Arizona Election Audit

[AM64]

And U would have supported that. So what’s the problem here? I mean look at this thread. Liberals, not saying you specifically, have posted in here religiously about how terrible and ridiculous it is. But why?

We all know nothing can nor will be done. Even if widespread fraud were to found, nothing would be done about it. So why the out rage over this audit? Let it play out and after nothing comes of it, just move on.

At the end of the election, about half the population doesn't care. Their guy won, so don't rock the boat. They accuse the other half of being sore losers. The country is the worse for it because legitimate questions are never really investigated and answered; we need to do better.

 

[NCFisher]

blah blah blah... you should consider worshipping our Lord & Savior Jesus Christ instead of Donald Trump hahaaaa

If the blackface Marxists and Antifa anarchos have their way, my only consolation is that after I'm run through the wood-chipper, you're next with your bible stuffed into an orifice. Perhaps I'll get to enjoy the look on your face in the afterlife.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

And U would have supported that. So what’s the problem here? I mean look at this thread. Liberals, not saying you specifically, have posted in here religiously about how terrible and ridiculous it is. But why?

We all know nothing can nor will be done. Even if widespread fraud were to found, nothing would be done about it. So why the out rage over this audit? Let it play out and after nothing comes of it, just move on.

Trump spent millions of taxpayers' money having the popular vote audited after the 2016 election because his extremely, fragile ego couldn't stand the thought of losing the popular vote

 

[NCFisher]

I didn't say anything about Dems. So it's tribal for you? It shouldn't be about party politics. If we're really searching for the truth, an audit should be brought by apolitical organizations

Uh, no; that's a show of good faith. I want to know we've valid, secure elections. I don't give a shite where truth comes from.

I don't see apolitical organizations ,if they exist, lining up and volunteering to do so. Maybe they don't like being doxxed, threatened and efforts to have them fired or ruin their lives.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

If the blackface Marxists and Antifa anarchos have their way, my only consolation is that after I'm run through the wood-chipper, you're next with your bible stuffed into an orifice. Perhaps I'll get to enjoy the look on your face in the afterlife.

Mr. Information with fringe references. Living in fear and perpetuating it is unhealthy. Perhaps you should seek therapy

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Uh, no; that's a show of good faith. I want to know we've valid, secure elections. I don't give a shite where truth comes from.

I don't see apolitical organizations ,if they exist, lining up and volunteering to do so. Maybe they don't like being doxxed, threatened and efforts to have them fired or ruin their lives.

Many of them have voiced their opinions. Which, by all accounts, are FAR more informed than those you offer

 

[AM64]

Stuff like not having pens laying around is important, yet if you go back to election night and the videos, clerks have purses sitting on desks. That's not acceptable; people working with ballots should go in clean - no writing implements, no phones, etc. But what you see in videos is a zoo filled with lazy people doing stuff after looking around to see if anybody is looking. No organization, no security, no professionalism, and no way of knowing for sure what they are doing. Unacceptable. People counting should never have implements to mark or to destroy ballots.

 

[NCFisher]

Mr. Information with fringe references. Living in fear and perpetuating it is unhealthy. Perhaps you should seek therapy

It's hardly fringe when the Marxists in blackface founders openly state they're Marxists, and BLM walks, talks and acts likes Marxists. Antifa are anarchists; it's an old movement and their Euro violence has been adopted by the U.S. proponents.

I don't live in fear; it was a satirical reply to a nonsensical post. That it has to be explained to you...
You did the Mr. Information right, though; that's progress!

 

[NCFisher]

Many of them have voiced their opinions. Which, by all accounts, are FAR more informed than those you offer

If they haven't matched paper ballot with machine tally, they know NOTHING more than I do. Go acquaint yourself with the MIT study I just posted to Luther.

 

[AM64]

Doesn't really matter how it's funded, the AZ state legislatures run their elections and they have the right to audit and investigate how they see fit. The people of AZ elect their officials, if they disapprove of what their elected officials are doing they can vote them out. People outside of AZ whining about an audit in that state is inconsequential.

Rolling, unannounced audits should be a part of any election process. If the people running the election know a team of inspectors could walk in the door any time to watch, verify, and/or audit - and there are real penalties, it keeps people focused on doing things right. Unfortunately election commissions have never operated in that kind of environment, and the sloth taking place shows it.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

It's hardly fringe when the Marxists in blackface founders openly state they're Marxists, and BLM walks, talks and acts likes Marxists. Antifa are anarchists; it's an old movement and their Euro violence has been adopted by the U.S. proponents.

I don't live in fear; it was a satirical reply to a nonsensical post. That it has to be explained to you...
You did the Mr. Information right, though; that's progress!

In my experiences, the guy in the room who has everything figured out, is usually the stupidest guy in the room. Obviously, you've never been in that room

 

[BowlBrother85]

First off, and I've said this before (in this thread, too, I think), "Cyber Ninjas" is a stupid name; I'd be the first to agree that it completely destroys any sense of professionalism. It sounds more like a term used in the hacker world, but then I wouldn't mind seeing a hacker's view of election systems. I'd bet they are a lot less secure than cracked up to be - A LOT LESS.

As far as the purpose, we tend to see this differently. You are right; it isn't going to set aside an election - that's done. Biden won't get an asterisk beside his name pointing out his win was a fluke even if proven. This doesn't even rise to the level of "grudge match" because it won't affect the election - we don't do the "no confidence" thing and a do over, which sometimes might be a good idea ... but likely not in our hyper-partisan political arena. What I want (and several others here say the same) is a thorough look at our election system with an intent to fix flaws. We have a very bad habit of picking up on things that are wrong during elections and then ignoring them just to screech about them again the next time. We need to stop that BS, figure out if there is a problem, and address it. That requires literally picking the current one apart to see what's right and what's wrong, and a lot of us believe there's plenty wrong.

It just doesn't have anything to do with Trump. A lot of us who are offended by what looks to be faulty equipment and processes just may have preferred Trump as the winner. A flawed system is a flawed system - period; we're better than this. You cannot have negative vote counts, and pretend it never happened or that it's normal - that's the kind of thing that has people in an uproar.

There are two things very wrong with this...

(1) Cyber Ninas Inc. doesn't have any experience with conducting the audit of an election. It isn't just their name presenting a problem here. They have never had the responsibility of auditing an election before (state or local), but somehow, they are qualified to conduct an audit involving the Presidential Election? That doesn't make any sense. Even without the obvious bias of their owner, Doug Logan, they were a poor choice. You don't select someone with no experience if it truly is "a thorough look at our election system with an intent to fix flaws" that you are after.

AND

(2) This audit in Arizona has everything to do with the Republican Party fealty and subservience to Donald Trump. This audit is only happening because Trump lost... and because Trump won't accept the results. Did Republicans want the 2016 Presidential Election to be audited? No, because Trump won that election.

The truth is, Al Gore had a much better claim to being cheated in 2000, than Donald Trump has now... but Republicans fought the hand recount in Florida from taking place at every turn. Al Gore lost by only 568 votes in one state. Even you flip both Arizona and Georgia over to Trump in the 2020 Presidential Election, he still loses the election. Your argument is disingenuous at its core. This has everything to do with Trump.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

If they haven't matched paper ballot with machine tally, they know NOTHING more than I do. Go acquaint yourself with the MIT study I just posted to Luther.

Message board MVP! Congratulations! Post in your trophy case

 

[AM64]

Why not - seems like everybody else was. Actually there was a reasonable chance the Russians would be more honest about Clinton/Trump "news" than our own media.

 

[AM64]

So apparently they can also detect if the paper ballots have Bamboo in them which would be a dead giveaway that they were shipped here from another country. I know at one time there was a conspiracy about ballots being flown in from another country. I guess we will find out if it's true or not. Either way, Rachel is in meltdown mode

Hoof and mouth disease in mad cows is a particularly serious thing.

 

[AM64]

There are two things very wrong with this...

(1) Cyber Ninas Inc. doesn't have any experience with conducting the audit of an election. It isn't just their name presenting a problem here. They have never had the responsibility of auditing an election before (state or local), but somehow, they are qualified to conduct an audit involving the Presidential Election? That doesn't make any sense. Even without the obvious bias of their owner, Doug Logan, they were a poor choice. You don't select someone with no experience if it truly is "a thorough look at our election system with an intent to fix flaws" that you are after.

AND

(2) This audit in Arizona has everything to do with the Republican Party fealty and subservience to Donald Trump. This audit is only happening because Trump lost... and because Trump won't accept the results. Did Republicans want the 2016 Presidential Election to be audited? No, because Trump won that election.

The truth is, Al Gore had a much better claim to being cheated in 2000, than Donald Trump has now... but Republicans fought the hand recount in Florida from taking place at every turn. Al Gore lost by only 568 votes in one state. Even you flip both Arizona and Georgia over to Trump in the 2020 Presidential Election, he still loses the election. Your argument is disingenuous at its core. This has everything to do with Trump.

So who does routine election audits? You could probably say that many big financial auditing companies have never audited an election. Does that disqualify them even if nobody has any concerns with their qualifications? The point is election auditing should be routine anyway. People with nothing to hide should be proud of their work and work ethic. I'd rather empty out local schools and turn elections over to school teachers than watch the slovenly process that goes on with local election commission employees.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

So who does routine election audits? You could probably say that many big financial auditing companies have never audited an election. Does that disqualify them even if nobody has any concerns with their qualifications? The point is election auditing should be routine anyway. People with nothing to hide should be proud of their work and work ethic. I'd rather empty out local schools and turn elections over to school teachers than watch the slovenly process that goes on with local election commission employees.

Have you expressed this opinion prior to the 2020 Presidential election?

 

[BowlBrother85]

So who does routine election audits? You could probably say that many big financial auditing companies have never audited an election. Does that disqualify them even if nobody has any concerns with their qualifications? The point is election auditing should be routine anyway. People with nothing to hide should be proud of their work and work ethic. I'd rather empty out local schools and turn elections over to school teachers than watch the slovenly process that goes on with local election commission employees.

Election auditing is routine... and the results in Arizona have already been through two of them. The Big Four accounting firms (Ernst & Young, PwC, Deloitte, KPMG) have all performed audits of elections. I can't believe that anyone would defend Cyber Ninjas being hired for this.

I frequently see the Republican argument that "People who are confident that the results are valid, should not care if those results are audited".

Why didn't this logic apply to the 2000 Presidential Election? Republicans fought like hell from having the results from the state of Florida audited, and that was a much closer election than the results currently being audited in Arizona... and the outcome of the entire 2000 Presidential Election hung in the balance on that one state - which was decided by only 568 votes. An audit in Florida in December of 2000 really could have changed the outcome of the whole election. It was possible.

 

[BowlBrother85]

Have you expressed this opinion prior to the 2020 Presidential election?

There damn sure weren't any Republicans talking like him in December of 2000.

 

[AM64]

Have you expressed this opinion prior to the 2020 Presidential election?

Probably not because I don't recall participating in any discussions about elections before. But going back to the Bush/Gore election, I certainly didn't have a problem with all the fanfare that went on there. Again to me that brought up a systemic problem that should never have happened and needed to be addressed to insure it never happened again. It's not the results that are important (although we may pay dearly for bad choices); it is the process, the process, the process - always make sure the process works and is untainted. Always address all the issues in full with complete honesty. I will never accept election software that's labeled "proprietary" - that's simply stupid - people have been adding 1's for years; it's entry level computer programming at best. There are way too many issues from registration right through vote counting; it's frankly embarrassing that this country doesn't have a more professional system.

 

[Orangeburst]

Probably not because I don't recall participating in any discussions about elections before. But going back to the Bush/Gore election, I certainly didn't have a problem with all the fanfare that went on there. Again to me that brought up a systemic problem that should never have happened and needed to be addressed to insure it never happened again. It's not the results that are important (although we may pay dearly for bad choices); it is the process, the process, the process - always make sure the process works and is untainted. Always address all the issues in full with complete honesty. I will never accept election software that's labeled "proprietary" - that's simply stupid - people have been adding 1's for years; it's entry level computer programming at best. There are way too many issues from registration right through vote counting; it's frankly embarrassing that this country doesn't have a more professional system.

Could not agree more with everything you posted. The writing was on the wall in 2000 and yet, it got worse.
AFAIAC, your vote should be tabulated whatever means, you see it count plus 1 on an accumulated tally and video record all votes. Dang live feed the tally on TV. You have personal validation and tally confirmation.
It is not complicated, although MIB and overseas ballots would need other methods.

Edit: MIB are so problematic

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Probably not because I don't recall participating in any discussions about elections before. But going back to the Bush/Gore election, I certainly didn't have a problem with all the fanfare that went on there. Again to me that brought up a systemic problem that should never have happened and needed to be addressed to insure it never happened again. It's not the results that are important (although we may pay dearly for bad choices); it is the process, the process, the process - always make sure the process works and is untainted. Always address all the issues in full with complete honesty. I will never accept election software that's labeled "proprietary" - that's simply stupid - people have been adding 1's for years; it's entry level computer programming at best. There are way too many issues from registration right through vote counting; it's frankly embarrassing that this country doesn't have a more professional system.

Your lengthy posts are far more compelling than NC Fisher's! I am able see your point and maybe, meld into mine. I truly believe there are major problems. Voting systems should be uniform across the country. There shouldn't be limited access. Flaws in vote counts, and gerrymandering, must be eliminated

 

[K-town Vol Fan]

And U would have supported that. So what’s the problem here? I mean look at this thread. Liberals, not saying you specifically, have posted in here religiously about how terrible and ridiculous it is. But why?

We all know nothing can nor will be done. Even if widespread fraud were to found, nothing would be done about it. So why the out rage over this audit? Let it play out and after nothing comes of it, just move on.

My biggest issue is instead of selecting an unbiased, professional 3rd party they hired a bunch of red hatters who claimed there was fraud before it even started and have 0 experience in auditing an election.

 

[K-town Vol Fan]

Thursdays update from Kelly Ward

a q

If they aren't hiding anything why do they not want federal monitors? See I know how to play too.

 

[Tastylicks]

If the blackface Marxists and Antifa anarchos have their way, my only consolation is that after I'm run through the wood-chipper, you're next with your bible stuffed into an orifice. Perhaps I'll get to enjoy the look on your face in the afterlife.

Idk, maybe , but if we're both in the afterlife then there definetely was some fraud