Coach Kellie Harper

[SGMVols]

She objectively is… next

Again what are your requirements for the “next” coach

The record book doesn’t agree.

 

[SGMVols]

Complete and utter b.s. Or else you're unaware of the complete off the court shambles the program was in under Holly. I know culture stuff doesn't win trophies, but it is important. And Holly let that get away from her to an alarming degree. Kellie restored that heroically. Doesn't mean she'll keep her job, but let's give credit where credit is due.

Folks love talking about things that Pat never would have stood for, Well fist fighting in the dorm and parents social media fighting in public were among those. Kellie cleaned all that up.

Be fair. And due to the small matter of Rickea's injury. But I do agree, if the scheduling doesn't ease up next year it is crazy.

You are what your record says you are. I just posted Kellie’s and Holly’s record at UT side by side.

 

[glv98]

You are what your record says you are. I just posted Kellie’s and Holly’s record at UT side by side.

Well that's one minimalist, nilihist way to view it. Trophy chase and culture be damned. I went to games for 20 yrs then stopped bc Holly's last few teams were so visably don't give a sh*t and divisive I couldn't bare to watch. I swear you can still do both, Rick Barnes does.

I think I need a new hobby. This has all gotten so cut throat and nasty.

 

[Dadof2Vols]

Real world: two things can be true. Poor Kellie absolutely owns every agonizing close but not quite moment this devastating year delivered. And also owns credit for getting a vastly under talented/under achieving team to that threshold. And holding them together as a cohesive unit.

If I live to be 1000, I will never understand the absolute glee of the gravedancers. Just me I guess, but my overwhelming feeling in all this is sympathy for two women: Kellie and Rickea. The queens of shoulda, coulda, woulda. Doesn't mean any part of any of it is not their faults, but both also got royally screwed by the universe this season.

So she had the players to compete! It is coaches job to get it out of them day and game after game,

I am not a gravedancer/fire/keep. I don’t see through orange or rose colored glasses.

I make my living by looking at problems holistically and not through any kind of bias lens.

This program has serious issues. Can Kellie fix them, that’s up to DW. What I feel comfortable in saying is they underperformed and things have to change.

 

[spojo13]

Well that's one minimalist, nilihist way to view it. Trophy chase and culture be damned. I went to games for 20 yrs then stopped bc Holly's last few teams were so visably don't give a sh*t and divisive I couldn't bare to watch. I swear you can still do both, Rick Barnes does.

I think I need a new hobby. This has all gotten so cut throat and nasty.

I honestly wish the culture would have paid off in more wins. No doubt that the culture is better, but I think you are seeing where college athletics is going. It’s a big business these days, and unfortunately just like in corporate America, the results are what are being looked at. I think her culture is probably why Danny will bring her back. You are going to give a leader with a better culture more grace without results, but eventually the results have to be there.

 

[madtownvol]

You are what your record says you are. I just posted Kellie’s and Holly’s record at UT side by side.

And in those first few years, when Holly was winning conference titles and coach of the year, people on this board were calling for her to be fired. I was a Holly supporter in those first 4-5 years because she was doing a good job keeping the program at a steady state post-Pat. In the prior 4 seasons, the LVs had been hitting the elite ceiling and that is where Holly kept things.

What we know in hindsight is that the whole thing fell apart once, players like Cierra Burdick, who had internalized the CPS culture, left. And it went bad fast—players calling out coaches in the media, fist fights among team mates, social media wars between parents and coaches (and who knows what else).

Holly inherited a program still shaped by the legacy of CPS. Kellie inherited a train wreck.

Context matters!!

 

[Majors]

And in those first few years, when Holly was winning conference titles and coach of the year, people on this board were calling for her to be fired. I was a Holly supporter in those first 4-5 years because she was doing a good job keeping the program at a steady state post-Pat. In the prior 4 seasons, the LVs had been hitting the elite ceiling and that is where Holly kept things.

What we know in hindsight is that the whole thing fell apart once, players like Cierra Burdick, who had internalized the CPS culture, left. And it went bad fast—players calling out coaches in the media, fist fights among team mates, social media wars between parents and coaches (and who knows what else).

Holly inherited a program still shaped by the legacy of CPS. Kellie inherited a train wreck.

Context matters!!

Kellies best years were Holly’s players/recruits. Nice gift left to her

 

[madtownvol]

Well that's one minimalist, nilihist way to view it. Trophy chase and culture be damned. I went to games for 20 yrs then stopped bc Holly's last few teams were so visably don't give a sh*t and divisive I couldn't bare to watch. I swear you can still do both, Rick Barnes does.

I think I need a new hobby. This has all gotten so cut throat and nasty.

Don't leave glv98!!! Posters are not representative. It is pretty well documented fact that disgruntled factions post more than people who are generally content. Many people come to this board to vent frustrations (and some to troll of course).

Its funny how many of these same posters who are now holding up Holly as emblem of coaching success were calling for her head when she had the job (even in those early good years).

It is hard to completely understand the vitriol.

I think there is a faction for whom no one will ever, ever replaced Pat Summitt (I can certainly get that).

Some still cling to the idea that the Lady Vol brand has the same cachet as it did back in the 1990s and the Meeks era (when the program was at its peak, sorry Candace).

I think there is a faction that dislikes (for political reasons), the LVs continuing the tradition of having a woman head coach and want a man in charge.

I am pulling hard for Kellie but its kind of getting to be high noon time for her.

I think people don't realize that her clock is ticking and the pressure is mounting whether or not posters on this board are calling for blood or hoping for her to turn it around. People like to believe they have more control over circumstances than they actually do.

Kellie is paid well. So she is fair game. I just hate it when posters turn on the players (fortunately, that is not so common).

 

[VolBall09]

Well that's one minimalist, nilihist way to view it. Trophy chase and culture be damned. I went to games for 20 yrs then stopped bc Holly's last few teams were so visably don't give a sh*t and divisive I couldn't bare to watch. I swear you can still do both, Rick Barnes does.

I think I need a new hobby. This has all gotten so cut throat and nasty.

It’ll blow over. This is just a contentious time around here. We don’t all always agree. This too shall pass. I appreciate what you bring to the board.

I know I rub you the wrong way a lot, but I appreciate you contributions.

 

[madtownvol]

Kellies best years were Holly’s players/recruits. Nice gift left to her

Last years season S16 was almost all Kellie recruits. Key was out; Jordan Horston was very important but so was RJ and everyone else, along with RJ, were Kellie's. the year before, it was Sara Puckett who hit the game winner that got them to the S16.

Good god man, you can't give Kellie credit for anything, can you?

Perhaps you are a bot programmed to flood the web with anti-Kellie narratives.

 

[VolFuture]

Last years season S16 was almost all Kellie recruits. Key was out; Jordan Horston was very important but so was RJ and everyone else, along with RJ, were Kellie's. the year before, it was Sara Puckett who hit the game winner that got them to the S16.

Good god man, you can't give Kellie credit for anything, can you?

Perhaps you are a bot programmed to flood the web with anti-Kellie narratives.

There’s a reason I have about 5 posters muted. I can’t stand the shots at our players. Phoenix being the worst I wish he was banned

 

[Volfan2012]

You are what your record says you are. I just posted Kellie’s and Holly’s record at UT side by side.

What you didn't say is Holly's record with Pat's players and when she needed to start playing with her own like year four through seven. You compare those four years you get a different perspective. Not defending Kellie's record, but she did not inherit a very good roster from Holly and still managed to do better than what Holly did her last year with what Holly left her the next season. Holly was not the answer and neither is Kellie it appears. The problem with comparing is Kellie sure would've liked to have those roster Holly had those first three seasons.

 

[glv98]

Ya'll are sweet, but I really didn't mean this board. I know what that brings. I meant LV bball as a whole. I'll never not care or be interested, or even go to a few games. But it's kind of a natural time for me to rethink with game buddy going off to school next Jan (boo hoo hoo). Also, this year has been far more bitterly disappointing for both of us than I meant for any athletic season to be. We put a whole lot of hopes, clearly too much, into this one last ride, esp with our favorite player coming back for the ride as well. We're trying to internalize that you can't enjoy the thrill of victory as much without the occassional agony of defeat, but this sh*t has been way over agonizing.

Moreso, the whole landscape of college sports has just gotten gross. Started with the divisive crap in the FF last spring, and now all this NIL stuff. Like so much in life, and espec like in politics, the emergence of money as the overwhelming driving force is ruining it. I totally believe the players deserve a salary. No way the coaches and schools should walk away with it all. OTOH, Caitlin Clark (or anyone) getting ANOTHER 5 mil just today in a world where children are starving just feels like a world I don't want to play in anymore. The priorities, or lack thereof, are stunning. Think how 5 mil could totally change the lives of so many.

I don't think these most extreme NIL things will last, and I don't think our bitter disappointment will last. But right now it's just not very much fun. And if game buddy and I feel that way, I can only imagine how those directly involved must feel.

 

[Volfan2012]

Ya'll are sweet, but I really didn't mean this board. I know what that brings. I meant LV bball as a whole. I'll never not care or be interested, or even go to a few games. But it's kind of a natural time for me to rethink with game buddy going off to school next Jan (boo hoo hoo). Also, this year has been far more bitterly disappointing for both of us than I meant for any athletic season to be. We put a whole lot of hopes, clearly too much, into this one last ride, esp with our favorite player coming back for the ride as well. We're trying to internalize that you can't enjoy the thrill of victory as much without the occassional agony of defeat, but this sh*t has been way over agonizing.

Moreso, the whole landscape of college sports has just gotten gross. Started with the divisive crap in the FF last spring, and now all this NIL stuff. Like so much in life, and espec like in politics, the emergence of money as the overwhelming driving force is ruining it. I totally believe the players deserve a salary. No way the coaches and schools should walk away with it all. OTOH, Caitlin Clark (or anyone) getting ANOTHER 5 mil today in a world where children are starving just feels like a world I don't want to play in anymore. The priorities, or lack thereof, are stunning. Think how 5 mil could totally change the lives of so many.

I don't think these most extreme NIL things will last, and I don't think our bitter disappointment will last. But right now it's just not very much fun. And if game buddy and I feel that way, I can only imagine how those directly involved must feel.

I tell ya if she doesn't make me happy with roster moves this portal season have to spend less time with the Lady Vols next season. Just not fun to watch us lose so much to teams we should be beating and I'm not talking about Sc but every other loss could've been a win and most of them should've been wins.

 

[glv98]

I tell ya if she doesn't make me happy with roster moves this portal season have to spend less time with the Lady Vols next season. Just not fun to watch us lose so much to teams we should be beating and I'm not talking about Sc but every other loss could've been a win and most of them should've been wins.

I don't blame specific shortcomings of coaching as much for feeling gutted as the epic bad luck and bad officiating that had us so close but so far away. It's not fun watching KJH suffer like she has. If we keep her, we have to help her.

The extra gut punch was Rickea getting so incredibly slighted bc of the injury and lack of winning. Her being so overlooked and esp not making AA was just the sh*tty icing on top of the turd cake. Feel like she deserved so much more.

That said, when the dust settles, I do feel good, as does RJ apparently, about her personal growth. I believe it was Lucy who said early last yr that Rickea would leave here with Kellie Harper either being the worst or the best thing that ever happened to her. Turned out to be the best.

Those are things we'll be able to appreciate more as the dust settles.

 

[Majors]

Last years season S16 was almost all Kellie recruits. Key was out; Jordan Horston was very important but so was RJ and everyone else, along with RJ, were Kellie's. the year before, it was Sara Puckett who hit the game winner that got them to the S16.

Good god man, you can't give Kellie credit for anything, can you?

Perhaps you are a bot programmed to flood the web with anti-Kellie narratives.

Almost, except #1A/1B Horston- HS AA/1st round WNBA and Key (unavailable)

 

[glv98]

Almost, except #1A/1B Horston- HS AA/1st round WNBA and Key (unavailable)

Same song, same verse, 10 millionth time. And why do you delight in doing this? You know well job 1 for KJH was the re-recruitment of Jordan Horston. And we all watched the painstaking process it took for KJH to make Jordy into the player she became. Talent was there, head was in outer space. Did you pay attention at all to the things Jordy said when she got drafted? She credited KJH for EVERYTHING, said a million times she could never have gotten drafted without her. Yet you know better that it was actually Holly Warlick's credit.

 

[Majors]

Same song, same verse, 10 millionth time. And why do you delight in doing this? You know well job 1 for KJH was the re-recruitment of Jordan Horston. And we all watched the painstaking process it took for KJH to make Jordy into the player she became. Talent was there, head was in outer space. Did you pay attention at all to the things Jordy said when she got drafted? She credited KJH for EVERYTHING, said a million times she could never have gotten drafted without her. Yet you know better that it was actually Holly Warlick's credit.

Which was why I stated HS AA. She was a outstanding player before she arrived. She adapted, but Holly leftover.

That was nice for her to say it. Just stating, it seems Holly didn’t leave the program in as bad of shape of many want to believe.

 

[Volfan2012]

I don't blame specific shortcomings of coaching as much for feeling gutted as the epic bad luck and bad officiating that had us so close but so far away. It's not fun watching KJH suffer like she has. If we keep her, we have to help her.

The extra gut punch was Rickea getting so incredibly slighted bc of the injury and lack of winning. Her being so overlooked and esp not making AA was just the sh*tty icing on top of the turd cake. Feel like she deserved so much more.

That said, when the dust settles, I do feel good, as does RJ apparently, about her personal growth. I believe it was Lucy who said early last yr that Rickea would leave here with Kellie Harper either being the worst or the best thing that ever happened to her. Turned out to be the best.

Those are things we'll be able to appreciate more as the dust settles.

The WNBA won't overlook her just watch that night. She will be either the third or fourth players chosen. My only sadness for Rickea is that she didn't have players surrounding her that could help more in getting wins. She puts up 33 points on 22 shots and the entire rest of the team goes for 39 on 38. We help the bad officiating by not making plays like free throws. Decisions with the basketball during games. I know it has been a tough season officiating is bad for everyone although seems we got more than our share this season. KJH can win here with a better roster and with better recruiting. Elite players make a lot of those bad Ref decisions go away cause were no longer on the edge of winning, but winning by enough that they don't matter.

 

[glv98]

The WNBA won't overlook her just watch that night. She will be either the third or fourth players chosen. My only sadness for Rickea is that she didn't have players surrounding her that could help more in getting wins. She puts up 33 points on 22 shots and the entire rest of the team goes for 39 on 38. We help the bad officiating by not making plays like free throws. Decisions with the basketball during games. I know it has been a tough season officiating is bad for everyone although seems we got more than our share this season. KJH can win here with a better roster and with better recruiting. Elite players make a lot of those bad Ref decisions go away cause were no longer on the edge of winning, but winning by enough that they don't matter.

I know RJ is about to get her due on draft day. I just hate the way her whole college career was kind of a cluster. It kind of mirrors KJH's tenure. Some her own fault, for sure, much just plain ole rotten luck.

 

[Volfan2012]

Which was why I stated HS AA. She was a outstanding player before she arrived. She adapted, but Holly leftover.

That was nice for her to say it. Just stating, it seems Holly didn’t leave the program in as bad of shape of many want to believe.

7 and 9 SEC and eighth place seems to say she did leave it in a very bad place. At least we haven't come close to finishing eighth in the league since, even if it hasn't been that good still tied for fourth is our worst finish. Hard to say she did not leave in a bad place with a losing SEC record and an eighth place finish.

 

[Voltopia]

Well that's one minimalist, nilihist way to view it. Trophy chase and culture be damned. I went to games for 20 yrs then stopped bc Holly's last few teams were so visably don't give a sh*t and divisive I couldn't bare to watch. I swear you can still do both, Rick Barnes does.

I think I need a new hobby. This has all gotten so cut throat and nasty.

Naaaaaaaaaah, you don't need a new hobby, you just have to keep in mind that a lot of this "I'm right/I told you so" stuff is an externalized emotional response from people processing the team's failure.

Being associating with winning is the most emotionally validating thing a typical sports fan experiences. But when you're associated with a loser or with losing, it's the opposite. The association doesn't give you that validation, and worse, it can turn people bitter toward the thing they associated with, because who likes being associated with a loser? And one of the most common coping mechanisms is self-validation through stuff like that "well we lost but I was right" or the "see I told you so" commentary, or through just out-and-out attacking the program to create a sense of distance. Jaded sports fans are something else, I tell you.

In short, they're using this board to cope. When you think about it, that's kind of funny. Actually, it's really funny. Worth a laugh or two if you ask me. So equally in short, don't let the negativity eat at you too much. Have a chuckle at the spectacle of human emotion in action, and let's see what the offseason brings.

 

[Majors]

7 and 9 SEC and eighth place seems to say she did leave it in a very bad place. At least we haven't come close to finishing eighth in the league since, even if it hasn't been that good still tied for fourth is our worst finish. Hard to say she did not leave in a bad place with a losing SEC record and an eighth place finish.

And she was let go. The roster was the stance, not Hollys record.

 

[Woodlawn VOL]

You are what your record says you are. I just posted Kellie’s and Holly’s record at UT side by side.

Holly’s problem was her last 4 years look like Kellie’s. She started going in the wrong direction at year 4 and kept going downhill. While both are VFL’s and have made big impacts at UT they just aren’t great head coaches. If Kellie gets another year I wish her luck but I just don’t see things turning around. Summitt was a great head coach and leader. I think White wanted Harper to succeed, whether she gets another year or not nobody can say she hasn’t had enough time to establish a identity and point to something this team does real well and does it with consistency. I am still trying to figure out what that one thing is. And that is not good. GBO!

 

[Volfan2012]

And she was let go. The roster was the stance, not Hollys record.

The next year we went 10 and 6 with that roster and finished third. So maybe the roster was not as bad as Holly's coaching even though two key players transferred.