COVID Relief Package

[Godfatha]

Remember it and do what? Both sides pushed this crap

Not much we can do as there really isn’t a viable alternative.

 

[utvolpj]

Not much we can do as there really isn’t a viable alternative.

Sure there is but it means you don't pull for a team anymore and you may lose for a while. Not many like that option

 

[Godfatha]

Sure there is but it means you don't pull for a team anymore and you may lose for a while. Not many like that option

Something I struggle with every election. In principle I agree with you. I don’t agree 100% with the Libertarian platform but I think it’s a platform I’m mostly aligned to and one that could be appealing to a majority of the country. They need a candidate who is well known, which would help negate the media bias toward a two party system. They’d have to appeal to fiscal conservatives or moderates who are offput with social conservatism.

 

[DancingOutlaw]

Something I struggle with every election. In principle I agree with you. I don’t agree 100% with the Libertarian platform but I think it’s a platform I’m mostly aligned to and one that could be appealing to a majority of the country. They need a candidate who is well known, which would help negate the media bias toward a two party system. They’d have to appeal to fiscal conservatives or moderates who are offput with social conservatism.

The problem with libertarianism is it espouses a little too much personal responsibility for the majority of our country.

 

[Sea Ray]

I haven't followed this bill to know if you're accurate with your numbers. I have no reason to doubt you because you seem to be an accurate poster.

Here's the issue. Spending and borrowing didn't just start when Biden took office. Look at the Rs when there is an R in the White House. R politicians do not have any moral high ground relative to debt, borrowing, and financing today's budget on the backs of our children, grandchildren, and great grandchildren.

I think there is only one fiscal conservative in DC and that's Rand Paul. There is no place for fiscal conservative voters right now. But the degree of craziness is different. In this case, the Dems spent 3x more than the most moderate R's. That's a significant amount of money

 

[utvolpj]

I think there is only one fiscal conservative in DC and that's Rand Paul. There is no place for fiscal conservative voters right now. But the degree of craziness is different. In this case, the Dems spent 3x more than the most moderate R's. That's a significant amount of money

Maybe because the repubs felt they had already spent enough with eip 1 & 2? Look at the past year of spending as a whole and then tell us someone deserves the high ground

 

[Sea Ray]

Maybe because the repubs felt they had already spent enough with eip 1 & 2? Look at the year of spending as a whole

If that's the case then I agree with them. We didn't need a third

 

[utvolpj]

If that's the case then I agree with them. We didn't need a third

Then how are you taking anyone to task over spending? It only makes sense if you're hyper partisan

 

[Sea Ray]

Then how are you taking anyone to task over spending? It only makes sense if you're hyper partisan

I said that there is nowhere for fiscal conservatives to go but the R's are much more fiscally conservative than the D's and I gave a most recent example. What is it about that statement that you disagree with?

 

[utvolpj]

I said that there is nowhere for fiscal conservatives to go but the R's are much more fiscally conservative than the D's and I gave a most recent example. What is it about that statement that you disagree with?

because you cherry picked your example. They weren't fiscal conservatives throughout the past year but now that flag is sure waving

is $2.2T>$1.9T

 

[McDad]

I said that there is nowhere for fiscal conservatives to go but the R's are much more fiscally conservative than the D's and I gave a most recent example. What is it about that statement that you disagree with?

The details the devil is in likely is your "much more" definition. The best arrangement for the past 20 years for reduced spending is a D president and R Congress. But even with those short lived scenarios, spending and debt grows far beyond inflation decade after decade.

 

[Sea Ray]

because you cherry picked your example. They fiscal conservatives throughout the past year but now that flag is sure waving

is $2.2T>$1.9T

It happens to be the most recent example thus it's pertinent. What does this mean?

is $2.2T>$1.9T

 

[Sea Ray]

The details the devil is in likely is your "much more" definition. The best arrangement for the past 20 years for reduced spending is a D president and R Congress. But even with those short lived scenarios, spending and debt grows far beyond inflation decade after decade.

I agree with your statement. Where do we disagree? It's best when R's control the purse strings

 

[utvolpj]

It happens to be the most recent example thus it's pertinent. What does this mean?

cost of first stim vs the one in your example

that's convenient if you want to ignore the ones posted by the gop this past year. Republicans only become fiscal conservatives when a Dem is in office

 

[Sea Ray]

cost of first stim vs the one in your example

that's convenient if you want to ignore the ones posted by the gop this past year. Republicans only become fiscal conservatives when a Dem is in office

The first stim was not a partisan bill It passed 96-0. I covered that with my comment that there's nowhere for fiscal conservatives to turn.

 

[McDad]

I agree with your statement. Where do we disagree? It's best when R's control the purse strings

It isn't though. R Congress + R president = no bueno.

 

[utvolpj]

The first stim was not a partisan bill It passed 96-0. I covered that with my comment that there's nowhere for fiscal conservatives to turn.

So every repub voted for it and a repub potus signed it. Where was the fiscal conservatism?

You claimed

But the degree of craziness is different.

Which is patently false

 

[AM64]

10 Republicans pushed for $600B. All the Dems pushed for $1.9T

Yeah, but remember which party and what policy the younger voters who will inherit the fiscal problem always support. And they still want government to bail out their school loan blunder. Maybe they should inherit the blunder party and the fiscal policies of the party they very much helped put in power; whether they will remember and own the "buyer's remorse" is to be determined. It should be a sin to allow people who haven't faced the reality of making a living and paying taxes to vote because they clearly don't understand the implications of their actions.

 

[Sea Ray]

So every repub voted for it and a repub potus signed it. Where was the fiscal conservatism?

You claimed



Which is patently false

Not at all. I don't know why you're not getting it:

The $2T stimulus was a wash when comparing parties. It was a totally bipartisan bill. There is no separation between the parties on that. Everyone was for it (except Rand Paul who abstained) . So if we're comparing parties, it's irrelevant except to say neither one is fiscally conservative (which I said many times).

If one is going to compare parties then you've got to pick issues where there's separation. A recent example is the $1.9T bill

 

[utvolpj]

Not at all. I don't know why you're not getting it:

The $2T stimulus was a wash when comparing parties. It was a totally bipartisan bill. There is no separation between the parties on that. Everyone was for it (except Rand Paul who abstained) . So if we're comparing parties, it's irrelevant except to say neither one is fiscally conservative (which I said many times).

If one is going to compare parties then you've got to pick issues where there's separation. A recent example is the $1.9T bill

No you don't when you have loads more data to use. A fiscal conservative stance would be consistent. It's not because there's a Dem party in charge. It's the only reason

 

[AM64]

I feel so bad for people my age (late 20s) and younger. I'm not sure how anyone will afford anything especially with what is happening to the housing market. Luckily I got locked into a good mortgage on a steal of a house before it went absolutely bonkers.

Remember the youngest voters are one of the blocs that keep the dems in power, and it's their liberal beliefs formed by lack of life experiences that form their political preferences. I'm sorry, but this falls into the category of be careful what you wish for.

 

[utvolpj]

Yeah, but remember which party and what policy the younger voters who will inherit the fiscal problem always support. And they still want government to bail out their school loan blunder. Maybe they should inherit the blunder party and the fiscal policies of the party they very much helped put in power; whether they will remember and own the "buyer's remorse" is to be determined. It should be a sin to allow people who haven't faced the reality of making a living and paying taxes to vote because they clearly don't understand the implications of their actions.

What is the average age of those wasting our tax dollars? Which party just spent 4yrs spending crazy amounts while their leader was claiming he didn't care about budgets? Neither side cares

 

[Sea Ray]

cost of first stim vs the one in your example

that's convenient if you want to ignore the ones posted by the gop this past year. Republicans only become fiscal conservatives when a Dem is in office

How many times do I have to type "there are no fiscal conservatives in DC anymore" before you'll get it? What you wrote above in bold goes against my words. If you're going to continue to not register what I write then it's a waste of my time to go back and forth with you

 

[AM64]

I haven't followed this bill to know if you're accurate with your numbers. I have no reason to doubt you because you seem to be an accurate poster.

Here's the issue. Spending and borrowing didn't just start when Biden took office. Look at the Rs when there is an R in the White House. R politicians do not have any moral high ground relative to debt, borrowing, and financing today's budget on the backs of our children, grandchildren, and great grandchildren.

It's a lot like stories you hear when parents divorce or separate. Each tries to outdo the other in buying their kid's affections. When one party starts handing out free stuff, the other invariably has to follow or simply turn it all over. If the electorate or a significant part of it can be bribed, there's little hope for a fiscally sound future. It takes a better electorate to get better politicians, so I think we're screwed.

 

[utvolpj]

How many times do I have to type "there are no fiscal conservatives in DC anymore" before you'll get it? What you wrote above in bold goes against my words. If you're going to continue to not register what I write then it's a waste of my time to go back and forth with you

Your claim is that one was worse than the other. Both love spending but the gop will pretend they don't when there's a Dem in office. They'll protest even harder when they know there's no chance of making a difference