19 students, 3 adults dead in Texas elementary shooting.

[05_never_again]

GOP: lone wolf shoots up school and kill 20 people it's a question ofnindividual responsibility by the shooter.

Also GOP: black gang member shoots rival gange member, this is systemic and has to do with absentee fathers and judges not being hard enough on criminals.

I've actually heard plenty of conservatives talk about the broken home the shooter (and lots of these shooters) came from as a reason for the shooting. Not sure what you're referring to. That has been a conservative talking point for years.

 

[luthervol]

There isn't a gun issue. You keep ignoring the fact that not to long ago guns were easier to obtain and we didn't have these problems. That simple fact by-itself debunks you're whole "it's a gun problem" argument.

No it doesn't debunk anything. Society may have changed from a point when guns were not much of an issue to a point when guns are very much an issue. Just because something wasn't an issue 70 years ago in no way mean that it can not be an issue today.

 

[hog88]

No it doesn't debunk anything. Society may have changed from a point when guns were not much of an issue to a point when guns are very much an issue. Just because something wasn't an issue 70 years ago in no way mean that it can not be an issue today.

Then we need to focus on what's changed in society and work to fix that.

 

[Lawrence Wright]

This is some next level incompetence on the part of Uvalde’s police department.

 

[NorthDallas40]

When did you get a talkshow @NorthDallas40 ?

So much illogical estrogen laden rage in one insignificant person tsk tsk

 

[BowlBrother85]

"American gun culture" has its roots in the founding of the country and particularly in Manifest Destiny, a concept which is almost 200 years old. Trying to effect or change the gun culture would be harder than convincing southerners they should stop watching college football.

Guns have been everywhere in the United States, and relatively easy to get, for a very long time. Certainly longer than regular school shootings have taken place. I am not sure ease of access has much to do at all with the regularity of these shootings, because that variable existed when these things did not occur regularly, so I'm not sure that making them more difficult to legally obtain would prevent or reduce them.

Nothing happens in a vacuum. The problem of spree shootings can't be analyzed by just isolating one factor by itself. This is a toxic brew of many factors working in conjunction with each other over the course of the last 230 years. Prevalence and ease of access are a small part of it, but it would do no good to isolate those variables for restriction, while holding everything else constant.

Outside of fortifying schools as much as possible, I'm not sure what can be done at this point. Gun violence is too ingrained in American culture.

 

[85SugarVol]

.
If they could have done a better job, okay, that may be the case.


It's an irrelevant distractionary technique by you to the gun issue.

What gun problem? There is no gun problem.

 

[hog88]

What gun problem? There is no gun problem.

There is a gun problem. They are too damn expensive.

 

[luthervol]

I am shocked anytime a government agency accepts responsibility. Was their admission without equivocation?

Pretty much. He did say in hindsight a couple of times.

 

[85SugarVol]

No, men like you don’t need a keyboard. But then again, my guess is that’s where your courage comes from

Dude. It’s an anonymous internet message board. There a no tuff guys here, except you.

 

[NorthDallas40]

There is a gun problem. They are too damn expensive.

I have more of an ammo problem.

 

[evillawyer]

Definitely a door problem and too little prayer.

 

[hog88]

I have more of an ammo problem.

That too

 

[hog88]

Definitely a door problem and too little prayer.

Guy had some serious cash. I don't think you can buy ammo on credit.

 

[luthervol]

When did you get a talkshow @NorthDallas40 ?

Everyone carrying a mini nuke is the natural extension of the gun nuts' stance.
Hog and this guy are the only two I've seen willing to claim that they accept that natural extension.

 

[VolStrom]

There is a gun problem. They are too damn expensive.

It's a democratic plan to make guns, ammo and fuel prices too high for conservatives to afford, therefor they get their way without passing actual laws.

 

[evillawyer]

Everyone carrying a mini nuke is the natural extension of the gun nuts' stance.
Hog and this guy are the only two I've seen willing to claim that accept that natural extension.

Oh, @NorthDallas40 is of that view as well.

 

[luthervol]

Then we need to focus on what's changed in society and work to fix that.

Plenty has changed in society. I'm willing to discuss and focus on any of those.

 

[Wireless1]

UPDATE: Synopsis of Press Conference

School Shooting Press Conference: 11:31 patrol car drives by funeral home. 11:33 suspect enters school and begins shooting 100 rounds into room 111 and 112. 11:35 - 3 police officers enter school followed by 3 more and a sheriff (7 officers). Went to door and received wounds from suspect. 11:37 more gunfire; 11:51 - US Border Patrol agents arrive; 12:03 officers continue to arrive in hallway (19 offices in hallway; 12:15 BORTAC officers arrive with shields / 12:21 - suspect fired again from door; 12:21 law enforcement moved down hallway; 12:50 - law enforcement used keys from janitor and killed suspect.

UPDATE
Additional information - 58 total magazines at the crime scene; 11 inside the school; 3 on the suspects body; 2 in room 112; 6 inside room 111; 5 were on the ground; 1 was in the rifle; 32 magazines outside the school (31 in suspects backpack that he did not take inside classroom/1 just outside school building); 15 magazines at the crash site; 2 magazines at suspect's residence for a total count of 60 magazines. He purchased 1,657 total rounds of ammunition. 315 rounds inside the school; 142 rounds were spent cartridges; 173 were live rounds; 923 were outside the school; 22 spent cartridges outside the school; 900 (outside) were live rounds; 422 rounds at crash site; 22 were spent cartridges; 420 were live rounds; 35 total law enforcement spent cartridges in the school; 8 in hallway; 27 in classroom where suspect was killed;

Suspect posted on Facebook Messenger not on Facebook.

September 2021 - asked sister to help him buy a gun; she refused

February 28, 2022 - Instagram: group chat discussed about him being a school shooter

March 1, 2022 - Instagram chat with 4 people - discussed him buying a gun

March 3, 2022 - Instagram chat with 4 people - "Word on street is you're buying a gun." Ramos: "Just bought something. RN"

March 14, 2022 - Instagram posting "10 more days" User replied "Are you going to shoot up a school or something?" Ramos: "No. Stop asking dumb questions and you'll see."

With the words "***** ** * School" how was this not flagged by Instagram (I omitted the words so I'm not flagged) and this not investigated?

 

[85SugarVol]

No it doesn't debunk anything. Society may have changed from a point when guns were not much of an issue to a point when guns are very much an issue. Just because something wasn't an issue 70 years ago in no way mean that it can not be an issue today.

Switching gears here a little.

In your personal opinion - Should it be easier to vote in America than it is to purchase a firearm in America?

 

[BowlBrother85]

Presser: Shooter went into unlocked door left propped open by teacher. Spokesman admitted it was the wrong decision not to breach the classroom door. Kids were calling 911 and the local police chief was outside the building and made the decision to not to breach the classroom door.

Police Chief made the decision it wasn’t an active shooter situation despite kids calling 911 and they could hear that 9 were still alive. It appears that the information was not relayed to police on the scene.

That's an epic level incompetence.

 

[luthervol]

Switching gears here a little.

In your personal opinion - Should it be easier to vote in America than it is to purchase a firearm in America?

Absolutely

 

[hog88]

Plenty has changed in society. I'm willing to discuss and focus on any of those.

You haven't as of yet and you have had ample opportunity.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Oh, @NorthDallas40 is of that view as well.

Should be able to buy whatever you can afford and have your eyes on! Why mini nuke if you’ve got the coin the shell out for a hydrogen bomb!

 

[luthervol]

You haven't as of yet and you have had ample opportunity.

That's just ridiculous.