Barnes offense is hot trash.....

#126
#126
RhodesVol said:
People will deride you, but this is a good point. This team is very streaky shooting the ball, and that makes the offense look bad even if you do all the other things right.

The Florida game was bad, and the effort looked poor. On the whole, though, this team is taking the best shots, based upon the metrics, in the conference. The problem is that the shots aren't going in the basket. The movement without the ball is very good, and the ball movement has been good for the most part.
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Yup, the thing about metrics is usually everything equals out...would be crazy for us to take the best shots and force the worst shots by quite a wide margin and yet continue to struggle badly. We were cold and missed Springer, some other guys banged up too, I’m not rushing to judgment after 3 games...especially considering we were playing like a Top 5 team previous to that stretch.
 
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#127
#127
bleedingTNorange said:
They were in the conversation, entering the dance they were outside looking in, but 2 wins in Nashville and it would’ve been a discussion...not like we are talking about a 10 win team here who’s metrics were garbage, every metric had them as a bubble team.

And no, 20 wins doesn’t mean much, Andy Kennedy had a bunch of those with his horrendous SOS...yes it’s about tourney appearances, right now Barnes is 2/4, sitting on 2 years in a row, looks like he’ll be 3/5 and 3 in a row after this season unless you’re assuming they fall of a cliff.

Again, next years squad looks pretty good to me, hard to say what they’ll be until we know exactly who’s coming/going, but with the likely guards they’ll have on campus that’s a pretty damn good staff to another tourney team.
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It was still a significant drop off. I’m okay not making the tournament every single year even if that is my minimum with significant tournament success but we haven’t had any yet and Barnes is going 15 years now with one or two S16. It’s a concern either way.

2022 is a big key. Chandler is awesome and our backcourt should be good again but we need two guys that can start at 4/5 if Fulky leaves. If he comes back way less concerned about being a tourney team. Barnes’ track record with posts transfer at UT hasn’t been good.
 
#128
#128
bleedingTNorange said:
Yup, the thing about metrics is usually everything equals out...would be crazy for us to take the best shots and force the worst shots by quite a wide margin and yet continue to struggle badly.
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What’s our percentages in SEC play?
 
#129
#129
bleedingTNorange said:
Not when he didn’t like the hire from the start and he’s proving him wrong.
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Jerry Green took over a team that made the tourney 1 time in four years and went to the tourney his first two years. Pearl took over a team that didn’t make a tourney in four years and went his first two years. I know the revisionist history from some is that Barnes took over a Baylor like situation similar to what Scott Drew took over, but it’s not impossible to make the tourney in year 2 of a rebuild. Even if it wasn’t expected. And I’d be more willing to forgive those first two years if Barnes had accomplished postseason success.
 
#130
#130
What would help Barnes achieve more success in my opinion and a thread I made earlier is if he would dump the motion offense. It’s holding this team back IMO.
 
#131
#131
zjcvols said:
What would help Barnes achieve more success in my opinion and a thread I made earlier is if he would dump the motion offense. It’s holding this team back IMO.
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I hear he's read your suggestion, and he's going to do just that for the Kansas game and moving forward.
 
#132
#132
zjcvols said:
Jerry Green took over a team that made the tourney 1 time in four years and went to the tourney his first two years. Pearl took over a team that didn’t make a tourney in four years and went his first two years. I know the revisionist history from some is that Barnes took over a Baylor like situation similar to what Scott Drew took over, but it’s not impossible to make the tourney in year 2 of a rebuild. Even if it wasn’t expected. And I’d be more willing to forgive those first two years if Barnes had accomplished postseason success.
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Donnie put TN in the NCAA’s crosshairs. That puts the kibosh on recruiting opportunities for a while. Cuonzo faced the same issue. Pearl and Green didn’t.
 
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#134
#134
zjcvols said:
It was still a significant drop off. I’m okay not making the tournament every single year even if that is my minimum with significant tournament success but we haven’t had any yet and Barnes is going 15 years now with one or two S16. It’s a concern either way.

2022 is a big key. Chandler is awesome and our backcourt should be good again but we need two guys that can start at 4/5 if Fulky leaves. If he comes back way less concerned about being a tourney team. Barnes’ track record with posts transfer at UT hasn’t been good.
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I’m good with James at the 4 if we are playing small ball
 
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#138
#138
bleedingTNorange said:
Might wanna lend some suggestions to your boy Izzo instead, 37 points last night and doesn’t look likely they’ll sniff the tourney this year, sheeeeesh.
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In his defense, first game in three weeks if I’m not mistaken.
 
#141
#141
bleedingTNorange said:
Ahhh, good to see missing time/players is a valid excuse for Izzo...something tells me you would have a little different tone if that was Barnes and Tennessee.
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You’re wrong but that’s not surprising. I have said multiple times this year with COVID how difficult this can be and mentioned in the first few games giving a pass because of the COVID issues at UT.
 
#142
#142
I think its fair to count last year as a missed tourney, we were very fortunate to be Alabama last year the first time, don't see us winning two games and sneaking in. Don't think its fair to hold missing the tourney in the first two years against Barnes, especially given the jump in the third year once he'd had time to rebuild the program a bit
He has definitely made mistakes. His post recruiting has left a little to be desired and I too am not the biggest fan of the type of offense we run. I don't harp on the early exits as much as some because I think its less instructive to artificially limit the sample of games you're considering when judging a coach (in other words, the tourney is a crapshoot and we barely lost both times, both times featuring some bad luck our way I'd argue).
I just don't understand what high expectations some have. We've made one Elite Eight, ever. We were ranked #1 for one week ever before Barnes got here. We hadn't won the SEC tourney in decades. I enjoy expecting to win 25 games with tough OOC schedules and competing for SEC championships and S16s. Maybe I am too easily satisfied
 
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#143
#143
Vol49er said:
I think its fair to count last year as a missed tourney, we were very fortunate to be Alabama last year the first time, don't see us winning two games and sneaking in. Don't think its fair to hold missing the tourney in the first two years against Barnes, especially given the jump in the third year once he'd had time to rebuild the program a bit
He has definitely made mistakes. His post recruiting has left a little to be desired and I too am not the biggest fan of the type of offense we run. I don't harp on the early exits as much as some because I think its less instructive to artificially limit the sample of games you're considering when judging a coach (in other words, the tourney is a crapshoot and we barely lost both times, both times featuring some bad luck our way I'd argue).
I just don't understand what high expectations some have. We've made one Elite Eight, ever. We were ranked #1 for one week ever before Barnes got here. We hadn't won the SEC tourney in decades. I enjoy expecting to win 25 games with tough OOC schedules and competing for SEC championships and S16s. Maybe I am too easily satisfied
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Tennessee was playing their best basketball of the year at that point.
 
#144
#144
cardvolfan said:
Tennessee was playing their best basketball of the year at that point.
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If you’re referring to the end of last season, indicating we may have gone on a run in the SEC tourney, I guess we were but it was still very Jekyl and Hyde. Wins over Florida and UK sandwiched between blowout losses to Arkansas and Auburn (both teams we’d played previously, just like Alabama would have been). Regardless I don’t even think two wins in the tourney would’ve gotten us in
 
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#145
#145
zjcvols said:
True and I’m not advocating for a Barnes firing or anything like that. He’s overpaid but there’s no salary cap on coaching salaries so it doesn’t truly matter.

The problem I’m having (and I’m doing some forecasting as well) is the inconsistency. This year is a very good team and we will make the tourney. But look at next year and we are probably gonna lose 4/6 top players (depending on Fulky). We don’t have a big committed or we lead on right now. I don’t trust any post player at the 4/5 on the current roster that isn’t a senior to play more than 10 mpg in an SEC game. Mashack is gonna be fun but needs seasoning. Next years team is going to struggle most likely.

If Barnes misses the tournament again in 2022 (and we are FAR OFF from that) that’s 3/7 of NCAAT appearances. And if we have another early exit this year? I don’t think that is acceptable. But again...that’s far off
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We've seen how he likes to operate. I never really felt as though we'd be seeing all these classes loaded with 5 star talent under Barnes. I think he's probably a lot more comfortable doing it the Admiral and Grant way. Get guys you know will be here for 3-4 years and develop them. We'll have a couple of lackluster years sandwiched by some very solid years. Hell, this is UT. I have no expectations when it comes to sports at this university anymore.
 
#147
#147
zjcvols said:
Jerry Green took over a team that made the tourney 1 time in four years and went to the tourney his first two years. Pearl took over a team that didn’t make a tourney in four years and went his first two years. I know the revisionist history from some is that Barnes took over a Baylor like situation similar to what Scott Drew took over, but it’s not impossible to make the tourney in year 2 of a rebuild. Even if it wasn’t expected. And I’d be more willing to forgive those first two years if Barnes had accomplished postseason success.
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You can’t be making stuff up and expect people to agree to your point.
 
#148
#148
bleedingTNorange said:
Yup, the thing about metrics is usually everything equals out...would be crazy for us to take the best shots and force the worst shots by quite a wide margin and yet continue to struggle badly. We were cold and missed Springer, some other guys banged up too, I’m not rushing to judgment after 3 games...especially considering we were playing like a Top 5 team previous to that stretch.
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I would say four games. The Vandy game was really bad as well. We wore them down and pulled away from their terrible team at the end. There was two very long extended periods of terrible basketball in that game that had all the signs of what was to come.
 
#149
#149
zjcvols said:
True and I’m not advocating for a Barnes firing or anything like that. He’s overpaid but there’s no salary cap on coaching salaries so it doesn’t truly matter.

The problem I’m having (and I’m doing some forecasting as well) is the inconsistency. This year is a very good team and we will make the tourney. But look at next year and we are probably gonna lose 4/6 top players (depending on Fulky). We don’t have a big committed or we lead on right now. I don’t trust any post player at the 4/5 on the current roster that isn’t a senior to play more than 10 mpg in an SEC game. Mashack is gonna be fun but needs seasoning. Next years team is going to struggle most likely.

If Barnes misses the tournament again in 2022 (and we are FAR OFF from that) that’s 3/7 of NCAAT appearances. And if we have another early exit this year? I don’t think that is acceptable. But again...that’s far off
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The problem I'm having is your consistent lies of omission about the state of our program CRB's first 2 seasons...given what you know about the roster CRB inherited and the national perception of our program, is it really your position that a reasonable and informed opinion would be to expect a tourney appearance in either of those seasons?
 
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