Calipari comment

#76
#76
Hardwood_fanatic said:
So, the last team to go undefeated was in 1976 at Indiana, which was a team led by seniors. In 34 years it has not happened again, but you say its safe to assume that a team full of freshmen should have done it easily enough? If thats not asinine, I'm not sure what is.

Are you actually reading the stuff you write?
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Should/will cal then recruit some kids that will stay beyond one year in order to have the non-freshmen that you believe are needed to win an NC ? And how many does he need ? Is he willing to sacrifice and pass on some "one and dones" and then actually develop a team capable of winning the NC ?

That would require high quality coaching and ego management versus the current model of letting the NBA talent just play, the preseason expectations be high, planning for postseaon underachievement, and then touting your players' NBA draft record ?

Sounds to me like an excuse...a well constructed excuse.
 
#77
#77
Incinigator said:
Should/will cal then recruit some kids that will stay beyond one year in order to have the non-freshmen that you believe are needed to win an NC ? And how many does he need ? Is he willing to sacrifice and pass on some "one and dones" and then actually develop a team capable of winning the NC ?

That would require high quality coaching and ego management versus the current model of letting the NBA talent just play, the preseason expectations be high, planning for postseaon underachievement, and then touting your players' NBA draft record ?

Sounds to me like an excuse...a well constructed excuse.
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You're making too many assumptions. He gets the best kids in the nation because they want to go to wherever he coaches.
 
#79
#79
crusse10 said:
How "getting drafted" is equivalent to "Michael Jordan" is beyond me. All it would have taken was 1 team to take a shot at him. A kid coming from Kentucky with 2 years of experience and his athleticism gets drafted.
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The point is Cal doesn't develop players---he signs players that are already going to be drafted. Does the exposure at KY move them up--possibly. That is all that happens. This notion that Cal is the great developer of players is hogwash.
 
#80
#80
crusse10 said:
You're making too many assumptions. He gets the best kids in the nation because they want to go to wherever he coaches.
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And I also ASSUME he hasn't won a NC or left behind NCAA issues at TWO programs after having "coached" as much NBA talent as any college coach in the last several years.

I question why the best kids in the nation want to go wherever he coaches. IMO, it's because it benefits cal first, the kids second, and the program du jour (uk, right now) third. Those priorities are not in the order that I would want for my favorite college program.
 
#81
#81
Incinigator said:
And I also ASSUME he hasn't won a NC or left behind NCAA issues at TWO programs after having "coached" as much NBA talent as any college coach in the last several years.

I question why the best kids in the nation want to go wherever he coaches. IMO, it's because it benefits cal first, the kids second, and the program du jour (uk, right now) third. Those priorities are not in the order that I would want for my favorite college program.
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You just don't understand. These players want to play for Cal because he "develops" them into NBA players. UT would have had 5 go in the first round this year if Cal had been coaching them. He is a great developer of talent---Folks just think that he is a great recruiter. Actually, he signs marginal players and they become first round picks after a year in his system.
 
#82
#82
I'm with the 3 years in college or Europe rule. It gives these guys time to mature both mentally and physically as well as set them up to be closer to success than if they had just come into the league out of high school and failed....
 
#83
#83
JZVOL said:
No
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Cal is the better dressed basketball version of Fulmer. He out talents his competition for wins. When placed in an equal talent scenario or faces a better coach, he loses.

His practice reminds of Jerry Green, roll out the ball and enjoy yourselves. The only difference is Cal throws in some defense.
 
#84
#84
UT IE 95 said:
Cal is the better dressed basketball version of Fulmer. He out talents his competition for wins. When placed in an equal talent scenario or faces a better coach, he loses.

His practice reminds of Jerry Green, roll out the ball and enjoy yourselves. The only difference is Cal throws in some defense.
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I don't agree. Is he the best X's and O's coach? No. However people seem to conveniently forget what he did at UMASS and that he rebuilt Memphis.

In February 2010, Pat Forde ESPN.com, recalled the 1992 team:
“ Calipari's greatest strength as a coach is his ability to create teams that play together. His 1992 Massachusetts team remains one of the most overachieving units The Minutes has ever seen, featuring a shooting guard with range so limited he made one 3-pointer all season (Jim McCoy), a 6-foot-3 power forward (Will Herndon), and a left-handed center who stood all of 6-7 (Harper Williams). Somehow, that collection of marginal talent went 30-5 and advanced to the NCAA Sweet 16.”

You don't have to be the best X's and O's guy to be a great coach; there are plenty of other factors. Likewise a guy who is good at X's and O's isn't automatically a great head coach.
 
#85
#85
BasketvolsFan said:
The point is Cal doesn't develop players---he signs players that are already going to be drafted. Does the exposure at KY move them up--possibly. That is all that happens. This notion that Cal is the great developer of players is hogwash.
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Hopson would have been in the dribble-drive system with Cal's stamp of approval. Regardless of what you see from him in Pearl's system, he'd have been drafted out of Kentucky.
 
#86
#86
Incinigator said:
And I also ASSUME he hasn't won a NC or left behind NCAA issues at TWO programs after having "coached" as much NBA talent as any college coach in the last several years.

I question why the best kids in the nation want to go wherever he coaches. IMO, it's because it benefits cal first, the kids second, and the program du jour (uk, right now) third. Those priorities are not in the order that I would want for my favorite college program.
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World. Wide. Wes.
 
#87
#87
crusse10 said:
Hopson would have been in the dribble-drive system with Cal's stamp of approval. Regardless of what you see from him in Pearl's system, he'd have been drafted out of Kentucky.
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Hopson needs to learn how to dribble first.
 
#89
#89
crusse10 said:
Hopson would have been in the dribble-drive system with Cal's stamp of approval. Regardless of what you see from him in Pearl's system, he'd have been drafted out of Kentucky.
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You can pretend that Hopson would have been drafted out of KY, but the facts indicate otherwise. The dribble-drive would not work with Hopson as one of his major weaknesses is the ability to dribble drive. It usually results in a turnover. The dribble drive offers no more to recruits than other offenses. Fact is if you are able to recruit players that are draft ready out of high school, they remain draft ready after one year in college. That is the magic of Cal's coaching.
 
#90
#90
BasketvolsFan said:
You can pretend that Hopson would have been drafted out of KY, but the facts indicate otherwise. The dribble-drive would not work with Hopson as one of his major weaknesses is the ability to dribble drive. It usually results in a turnover. The dribble drive offers no more to recruits than other offenses. Fact is if you are able to recruit players that are draft ready out of high school, they remain draft ready after one year in college. That is the magic of Cal's coaching.
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I wonder how he got those 30 win seasons at UMASS then with one pro player (Camby) and led them to their first NCAA Tournament appearance in 30 years?
 
#91
#91
BasketvolsFan said:
You can pretend that Hopson would have been drafted out of KY, but the facts indicate otherwise. The dribble-drive would not work with Hopson as one of his major weaknesses is the ability to dribble drive. It usually results in a turnover. The dribble drive offers no more to recruits than other offenses. Fact is if you are able to recruit players that are draft ready out of high school, they remain draft ready after one year in college. That is the magic of Cal's coaching.
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I understand that you want to hate him, but one of the 32 NBA teams would have taken a chance on Hopson whether or not you want to believe it.
 
#92
#92
BasketvolsFan said:
You can pretend that Hopson would have been drafted out of KY, but the facts indicate otherwise. The dribble-drive would not work with Hopson as one of his major weaknesses is the ability to dribble drive. It usually results in a turnover. The dribble drive offers no more to recruits than other offenses. Fact is if you are able to recruit players that are draft ready out of high school, they remain draft ready after one year in college. That is the magic of Cal's coaching.
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That's not totally true. It allows athletic guards (Rose, Evans, Wall) to showcase their skills with it's style of play where say Izzo's or Howland's methodical style does not.

Besides Cal still runs plays (entry sets to initiate the offense) and last year he ran the DDM less because of Cousins.
 
#93
#93
crusse10 said:
I understand that you want to hate him, but one of the 32 NBA teams would have taken a chance on Hopson whether or not you want to believe it.
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I absolutely do not hate Hopson. He has great potential, but hasn't developed yet. I, as much as anyone, would like to see him improve and develop into the best player he can be. But the fact is, if one of the 32 NBA teams wanted to take a chance on him, he would have been drafted. Being at KY would not have made him more draftable. That is the only point I am making.
 
#94
#94
JZVOL said:
That's not totally true. It allows athletic guards (Rose, Evans, Wall) to showcase their skills with it's style of play where say Izzo's or Howland's methodical style does not.

Besides Cal still runs plays (entry sets to initiate the offense) and last year he ran the DDM less because of Cousins.
Click to expand...

I would agree that his offense allows more opportunity for athletic guards to showcase their skills than Izzo's or Howland's offense allows. Their offense is more structured and doesn't give players as much freedom to go one on one. However, great players are recognized by NBA scouts in any offense.
 
#95
#95
BasketvolsFan said:
I absolutely do not hate Hopson. He has great potential, but hasn't developed yet. I, as much as anyone, would like to see him improve and develop into the best player he can be. But the fact is, if one of the 32 NBA teams wanted to take a chance on him, he would have been drafted. Being at KY would not have made him more draftable. That is the only point I am making.
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1. I was referring to you hating Calipari
2. He would have been drafted if he was at Kentucky because he would have declared for the draft
 
#96
#96
BasketvolsFan said:
I would agree that his offense allows more opportunity for athletic guards to showcase their skills than Izzo's or Howland's offense allows. Their offense is more structured and doesn't give players as much freedom to go one on one. However, great players are recognized by NBA scouts in any offense.
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Darren Collison had to go 3 years before he was drafted in the 20s. Go back to the last draft and tell me if he isn't drafted in the top 10.
 
#97
#97
BasketvolsFan said:
I would agree that his offense allows more opportunity for athletic guards to showcase their skills than Izzo's or Howland's offense allows. Their offense is more structured and doesn't give players as much freedom to go one on one. However, great players are recognized by NBA scouts in any offense.
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I agree but for a one and done Cal's style is more attractive because it will highlight their skill set more.
 
#98
#98
BasketvolsFan said:
You just don't understand. These players want to play for Cal because he "develops" them into NBA players. UT would have had 5 go in the first round this year if Cal had been coaching them. He is a great developer of talent---Folks just think that he is a great recruiter. Actually, he signs marginal players and they become first round picks after a year in his system.
Click to expand...

BasketvolsFan said:
You can pretend that Hopson would have been drafted out of KY, but the facts indicate otherwise. The dribble-drive would not work with Hopson as one of his major weaknesses is the ability to dribble drive. It usually results in a turnover. The dribble drive offers no more to recruits than other offenses. Fact is if you are able to recruit players that are draft ready out of high school, they remain draft ready after one year in college. That is the magic of Cal's coaching.
Click to expand...

Does he develop "marginal" players or acquire draft ready players ?

BasketvolsFan said:
I absolutely do not hate Hopson. He has great potential, but hasn't developed yet. I, as much as anyone, would like to see him improve and develop into the best player he can be. But the fact is, if one of the 32 NBA teams wanted to take a chance on him, he would have been drafted. Being at KY would not have made him more draftable. That is the only point I am making.
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I thought that you declared that cal develops marginal players for the NBA.

BasketvolsFan said:
I would agree that his offense allows more opportunity for athletic guards to showcase their skills than Izzo's or Howland's offense allows. Their offense is more structured and doesn't give players as much freedom to go one on one. However, great players are recognized by NBA scouts in any offense.
Click to expand...

IMO, in today's NBA, the NBA drafts on potential first and size/athletic ability second. Actual, basketball skills and achievement(team/individual) seem to be pretty far down the list. At least cal seems to be on the same page with the NBA regarding player evaluation.

Nice to see cal is looking to bring the poor quality of NBA basketball with the world's best athletes into top level of college basketball.
 
#99
#99
Incinigator said:
Should/will cal then recruit some kids that will stay beyond one year in order to have the non-freshmen that you believe are needed to win an NC ? And how many does he need ? Is he willing to sacrifice and pass on some "one and dones" and then actually develop a team capable of winning the NC ?

That would require high quality coaching and ego management versus the current model of letting the NBA talent just play, the preseason expectations be high, planning for postseaon underachievement, and then touting your players' NBA draft record ?

Sounds to me like an excuse...a well constructed excuse.
Click to expand...

Are you by chance related to MHF?
 
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