Cases of West and Jurick, my take

#52
#52
hatvol96 said:
His peers think he's trash and have no problem reciting the reasons they think so at length. Pretty much nobody who has been in a league where he was a head coach or assistant has the first modicum of respect for him. That's good enough for me.
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So other coaches don't like him and that means he has poor character. Whatever.

Regardless... no facts or examples. You can choose not to like the guy, but lets not pretend that their are "plenty" of examples floating around that support your cause.
 
#53
#53
vol_freak said:
But Tennessee had nothing to do with him not getting in school and wasting a year of eligibility. Blame it on West or the NCAA but not Tennessee.

What was the lie to his HS coach? Regarding West being in good shape?
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You know what, with the way they wrongly advised Gerald Williams to take an online course that the SEC was outlawing and the way they drug their feet in getting Brandon Warren's paperwork together this summer, I'm not so sure the UT compliance office doesn't bare some responsibility, in that they should have been fully aware of what West's academic situation was last summer and even more importantly, should have been aware of their APR situation with all of the dismissals that had occured in the previous season. And not only that, but Pearl had all summer (including Rocky Top League) and a few practices in October to gage whether West could contribute to the team and still lead him to believe that he would have a scholarship available to him in 2009.

The lie to his coach was that his HS coach confronted Pearl in Detroit during the Final Four and Pearl told him that West had a spot. Listen to the interview on the link I posted earlier in the thread....
 
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#54
#54
hatvol96 said:
His peers think he's trash and have no problem reciting the reasons they think so at length. Pretty much nobody who has been in a league where he was a head coach or assistant has the first modicum of respect for him. That's good enough for me.
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I follow your logic . . . but it's kind of funny seeing you play the "people don't like him" card.
 
#55
#55
hatvol96 said:
So, the coaching staff and compliance can't figure out the APR? That's encouraging.
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I have no idea. I'm thinking out loud. But it surely doesn't seem like the hit was expected... and that is definitely scary.

Surely that can't be??
 
#56
#56
vol_freak said:
So other coaches don't like him and that means he has poor character. Whatever.

Regardless... no facts or examples. You can choose not to like the guy, but lets not pretend that their are "plenty" of examples floating around that support your cause.
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Anyone who has ever recruited against him consistently puts him in the same category with Kelvin Sampson. That speaks volumes.
 
#57
#57
vol_freak said:
I have no idea. I'm thinking out loud. But it surely doesn't seem like the hit was expected... and that is definitely scary.

Surely that can't be??
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I think everyone knows how low a regard I have for this coaching staff and UT's compliance guys. That said, I find it hard to believe they're that lost.
 
#58
#58
"He's gonna make it academically, but... he's not gonna make it." :mf_surrender: :eek:lol:
 
#60
#60
hatvol96 said:
The fact they have no respect for him is the more telling issue to me.
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Like I said, I follow the logic. Don't basketball guys tend to backbite more than just about any sport though?
 
#61
#61
Rasputin_Vol said:
You know what, with the way they wrongly advised Gerald Williams to take an online course that the SEC was outlawing and the way the drug their feet in getting Brandon Warren's paperwork together this summer, I'm not so sure the UT compliance office doesn't bare some responsibility, in that they should have been fully aware of what West's academic situation was last summer and even more importantly, should have been aware of their APR situation with all of the dismissals that had occured in the previous season. And not only that, but Pearl had all summer (including Rocky Top League) and a few practices in October to gage whether West could contribute to the team and still lead him to believe that he would have a scholarship available to him in 2009.

The lie to his coach was that his HS coach confronted Pearl in Detroit during the Final Four and Pearl told him that West had a spot. Listen to the interview on the link I posted earlier in the thread....
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I'll grant that it is possible that our compliance office could have been partially responsible. But the way I heard it, it was a simple matter of the NCAA flagging a test score...after he was accepted and enrolled.

I don't believe it's as cut and dry as Pearl evaluating him and not wanting him around. He wanted him... for the 2008 season -- when we needed a point guard. Once he was declared ineligible things changed. The staff says they encouraged West to attend junior college but he was already in school at Tennessee and agreed to say and try to earn a spot in 09.

Look, if Pearl told West and his coach that he would be guaranteed a spot on the roster if he paid his way for a year, then Pearl is in the wrong. I'm just not sure that's the case regardless of what West's high school coach says.
 
#62
#62
If they knew that they couldn't use him or if they were just keeping him as a wild card, then they did this kid wrong. They should have told him in no uncertain terms that he would not have a spot in 09.

Why did he stay around and fork out $20,000? Why did the community of Saginaw pony up some of that money to help him stay? Why won't Pearl return the phone calls of West's mom or his high school coach?
 
#63
#63
GAVol said:
Like I said, I follow the logic. Don't basketball guys tend to backbite more than just about any sport though?
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To an extent, but there is still usually mutual respect. I'm pretty sure, for example, Bob Huggins and Pete Gillen still wouldn't spit on the other if they caught fire. However, they grudgingly gave the other guy credit. Pearl doesn't get much of that.
 
#64
#64
hatvol96 said:
Anyone who has ever recruited against him consistently puts him in the same category with Kelvin Sampson. That speaks volumes.
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Good for them. I don't like most people I complete with. Unless you want to provide some names and exact quotes and instances, that's just not going to convince me.

hatvol96 said:
I think everyone knows how low a regard I have for this coaching staff and UT's compliance guys. That said, I find it hard to believe they're that lost.
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I don't think they could be that lost either. I guess I'm just surprised that this wasn't dealt with or brought up before the APR was actually announced. It's just odd I guess.
 
#65
#65
vol_freak said:
Look, if Pearl told West and his coach that he would be guaranteed a spot on the roster if he paid his way for a year, then Pearl is in the wrong. I'm just not sure that's the case regardless of what West's high school coach says.
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From all indications so far, this Goines kid is marginally a Division I point guard. So it's essentially a push. Why give a scholarship to Goines when you've got a guy that sacrificed a year and $20,000?
 
#66
#66
Daddy Gee said:
If they knew that they couldn't use him or if they were just keeping him as a wild card, then they did this kid wrong. They should have told him in no uncertain terms that he would not have a spot in 09.

Why did he stay around and fork out $20,000? Why did the community of Saginaw pony up some of that money to help him stay? Why won't Pearl return the phone calls of West's mom or his high school coach?
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He was already enrolled and wanted to stay in hopes of making the team in 09. If Tyler Smith goes pro and there are no APR hits, maybe he makes the team.

Pearl not returning calls is their word against his. I would think they would have called Mike Hamilton after a day or two if that was the case.
 
#68
#68
Rasputin_Vol said:
From all indications so far, this Goines kid is marginally a Division I point guard. So it's essentially a push. Why give a scholarship to Goines when you've got a guy that sacrificed a year and $20,000?
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That's the million dollar question. I have no idea. I don't believe it's that simple.
 
#71
#71
vol_freak said:
I guess I'm just surprised that this wasn't dealt with or brought up before the APR was actually announced. It's just odd I guess.
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It's not odd... it's just another indictment on the UT compliance office. It is a Chinese fire drill over there...
 
#72
#72
Pearl really has his hands tied -- it's a lose lose situation. He's not allowed to come out and talk about the kids academics and may chose not to bring up other things that could discredit West. I'm not saying that's the case, just there is likely more to the story than we know.

But, again, if Pearl promised West a scholarship in 09 and told his coach he was in, and that's all there is to it, then Pearl is in the wrong. I just don't believe it to be true.
 
#73
#73
vol_freak said:
He was already enrolled and wanted to stay in hopes of making the team in 09. If Tyler Smith goes pro and there are no APR hits, maybe he makes the team.

Pearl not returning calls is their word against his. I would think they would have called Mike Hamilton after a day or two if that was the case.
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How hard would it be for someone to print out a list of outgoing and ingoing phone calls to a particular number in 2009? I would be willing to bet that if their claims are true, they could easily get that information...
 
#74
#74
hatvol96 said:
What good would that have done?
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I don't know that it would have done any good, but if all accusations are true, I would escalate the situation and take it up with Pearl's boss, the AD. Wouldn't you?
 
#75
#75
Rasputin_Vol said:
How hard would it be for someone to print out a list of outgoing and ingoing phone calls to a particular number in 2009? I would be willing to bet that if their claims are true, they could easily get that information...
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I'm sure they could, but I haven't seen it. Have you? :)
 
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