Anti-Trump Hysteria and Silliness

[RavinDave]

ooga booga…...

Thanks '72, I needed a good laugh. Particularly after perusing the "911 Conspiracy" thread for the first time...

 

[C-south]

I appreciate you taking the time to explain this. I had honestly never given much thought to it besides a cursory explanation of some millennial nonsense.

I thought about this from a lot of angles today, and I have to say it’s one of the dumbest concepts I’ve pondered in quite some time. It makes no sense and I feel sorry for anyone who has this line of thought forced upon them.

What kind of worldview must one hold to buy into this gender nonsense? A person just declares they are what they feel like? Might it change over time? Doesn’t that invalidate research such as the gender pay gap? Even the meanings are different across cultures?

It sounds like the end goal is to make gender definitions meaningless. I truly feel sorry for any young person who has had this taught to them. There’s really no excuse for adults who have bought into these gender views.

Anyone who believes in a gender “spectrum” falls into another spectrum themselves.

 

[Carl Pickens]

I just let it fester and ferment until it becomes a source of personal amusement.

They call you baboon at work?

 

[NorthDallas40]

Biologically, yes. Otherwise, who cares?

Biologically is all that existed until this made up damn term “gender” from the 1950’s came along and needlessly screwed things up.

 

[RavinDave]

You missed my point. I already agreed with Reb that biologically there are two sexes, minus the rare occurrence. Gender is a social construct. How someone identifies is none of my business or concern.

Seems to me that, before gender-bending became a thing with the progressives - hermaphrodites and other such freaks of nature excluded - gender was basically an "either/or" proposition...

 

[zeppelin128]

I appreciate you taking the time to explain this. I had honestly never given much thought to it besides a cursory explanation of some millennial nonsense.

I thought about this from a lot of angles today, and I have to say it’s one of the dumbest concepts I’ve pondered in quite some time. It makes no sense and I feel sorry for anyone who has this line of thought forced upon them.

What kind of worldview must one hold to buy into this gender nonsense? A person just declares they are what they feel like? Might it change over time? Doesn’t that invalidate research such as the gender pay gap? Even the meanings are different across cultures?

It sounds like the end goal is to make gender definitions meaningless. I truly feel sorry for any young person who has had this taught to them. There’s really no excuse for adults who have bought into these gender views.

No problem, it was a nice discussion among several posters in this thread today. Thanks for not just throwing out insults.
I never expected to change anyone's mind, it is a tricky subject. I came to my line of thinking over several years, both during and after university.
In short, how someone identifies their gender is up to them. And I think it can change over time. That doesn't change their biological sex. Until we reach a point where DNA manipulation allows for removal of X and Y chromosomes, it is what it is. It doesn't invalidate the gender pay gap. But that is a totally different tangent.
As far as gender constructs being different across cultures, the classic example is handholding. In many cultures, handholding among adult men is common. They would not consider that an "unmanly" thing to do. In the US and most Western cultures, that would be considered "feminine" and generally a social taboo outside of the gay community. Neither culture is correct or incorrect. It just is what it is.
I don't think the end goal is to make gender constructs meaningless. The end goal is equality, for men, women, and LGBTQ. It is an idealistic thought that will probably never happen, but it is just my opinion.
Anyways, good discussion.

 

[zeppelin128]

Biologically is all that existed until this made up damn term “gender” from the 1950’s came along and needlessly screwed things up.

Damn baby boomers.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Time to change the knuckle bandages.

The wrench slip?

when? No idea. I kind of observed it over time....maybe 40 years ago or so.
I', the norm from which all others are measured.
My man card is validated. Married, 3 kids, sports, 15+ years coaching, etc....
But I also think, feel and have empathy.

You're proposing that a person can't believe in two genders, see body dysphoria as a mental illness and also have empathy for the person that suffers with it? You think I can't have empathy for my niece with anorexia?

Don't trip. There's a curb behind you.

 

[DC_Vol]

No problem, it was a nice discussion among several posters in this thread today. Thanks for not just throwing out insults.
I never expected to change anyone's mind, it is a tricky subject. I came to my line of thinking over several years, both during and after university.
In short, how someone identifies their gender is up to them. And I think it can change over time. That doesn't change their biological sex. Until we reach a point where DNA manipulation allows for removal of X and Y chromosomes, it is what it is. It doesn't invalidate the gender pay gap. But that is a totally different tangent.
As far as gender constructs being different across cultures, the classic example is handholding. In many cultures, handholding among adult men is common. They would not consider that an "unmanly" thing to do. In the US and most Western cultures, that would be considered "feminine" and generally a social taboo outside of the gay community. Neither culture is correct or incorrect. It just is what it is.
I don't think the end goal is to make gender constructs meaningless. The end goal is equality, for men, women, and LGBTQ. It is an idealistic thought that will probably never happen, but it is just my opinion.
Anyways, good discussion.

Defined your way, gender construct is nothing more than a personal identify that can change over time. Not really anything there to discriminate against. Just start saying sex and quit talking about gender since it is meaningless by these new definitions.

 

[Orange_Crush]

No problem, it was a nice discussion among several posters in this thread today. Thanks for not just throwing out insults.
I never expected to change anyone's mind, it is a tricky subject. I came to my line of thinking over several years, both during and after university.
In short, how someone identifies their gender is up to them. And I think it can change over time. That doesn't change their biological sex. Until we reach a point where DNA manipulation allows for removal of X and Y chromosomes, it is what it is. It doesn't invalidate the gender pay gap. But that is a totally different tangent.
As far as gender constructs being different across cultures, the classic example is handholding. In many cultures, handholding among adult men is common. They would not consider that an "unmanly" thing to do. In the US and most Western cultures, that would be considered "feminine" and generally a social taboo outside of the gay community. Neither culture is correct or incorrect. It just is what it is.
I don't think the end goal is to make gender constructs meaningless. The end goal is equality, for men, women, and LGBTQ. It is an idealistic thought that will probably never happen, but it is just my opinion.
Anyways, good discussion.

Your example isn't a cultural difference in what genders are. It is a difference in what is considered for men to do. It is the difference on what is acceptably defined as masculinity, but they are both still considered men. Neither one is expected to invite you outside yo kick your ... because you called him "sir".

 

[zeppelin128]

Your example isn't a cultural difference in what genders are. It is a difference in what is considered for men to do. It is the difference on what is acceptably defined as masculinity, but they are both still considered men. Neither one is expected to invite you outside yo kick your ... because you called him "sir".

It is absolutely a cultural difference of gender norms. Masculinity and feminity are a part of gender.

 

[Orange_Crush]

It is absolutely a cultural difference of gender norms. Masculinity and feminity are a part of gender.

But not a difference in gender definitions. To say that gender definitions vary between cultures to support transgenderism, and then list that example to support it, is disingenuous.

As a matter of fact, your example works *against* the point you seem to be trying to make. Men can hold hands with one another, but they are still men considered men. Neither is considered gender fluid. By that logic, in our culture where men want to wear dresses, we should still consider them men.

You claim that gender definitions vary across culture, but you've only made the argument that opinions on masculinity are different. Well, duh.

 

[photovol]

So you expect black people to support a guy who openly advocates white supremacy?

No, just continue to trust the deep state to advance your ideas and see how that works out for you pal

 

[zeppelin128]

But not a difference in gender definitions. To say that gender definitions vary between cultures to support transgenderism, and then list that example to support it, is disingenuous.

As a matter of fact, your example works *against* the point you seem to be trying to make. Men can hold hands with one another, but they are still men considered men. Neither is considered gender fluid. By that logic, in our culture where men want to wear dresses, we should still consider them men.

You claim that gender definitions vary across culture, but you've only made the argument that opinions on masculinity are different. Well, duh.

If a man likes women's clothing and identifies as a man, he's a man. Gender and biological sex are different things. Cultural ideas interpretations of "masculine" and "feminine" define gender.

 

[zeppelin128]

Woah, D4H was here? What did you guys do?

 

[photovol]

Why does he still own a hotel in D.C. (or anywhere)?

Why don’t you ask the main stream media, I’m sure you’ll be satisfied with their answer, because they always have your best interest at heart, don’t they?

 

[photovol]

"As He Plans To"

Take the Red Pill

 

[Orange_Crush]

Cultural ideas interpretations of "masculine" and "feminine" define gender.

Not according to your example of men holding hands being considered men. If "gender definition" means that they're still considered guys, then OK. Have at it.I'm not sure what you win for your argument, but have at it.

"Gender aligns with sex, but different cultures have different ideas of what how sexes/genders will express themselves in those cultures."

Sure. Let me know when that culture tells me I have to start calling the guys "ma'am" or they prove how ladylike they are by asking me to take it outside.

 

[zeppelin128]

Not according to your example of men holding hands being considered men. If "gender definition" means that they're still considered guys, then OK. Have at it.I'm not sure what you win for your argument, but have at it.

"Gender aligns with sex, but different cultures have different ideas of what how sexes/genders will express themselves in those cultures."

Sure. Let me know when that culture tells me I have to start calling the guys "ma'am" or they prove how ladylike they are by asking me to take it outside.

No one is forcing you to do anything. And certainly not our culture. It is still taboo to be LGBTQ, let alone pan, fluid, etc., in the majority of the country.
I said way earlier in this discussion that I don't think this is as big an issue as it is made out to be. If a dude wearing camo and a MAGA hat wants to be called Miss Sally, I'll call him/her Miss Sally. It is the polite thing to do, and it really isn't any of my business beyond that.

 

[C-south]

No one is forcing you to do anything. And certainly not our culture. It is still taboo to be LGBTQ, let alone pan, fluid, etc., in the majority of the country.
I said way earlier in this discussion that I don't think this is as big an issue as it is made out to be. If a dude wearing camo and a MAGA hat wants to be called Miss Sally, I'll call him/her Miss Sally. It is the polite thing to do, and it really isn't any of my business beyond that.

You confuse gender and gender dysphoria. Gender is male or female. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness where someone can’t come to grips with their actual gender and wish to be a different one.

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

Wiccan community offended by Trump's use of "witch hunt" term.

"Real" Witches Triggered By Trump's Use Of "Witch Hunt"

Boo-freaking Hoo!! We don't give a flying F about them. Screw them & their pointy hats.

 

[Orange_Crush]

No one is forcing you to do anything. And certainly not our culture. It is still taboo to be LGBTQ, let alone pan, fluid, etc., in the majority of the country.
I said way earlier in this discussion that I don't think this is as big an issue as it is made out to be. If a dude wearing camo and a MAGA hat wants to be called Miss Sally, I'll call him/her Miss Sally. It is the polite thing to do, and it really isn't any of my business beyond that.

Obviously, I was being sarcastic.

But it was to make a point. You haven't made the case for the point you seem to have been trying to make about gender definitions across cultures. As mentioned, you've undermined the point you were trying to make. Your example showed that men are men, even across cultures who view masculinity to be expressed differently.

With that said, would you call an anorexic fat to politely agree with their delusion?

 

[zeppelin128]

Boo-freaking Hoo!! We don't give a flying F about them. Screw them & their pointy hats.

Who is "we"? And what do you have against pointy hats?

 

[zeppelin128]

Obviously, I was being sarcastic.

But it was to make a point. You haven't made the case for the point you seem to have been trying to make about gender definitions across cultures. As mentioned, you've undermined the point you were trying to make. Your example showed that men are men, even across cultures who view masculinity to be expressed differently.

With that said, would you call an anorexic fat to politely agree with their delusion?

Masculinity and feminity are expressions of gender. Gender is influenced by culture and defined by personal opinion. Biological sex is determined by chromosomes. You are picking at my argument from the notion that gender and biological sex are the same thing. I don't think they are.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Masculinity and feminity are expressions of gender. Gender is influenced by culture and defined by personal opinion. Biological sex is determined by chromosomes. You are picking at my argument from the notion that gender and biological sex are the same thing. I don't think they are.

I am picking at your argument that it didn't make the point you inferred it would when making your argument. It's nothing personal, nor earth shattering. You claimed gender is different than sex (in support of normalizing gender dysphoria) and varying gender definitions across cultures support this. You actually meant that men are men across the planet when it comes to both sex and gender, it's just that opinions per masculinity expression change.

In other words, men are men around the globe and women are women around the globe even if men don't limp into bars and call people "pilgrim".

Well, like I said earlier... Duh.

Your example actually tells us that we should consider effeminate men to be men and butch women to be women.