2024 Presidential Race

#45,026
#45,026
OrangeTsar said:
There is no “free market” right now anyway.
All tax policy is designed to manipulate market behavior: but if you would be willing to replace our Byzantine tax laws with a simple flat percentage tax of businesses and individuals to do away with such manipulation; I am 100 💯 on board then.
Deal?
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Pretty sure I've said plenty about our tax system. I'm just not willing to go further away from a free market simply because some want to ignore economics in order to punish a foreign county
 
#45,027
#45,027
n_huffhines said:
Then say that. You go the extra mile to give just one side the benefit of the doubt*. It's a lie. He told you it's OK to lie. He's lying now. It's not a mountain to call it out. Most people come here to call out lies. Some people defend them. I'm the first group.

*Remember when you argued Trump said "there are" vs. "they are" so you could defend his bigotry on a technicality. Turns out he's an outright bigot, talking about deporting 20k legal immigrants to the wrong country over fake news.
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No, I don't remember that at all.
 
#45,029
#45,029
China is currently engaged in blatant theft of intellectual property and trade secrets and is not even pretending to meet their agreed upon US import targets. Bis don’t give me the bogus “free trade” argument if we dare suggest penalizing them with tariffs. They are not exactly a trade partner acting in good faith.
And never EVER forget that they are the nation that crashed the world economy with their dangerously insane bio weapons research and pathetic safeguards on their labs. I have absolutely ZERO desire to reward them with cushy one way trade deals.
 
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#45,032
#45,032
OrangeTsar said:
If the alternative to tariffs was a true free market then maybe you are correct. But when other nations take advantage of US political stupidity and don’t hold up their end of trade agreements, we do not actually have free trade. This forces our international competitors to either play fair or else to bow out of the game.
The US corporate economy is ruled by large multinationals that are in bed with both political parties to the detriment of American workers. Trump/Vance are the only leaders really trying to change that. Which is why a Republican (of all people) is actually going to capture the Union vote
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Im not anti tarrif, especially for a manipulative country like China but that's not what we are talking about here. We are talking about an administration that is proposing to use punitive tarrifs against only 1 company in an industry who wants to produce overseas when that company's competitors produce overseas. That type of selective power dramatically increases power of govt.

If Kamala put a 200% not woke enough tax only on SEC football, there would be an outcry here
 
#45,034
#45,034
utvolpj said:
Pretty sure I've said plenty about our tax system. I'm just not willing to go further away from a free market simply because some want to ignore economics in order to punish a foreign county
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China is not just a “foreign country”. They are our economic adversary and they unleashed (wether accidentally or on purpose) a bioweapon that killed probably 10s of millions worldwide and tanked the entire world economy.
If there is one nation on God’s green earth that deserves “punishment”‘you are looking at them.
 
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#45,035
#45,035
BigOrangeMojo said:
Im not anti tarrif, especially for a manipulative country like China but that's not what we are talking about here. We are talking about an administration that is proposing to use punitive tarrifs against only 1 company in an industry who wants to produce overseas when that company's competitors produce overseas. That type of selective power dramatically increases power of govt.

If Kamala put a 200% not woke enough tax only on SEC football, there would be an outcry here
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Ag, I see your point. I thought we were talking about China. In terms of John Deere, I would be happy if their customers simply deserted them without tariffs.
And be careful talking about Kamala and SEC football taxes. You might just give her another looney idea 😉
 
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#45,037
#45,037
InVOLuntary said:
So you agree it's not a level playing field?
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How many answers do you need? I'm still not in favor of the govt artificially manipulating markets with the tariffs at the expense of consumers. Health and welfare is a different issue

If you want to get picky it's different from city to city in this country.
 
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#45,038
#45,038
OrangeTsar said:
China is not just a “foreign country”. They are our economic adversary and they unleashed (wether accidentally or on purpose) a bioweapon that killed probably 10s of millions worldwide and tanked the entire world economy.
If there is one nation on God’s green earth that deserves “punishment”‘you are looking at them.
Click to expand...
And you're willing to hit the already struggling US consumer at the same time?
 
#45,039
#45,039
BigOrangeMojo said:
Im not anti tarrif, especially for a manipulative country like China but that's not what we are talking about here. We are talking about an administration that is proposing to use punitive tarrifs against only 1 company in an industry who wants to produce overseas when that company's competitors produce overseas. That type of selective power dramatically increases power of govt.

If Kamala put a 200% not woke enough tax only on SEC football, there would be an outcry here
Click to expand...

Please be 100% anti-tariff.
 
#45,041
#45,041
OrangeTsar said:
If the alternative to tariffs was a true free market then maybe you are correct. But when other nations take advantage of US political stupidity and don’t hold up their end of trade agreements, we do not actually have free trade. This forces our international competitors to either play fair or else to bow out of the game.
The US corporate economy is ruled by large multinationals that are in bed with both political parties to the detriment of American workers. Trump/Vance are the only leaders really trying to change that. Which is why a Republican (of all people) is actually going to capture the Union vote
Click to expand...

If you're practicing free trade, then there are no trade agreements.

Where are you actually seeing this work? Forces them to play fair? We got all kinds of tariffs on China. You think they're being fair?

There will never, ever be a scenario that exists where we think every other country is practicing fair trade. Regardless, the overwhelming consensus by economists is that we are hurting ourselves with protectionism.
 
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