesses and got lucky when the victim declined to press charges. However, as Deerpark12 pointed out, playing football at Tennessee is a privilege, not a right. Butch Jones is entitled to draw his own conclusions about what happened and, with the information available to him, he should have kicked Paulk permanently off the team. Unlike the situations involving Pearson or A.J. (who may or may not be legally and/or morally innocent), there doesn't appear to be any ambiguity about what Paulk did.



Yes, a football player committing violence against women is more serious than a fight between men or victimless "crimes" like underage drinking or marijuana use (wasn't that what got Da'Rick Rogers kicked off the team?). I'm all for leniency and second chances with respect to those less serious offenses, but it should be obvious at this point that college and pro football need to be more serious about combatting domestic violence.



A suspension amounting to a redshirt year isn't a sufficiently serious punishment. Even if Paulk is genuinely sorry and reformed, he and every other domestic abuser need to be expelled to serve as a deterrent for everybody else (both on and off the team) that domestic abuse isn't acceptable. He can get a "second chance" on some other team.

Didn't she attack Paulk or something? I feel like I remember something about no charges for Paulk because she wasn't exactly an innocent victim of a violent outburst by Paulk.

 

[ItsAllVols]

Didn't she attack Paulk or something? I feel like I remember something about no charges for Paulk because she wasn't exactly an innocent victim of a violent outburst by Paulk.

Paulk had one issue that he couldn't escape, EYE witness that was on the team saw the whole thing...I believe.

 

[wmcovol]

I don't hit women, never have but I don't think its a crime to the point that it should ruin any chance someone has to educate themselves or pursue their lifelong dream. We all make mistakes and most believe in second chances but many don't in this case. I do.

I do believe that any crime, misdeed, etc should be punished and the punishment, whatever it is, served BEFORE they are allowed to move forward with their life. But they should be allowed to move on AFTER THAT.

I hope that the young man can pursue his dream at some point, one year is enough for me.

 

[HoptownVol]

I think the charges were dropped because the person did not press charges however fairly certain he did punch a female in the mouth if I remember the story correctly, it was a while back. So just because he did not get in trouble with the law he still punched a female in the mouth.

Doesnt matter if an individual presses charges or not, the DA will pick up these cases and prosecute them
if they believe they have a case, regardless of the "victim's" wishes.

 

[Remy]

Hurd's already dealt with 3 injuries since committing to Tennessee 2 years ago .... shoulder his senior year at Beech, concussion that led to him being pulled out of Vandy game and then shoulder injury that led to him being held out of contact this Spring. I agree with you that he's been injury prone to this point.

Folks, he showed up for every game as a freshman in the SEC and ended up carrying the bulk of the running load before midpoint in the season including the bowl game. Injury prone is not physically able to answer the bell during the season(s). Hurd answered every bell on our 2013 schedule with a very suspect OL, therefore per my standard was very far removed from being classified as injury prone.