China Thread

#152
#152
82_VOL_83 said:
What pray tell is the base 10 metric system?
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Base Ten Definition

and then this extrapolates that

The Metric System

While it may be somewhat of a costly endeavor, the US needs to move to Metric sooner than later. The military uses it. Engineering uses it. The entire world uses it and we're further antiquating ourselves by not adopting it and requiring costly and time-consuming unit conversions between ourselves and our largest trading partners.
 
#154
#154
volprof said:
Contrary to the thinking of some, the Bretton Woods system has been relatively beneficial.

Sure, it's a bribery scheme, but the US deserves something for keeping all ocean-bound international freight open and safe from pirates and/or hostile nations.

China would be relatively powerless without it. Like I said, we created the monster. We can take it down if need be.

If I were China, I wouldn't bite the hand that feeds me.

But, as we know, humans are not always rational creatures.
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What about the Bretton Woods system is still beneficial? My understanding was the key part of the Bretton Woods agreement was the dollar's fixed exchange rate with gold. That exchange rate went out the window when we defaulted in the 70s. So what's left of the Bretton Woods agreement?
 
#156
#156
Velo Vol said:
Powerless against whom? The Barbary pirates?
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Just in China's maritime trade neighborhood? Well, let's see:

South Korea
Japan
Taiwan
The Philippines
Vietnam
Malaysia
Indonesia
Singapore

I have a feeling that China's Middle East/Indian Ocean trade would also be somewhat jeopardized as well, what with a factional Middle East, an historic rival in India, and, you guessed it, Somali pirates.
 
#157
#157
red butler said:
What about the Bretton Woods system is still beneficial? My understanding was the key part of the Bretton Woods agreement was the dollar's fixed exchange rate with gold. That exchange rate went out the window when we defaulted in the 70s. So what's left of the Bretton Woods agreement?
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All I know is that the last half-century has seen the most general, wide-ranging prosperity in human history. And no wars between major powers, unlike the "once a decade" imperial system that existed before.

You're right. Bretton, erstwhile high school dreamboy, may very well have transitioned to balding, pudgy middle-age.

It will be interesting to see what the Chinese currency challenge, which seems to promise more stability will have to offer.

And as long as the American taxpayer is still bankrolling world trade (while having foreign nincompoops constantly berating us), I'm sure things will still be relatively okay for most, particularly the Chinese, who basically use us like two dollar whores.
 
#158
#158
volprof said:
Just in China's maritime trade neighborhood? Well, let's see:

South Korea
Japan
Taiwan
The Philippines
Vietnam
Malaysia
Indonesia
Singapore

I have a feeling that China's Middle East/Indian Ocean trade would also be somewhat jeopardized as well, what with a factional Middle East, an historic rival in India, and, you guessed it, Somali pirates.
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China would probably manage just fine patrolling the waters without us. U.S. Exposes China
 
#159
#159
red butler said:
What about the Bretton Woods system is still beneficial? My understanding was the key part of the Bretton Woods agreement was the dollar's fixed exchange rate with gold. That exchange rate went out the window when we defaulted in the 70s. So what's left of the Bretton Woods agreement?
Click to expand...

The only parts of the Bretton Woods system that remain are the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund.

The fixed exchange rates established at Bretton Woods plus the US dollar pegged to a fixed price of gold, was doomed from the start.

As a footnote:

The "fixed exchange rates" were not truly fixed; there was a mechanism for individual countries to make adjustments. The pegged price of gold was also not an absolute as the US changed the dollar-to-gold ratio twice; but, that did not resolve the problems of the system.
 
#160
#160
volprof said:
Just in China's maritime trade neighborhood? Well, let's see:

South Korea
Japan
Taiwan
The Philippines
Vietnam
Malaysia
Indonesia
Singapore
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Other than Japan, which of the above even has the resources to threaten Chinese shipping? And how would it benefit them to do so?
 
#161
#161
Velo Vol said:
Other than Japan, which of the above even has the resources to threaten Chinese shipping? And how would it benefit them to do so?
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to be fair even 1 small ship can cause a snare in shipping. you figure 30 armed trained guys can take over any civilian ship, kill the crew, plant a bomb below the waterline and scuttle the ship. in and out before the Chinese get there. hole shipment goes down, millions if not billions in losses from a single incident and wahlah.
 
#162
#162
Abe Hoffman said:
The only parts of the Bretton Woods system that remain are the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund.

The fixed exchange rates established at Bretton Woods plus the US dollar pegged to a fixed price of gold, was doomed from the start.

As a footnote:

The "fixed exchange rates" were not truly fixed; there was a mechanism for individual countries to make adjustments. The pegged price of gold was also not an absolute as the US changed the dollar-to-gold ratio twice; but, that did not resolve the problems of the system.
Click to expand...

I think your information is incorrect, but I'm not an expert so I'll throw out my opinion. Yes, the US changed the dollar-to-gold ratio twice, but that was prior to the Bretton Woods agreement. I also agree the dollar peg was doomed from the start, but that's because the government can't be trusted and it printed more money than it had gold to cover. Individual countries did have leeway to adjust their ratio against the dollar, but the dollar was supposed to remain fixed. The fact is our government defaulted and rather than give the rest of the world our gold, we simply closed the gold convertibility window.

I'll add that dismissing a stable currency as "doomed from the start" is one of the reasons we're in the mess we're in. It's essentially saying it's ok for the government to steal from all of us by constantly devaluing the purchasing power of our wages. I realize the government gave the responsibility for monetary policy to the banks a long time ago, but the point is still the same.
 
#163
#163
LouderVol said:
to be fair even 1 small ship can cause a snare in shipping. you figure 30 armed trained guys can take over any civilian ship, kill the crew, plant a bomb below the waterline and scuttle the ship. in and out before the Chinese get there. hole shipment goes down, millions if not billions in losses from a single incident and wahlah.
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Don't need aircraft carriers, submarines, battleships, missiles to deal with this threat.
 
#164
#164
red butler said:
I think your information is incorrect, but I'm not an expert so I'll throw out my opinion. Yes, the US changed the dollar-to-gold ratio twice, but that was prior to the Bretton Woods agreement. I also agree the dollar peg was doomed from the start, but that's because the government can't be trusted and it printed more money than it had gold to cover. Individual countries did have leeway to adjust their ratio against the dollar, but the dollar was supposed to remain fixed. The fact is our government defaulted and rather than give the rest of the world our gold, we simply closed the gold convertibility window.

I'll add that dismissing a stable currency as "doomed from the start" is one of the reasons we're in the mess we're in. It's essentially saying it's ok for the government to steal from all of us by constantly devaluing the purchasing power of our wages. I realize the government gave the responsibility for monetary policy to the banks a long time ago, but the point is still the same.
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At the time of the Brenton Woods Agreement, the Dollar was pegged at $35 per ounce. This was changed to $38 in 1971 and in 1973 it was raised to $42.22 per ounce. A few months after the second increase, the Dollar was floated ending the futile attempt to tie the currency to gold.
 
#165
#165
Abe Hoffman said:
At the time of the Brenton Woods Agreement, the Dollar was pegged at $35 per ounce. This was changed to $38 in 1971 and in 1973 it was raised to $42.22 per ounce. A few months after the second increase, the Dollar was floated ending the futile attempt to tie the currency to gold.
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Thanks I didn't know that. Based on the timing of the adjustments it's clear we knew the system was beginning to crack. That's about the same timeframe countries like France realized we were overprinting and they were converting their dollars into gold. But the point still stands, the system seemed to work until the government decided to overprint to pay for the Great Society and the Vietnam war.
 
#167
#167
Why is China goading all of its neighbors by building fake land territories in the middle of the South China Sea, hundreds of miles from Chinese shores and right in the backyards of other nations?

I've heard of creating facts on the ground but never of creating facts of ground. Literally. Who in the hell does that? China, I guess.

Oh, but we don't care about that, because US bad, everyone else good.

Did I get that right?
 
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#168
#168
volprof said:
Why is China goading all of its neighbors by building fake land territories in the middle of the South China Sea, hundreds of miles from Chinese shores and right in the backyards of other nations?
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I don't see why they'd do that unless they want a battle. Maybe they're hoping for a short war in which they can annex other countries.
 
#169
#169
volprof said:
Why is China goading all of its neighbors by building fake land territories in the middle of the South China Sea, hundreds of miles from Chinese shores and right in the backyards of other nations?

I've heard of creating facts on the ground but never of creating facts of ground. Literally. Who in the hell does that? China, I guess.

Oh, but we don't care about that, because US bad, everyone else good.

Did I get that right?
Click to expand...

Because they know there won't be any repercussions ...duh
 
#170
#170
Pacer92 said:
What good is a thread unless there is some good ole global research to shed some light on things?

Pivot Insanity: Why is Obama Goading China? | Global Research - Centre for Research on Globalization
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Fact checking. China has seized numerous vessels and blown a couple up too. That's about half the issue between them and Vietnam and the Philippines.

Also like the bit about isolation, intimidation and confrontation. Too bad trade continues to increase and we have nothing to isolate China, if anything we continue to push them into the global stage. Intimidation, is it worse coming from the SoD or from their navy? And confrontation China has fired warning shots at our ships. It was in some of the articles I linked.

Again with the color revolutions and ignoring that China already has these revolts/protests going on. I have gone through the reasons China will face internal problems in this thread, but it must be Americas fault because it never works out for america.

And its all about the money. Thats not a great revelation. I forget who said it but: "the sinews of war are: gold, gold, gold." Money makes the whole world go round, not just the us. And if you paid attention to half my article in this thread you would see that China isn't acting out of any bodies interest but their own.
 
#171
#171
This is why the Obama administration is making a general nuisance of itself in the South China Sea. It’s so the big US mega-corporations will have new customers for their IPADs and toaster ovens.

For that, they are willing to risk a nuclear war.
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These articles are so insightful.
 
#174
#174
LouderVol said:
Fact checking. China has seized numerous vessels and blown a couple up too. That's about half the issue between them and Vietnam and the Philippines.

Also like the bit about isolation, intimidation and confrontation. Too bad trade continues to increase and we have nothing to isolate China, if anything we continue to push them into the global stage. Intimidation, is it worse coming from the SoD or from their navy? And confrontation China has fired warning shots at our ships. It was in some of the articles I linked.

Again with the color revolutions and ignoring that China already has these revolts/protests going on. I have gone through the reasons China will face internal problems in this thread, but it must be Americas fault because it never works out for america.

And its all about the money. Thats not a great revelation. I forget who said it but: "the sinews of war are: gold, gold, gold." Money makes the whole world go round, not just the us. And if you paid attention to half my article in this thread you would see that China isn't acting out of any bodies interest but their own.
Click to expand...

The anti-American hate by the loudmouth Internet fringe has gotten to the point that I might actually welcome the US no longer being the world hegemon solely for the opportunity to be the biggest loudmouth anti-whoever comes after us troll on the web.

I will make these current loudmouths look relatively sane in comparison. I will be the most obnoxious poster on the Internet, linking unfounded "research" and idiotic claims all day and all night.

The revenge will be bittersweet, but at least it will have been taken.
 
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