Bernie Sanders Thread

[theFallGuy]

I'm sure they did, just not the ones born into poverty. They were SOL.

well if these safety programs are so great, surely you could point out all the instances of people who have moved out of poverty to the middle class because of the generosity of a welfare program

 

[mrorange211]

Are you guys suggesting we go back to the gilded age and the political machine bosses that ran cities?

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

You claimed the the Constitution gave the Gov't the power to provide welfare with tax payer funded dollars. I simply stated that this was not true.

Welfare should undergo major reforms yes.

I said the Constitution speaks of promoting the general welfare for all Americans, wealthy, middle class, and poor. I never said "the Constitution gave the government the power to provide welfare with tax payer funded dollars." Do you work for Fox News?

 

[gasguy98]

The constitution speaks of promoting the general welfare, so the term doesn't just apply to the SNAP program - we are promoting the general welfare of our people through a variety of government programs, including ones you and I use and benefit from every single day.

As for that person appearing to be perfectly healthy and dressed in the latest fashion? What do you know of that person's mental state? Did you give them a full physical and deem them perfectly healthy? There are so many things that could have gone wrong in that person's life. As for them dressing in the latest fashion? How do you know they aren't thrift shoppers? Go to the Goodwill in Franklin, TN and you'll find new name brand clothes for sale. What if they were on their way or returning from a job interview? Are all welfare recipients supposed to wear a burlap sack or what?

What if I told you that distant family members of mine are generational welfare recipients'? That they all know what boxes to check, what officers to see, what to tell the people they have to talk to in order to get the goodies. That welfare abuse in an industry unto itself.

Oh and I left this out on the Kroger experience expecting a reply like the one you gave. One got into a newer model Toyota Avalon and the other got into an early 2000's Jag while talking on her iPhone.

I wish I could do business with you. It is apparently very easy to pull the wool over your eyes.

 

[theFallGuy]

Are you guys suggesting we go back to the gilded age and the political machine bosses that ran cities?

No, but if someone is going to make the argument that the Great Society and the New Deal were the greatest inventions since sliced bread then I have to respectfully disagree with that.

 

[MG1968]

I said the Constitution speaks of promoting the general welfare for all Americans, wealthy, middle class, and poor. I never said "the Constitution gave the government the power to provide welfare with tax payer funded dollars." Do you work for Fox News?

Look up article I, Section 8 of the Constitution. Those are the things federal dollars are supposed to be appropriated for and what the Framers considered "general welfare".

 

[gasguy98]

You do realize that before all of these great and wonderful social welfare programs existed, people still went to school, people still ate, people still received necessary health care.

opcorn:

 

[mrorange211]

No, but if someone is going to make the argument that the Great Society and the New Deal were the greatest inventions since sliced bread then I have to respectfully disagree with that.

For sure. Couldn't agree more. I just don't want think it would be such a good idea go back to a dog-eat-dog society.

 

[gasguy98]

Look up article I, Section 8 of the Constitution. Those are the things federal dollars are supposed to be appropriated for and what the Framers considered "general welfare".

Not to be confused with section 8 housinglol:

 

[mrorange211]

Hilarious

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

well if these safety programs are so great, surely you could point out all the instances of people who have moved out of poverty to the middle class because of the generosity of a welfare program

Um Ben Carson? Myself? My sisters who are now nurses? Countless numbers of people have benefited from social welfare programs and no longer need them, but wouldn't have had the opportunities without them.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

No, but if someone is going to make the argument that the Great Society and the New Deal were the greatest inventions since sliced bread then I have to respectfully disagree with that.

We should live in a country without child labor laws, without overtime laws, without workplace safety laws, without pollution laws, without public school and vocational funding, without Social Security and Medicare for the elderly, without Medicaid for the poor and disabled? Oh, and black people and women are kept in their place! Yeah, pre-progressive America sounds awesome. Dog Eat Dog FTW.

 

[MG1968]

We should live in a country without child labor laws, without overtime laws, without workplace safety laws, without pollution laws, without public school and vocational funding, without Social Security and Medicare for the elderly, without Medicaid for the poor and disabled? Oh, and black people and women are kept in their place! Yeah, pre-progressive America sounds awesome. Dog Eat Dog FTW.

It's sad that you think that just because someone doesn't believe the federal government is the best source for social welfare they must believe, and even endorse, a society where the poor lay starving in the middle of the street.

It's not an either/or proposition.

 

[FLVOL69]

Um Ben Carson? Myself? My sisters who are now nurses? Countless numbers of people have benefited from social welfare programs and no longer need them, but wouldn't have had the opportunities without them.

And those are the ones who it's designed for, unfortunately there are record numbers of moochers who make it a career living off the generosity of hard working taxpayers, it has increased exponentially under this ass clown of a potus .

 

[theFallGuy]

We should live in a country without child labor laws, without overtime laws, without workplace safety laws, without pollution laws, without public school and vocational funding, without Social Security and Medicare for the elderly, without Medicaid for the poor and disabled? Oh, and black people and women are kept in their place! Yeah, pre-progressive America sounds awesome. Dog Eat Dog FTW.

Yes because this is exactly what I said. Good logic there.

Hey everyone if we reform Federal Welfare the whole world will implode! Literally, the poor will just start dying in the streets.

I would agree that we should eliminate the Department of Education but judging from the logic you just posted I'm sure this will cause your head to spin. Crazy I know.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

And those are the ones who it's designed for, unfortunately there are record numbers of moochers who make it a career living off the generosity of hard working taxpayers, it has increased exponentially under this ass clown of a potus .

And I agree with all of you guys that nobody should make a lifestyle out of these programs. But for all of the loud and obnoxious ones that do abuse the help, there are far more that genuinely need the help. Reform is definitely needed, but some people around here act like we need to follow a system where even those who genuinely need, and are not capable of "work" as you and I are capable of doing, should be doing "something" because nothing should be free. I've used the example of my grandmother, who isn't at retirement age, but can hardly walk and has had congenital heart failure or my little brother who can't climb a set of stairs. I don't expect them to be held accountable for their disabilities, and I wouldn't expect any family members of yours to be either. They're not lazy. They just cannot do what people like us are capable of doing.

 

[mrorange211]

And those are the ones who it's designed for, unfortunately there are record numbers of moochers who make it a career living off the generosity of hard working taxpayers, it has increased exponentially under this ass clown of a potus .

The average benefit per meal for these 'moochers' is $1.50. Most welfare programs require some proof of employment in order to receive assistance, TANF for example makes single parents work at least 30 hrs a week to receive help. No illegal aliens are allowed on any kind of financial assistance, except emergency medicaid. While many say welfare recipients use the money on drugs, the percentage that do is actually lower then the percentage of Americans not on welfare that do use money for drugs. For example, Tennessee began testing for drugs and a huge number of people were found to be dirty: 1 out of every 800. In your beautiful state of Florida, only 2.6% of welfare recipients tested positive. The 'welfare queen' that Reagan referred to in the 1980's? Never existed, but of course she was a black lady from Chicago when the "Great Liar" anointed this figment of his imagination as robbing us blind. Finally, every statistic shows that welfare makes a difference. Food stamps helped lessen the burden of poverty for 4.8 million people last year. The Earned Income Tax Credit and Child Credit kept 8 million families from falling under the povety line in 2014. If Social Security did not exist, over 28 million more people would be living in poverty.

These statements are fact, not conjecture. Use data sometime.

 

[theFallGuy]

That kind of fear-mongering is why nothing ever changes.

 

[gasguy98]

Um Ben Carson? Myself? My sisters who are now nurses? Countless numbers of people have benefited from social welfare programs and no longer need them, but wouldn't have had the opportunities without them.

So you and your sisters were all on welfare?

 

[mrorange211]

So you and your sisters were all on welfare?

You saw some individuals that took advantage of welfare at a Kroger, drove an old Jaguar, and suddenly the entire social welfare system is total $hit because of that one example? Seems weak, cause it is weak.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

Yes because this is exactly what I said. Good logic there.

Hey everyone if we reform Federal Welfare the whole world will implode! Literally, the poor will just start dying in the streets.

I would agree that we should eliminate the Department of Education but judging from the logic you just posted I'm sure this will cause your head to spin. Crazy I know.

I agree with reforms. As for the DOE? I would be afraid that some poorer states would never be able to fund the education of their youth without a federal level of education. But, as a teacher, having politicians (Governor Haslam, for example) dictating how education should be handled is a real pain in the ass. I see both sides of all of these arguments, as there are valid points you guys are making.

 

[FLVOL69]

The average benefit per meal for these 'moochers' is $1.50. Most welfare programs require some proof of employment in order to receive assistance, TANF for example makes single parents work at least 30 hrs a week to receive help. No illegal aliens are allowed on any kind of financial assistance, except emergency medicaid. While many say welfare recipients use the money on drugs, the percentage that do is actually lower then the percentage of Americans not on welfare that do use money for drugs. For example, Tennessee began testing for drugs and a huge number of people were found to be dirty: 1 out of every 800. In your beautiful state of Florida, only 2.6% of welfare recipients tested positive. The 'welfare queen' that Reagan referred to in the 1980's? Never existed, but of course she was a black lady from Chicago when the "Great Liar" anointed this figment of his imagination as robbing us blind. Finally, every statistic shows that welfare makes a difference. Food stamps helped lessen the burden of poverty for 4.8 million people last year. The Earned Income Tax Credit and Child Credit kept 8 million families from falling under the povety line in 2014. If Social Security did not exist, over 28 million more people would be living in poverty.

These statements are fact, not conjecture. Use data sometime.

Try getting out in the real world sometime,over 20 million more on food stamps under this pos prez, extended unemployment benefits for as far as the eye can see.. How much of the damn budget goes to entitlements Einstein ? Too damn much !

 

[gasguy98]

And I agree with all of you guys that nobody should make a lifestyle out of these programs. But for all of the loud and obnoxious ones that do abuse the help, there are far more that genuinely need the help. Reform is definitely needed, but some people around here act like we need to follow a system where even those who genuinely need, and are not capable of "work" as you and I are capable of doing, should be doing "something" because nothing should be free. I've used the example of my grandmother, who isn't at retirement age, but can hardly walk and has had congenital heart failure or my little brother who can't climb a set of stairs. I don't expect them to be held accountable for their disabilities, and I wouldn't expect any family members of yours to be either. They're not lazy. They just cannot do what people like us are capable of doing.

It sounds like your entire family (you, sisters, grand ma, brother) has used these services. What gives? Is everyone in your family just super unhealthy?

 

[gasguy98]

You saw some individuals that took advantage of welfare at a Kroger, drove an old Jaguar, and suddenly the entire social welfare system is total $hit because of that one example? Seems weak, cause it is weak.

Been seeing it all the time for the last 20 years. Kroger was in the last few weeks. The Jag was a 2007ish, very nice

Saw it some in Charlotte, NC.
Saw it nearly daily living in south Florida. Not as much in Colorado. Bad here in Lexington. See it all the time at Circle K. Mostly young women that look like meth users. First time was at the Kroger on Western Ave, 1994, Knoxville. Still remember the guy was dressed well. Easier to spot back then because they didn't have the super cool EBT cards.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

So you and your sisters were all on welfare?

Our family received food stamps and free lunches at school after my mother was treated for her brain tumor in her frontal lobe. She is disabled and has had seizures on occasion for 20+ years now. Stepdad was a welder and was burdened with enormous medical bills from her situation and my younger brother being diagnosed with muscular dystrophy. When we graduated high school, we received Pell grants and subsidized student loans for college, due to our low income status.