David Climer Speaks a Truth

[OneManGang]

http://www.tennessean.com/article/2...28/Climer-Butch-Jones-right-coach-right-place

The decline of Tennessee football from excellence to mediocrity to near irrelevance has been going on for most of a decade. There is/was no way in hell Head Vol Butch Jones was going to be able to fix it in one year.

Climer is right, Next year is going to look a lot like this year. This isn't Philip Fulmer stepping up to be Head Vol in 1992 with a team loaded with talent he could build on and win big games doing so. This is John Majors arriving in 1977 to find that there were teams in the KIL with more - and better - D-1 talent than Tennessee boasted at the time. Combine that with the fact that Majors was able to operate largely free from recruiting restrictions and what you have is a multi-season process to rebuild the program.

I wrote this in 2003 and easily could have just re-posted it in 2008 or 2012:

After the Debacle in the Dome - otherwise known as the 2002 Peach Bowl, your humble scribe offered the following analysis:
Welcome, mi compadres to the 1970s. The long slide has begun and there’s not a whole heck of lot Coach Fulmer can do to arrest the swan-dive that is UT football.

ESPN, in their pre-game hype Saturday morning, referred to this as “Separation Saturday,” a day of big games that would begin the process of separating the elite teams from the merely good. Georgia completed the process of separating Tennessee from the elite teams of the Southeastern Conference. Indeed, given their performance in the last three games, (183 yards combined total net rushing) I would offer that the Vols are in danger of falling out of the middle of the SEC pack. I compare 2003 to 1974, the year before the wheels came off and two years before Bill Battle was excused from the premises.

If Head Vol Jones can get UT competitive in anything less than five years he should be named Coach of the Decade.

 

[CountVolcula]

He won't have that long

Heads will roll if no improvements are made after year 3

 

[vol-un-tear]

Next year will be a good look into the future. This legacy class will be winners before they graduate. Lots of talent on the way! GBO!!!

 

[gnm53108]

He won't have that long

Heads will roll if no improvements are made after year 3

3?

That would be 4 losses in a row to van...I cant even type that.

There will be stuff burning if Butch doesn't correct our little vandy problem next year.

 

[sjt18]

NO ONE... that I have seen has suggested it be fixed in one year. What we expected is that they would control and succeed at the things they could do. Being uncompetitive vs every good (and healthy) team UT played outside of USCe, losing to Vandy, and almost losing to USA... are failures that belong exclusively to THIS STAFF.

 

[Slydell]

BuJo, or anyone else will never have the long leash or number of years that Majors had.

 

[gnm53108]

BuJo, or anyone else will never have the long leash or number of years that Majors had.

It would have to be a favored son....Peyton maybe?

 

[GBOVOLS]

He won't have that long

Heads will roll if no improvements are made after year 3

We will see improvement in Three years. Sutton will be a junior, Vereen, North, Carr etc. We will be competitive before 5 years. I think he was being dramatic.

 

[tnvols72]

The best staff in the country defenders will Que in 3,2,1.....

For the record I like BJ but the OC and DC are pathetic

 

[sjt18]

I'm expecting a replay of Dooley and Fulmer. Year 3 is going to be do or die with a low probability of success. The only way he breaks that cycle is if they really are an elite staff that for some reason just didn't show it... AT ALL... this year.

The worst possible outcome for the future of the program if you are like me and want to see UT competing for championships would be if this plays out and Jones manages to win 6 or 7 games in '15... still underperforming the talent but enough to save his job.

The really scary thing about last year is that if Dooley had beaten one more team... he probably would not have been fired. If he had beaten two more... he definitely would not have. He would have underperformed the talent on his roster by 2 or 3 games... and still have been retained. It would have been terrible for the program... and would be if any future mediocre or worse coach did the same.

 

[Col_Cathcart]

NO ONE... that I have seen has suggested it be fixed in one year. What we expected is that they would control and succeed at the things they could do. Being uncompetitive vs every good (and healthy) team UT played outside of USCe, losing to Vandy, and almost losing to USA... are failures that belong exclusively to THIS STAFF.

UGA was relatively healthy when we played them.

I firmly believe that this year would have gone much differently if not for our rash of injuries at QB and losing Couch and Saulsberry for the year at DT. I'm hopeful for the future.

 

[TheManFromTenn]

Climer: Butch Jones, Tennessee Volunteers need time to rebuild | The Tennessean | tennessean.com

The decline of Tennessee football from excellence to mediocrity to near irrelevance has been going on for most of a decade. There is/was no way in hell Head Vol Butch Jones was going to be able to fix it in one year.

Climer is right, Next year is going to look a lot like this year. This isn't Philip Fulmer stepping up to be Head Vol in 1992 with a team loaded with talent he could build on and win big games doing so. This is John Majors arriving in 1977 to find that there were teams in the KIL with more - and better - D-1 talent than Tennessee boasted at the time. Combine that with the fact that Majors was able to operate largely free from recruiting restrictions and what you have is a multi-season process to rebuild the program.

I wrote this in 2003 and easily could have just re-posted it in 2008 or 2012:

If Head Vol Jones can get UT competitive in anything less than five years he should be named Coach of the Decade.

The 2002 Peach Bowl... Oh my! I was at that miserable game. Had some of the best seats I've ever had at the dome... 50 yard line, about 15 rows up.. perfect! Perfect to see that disaster!!! And, I was sitting next to a Maryland fan who just made my life suck more as the night went on... That really was the beginning of losing by large numbers:cray:

 

[sjt18]

BuJo, or anyone else will never have the long leash or number of years that Majors had.

You can't do it in this era. You either improve or you sink. There's no treading water for a few years then climbing with modern media and recruiting. UT NEEDS out of state recruits and MUST win to consistently get them.

 

[GBOVOLS]

NO ONE... that I have seen has suggested it be fixed in one year. What we expected is that they would control and succeed at the things they could do. Being uncompetitive vs every good (and healthy) team UT played outside of USCe, losing to Vandy, and almost losing to USA... are failures that belong exclusively to THIS STAFF.

These are the same players that almost lost to Troy last year and lost to Vandy badly. Two different staffs with similar results. What's the common variable? The players.

 

[gasguy98]

NO ONE... that I have seen has suggested it be fixed in one year. What we expected is that they would control and succeed at the things they could do. Being uncompetitive vs every good (and healthy) team UT played outside of USCe, losing to Vandy, and almost losing to USA... are failures that belong exclusively to THIS STAFF.

This.

 

[btate]

If Payton retires next year, bring him in as OC

 

[sjt18]

I'm hopeful for the future.

Help me then. What specific, tangible thing did this staff do this year besides a recruiting class that is highly ranked that suggests they are good enough to compete in the SEC?

They beat USCe and outcoached Richt. But those are far outweighed by bad losses and being outcoached by others with inferior teams.

 

[butchball13]

http://www.tennessean.com/article/2...28/Climer-Butch-Jones-right-coach-right-place

The decline of Tennessee football from excellence to mediocrity to near irrelevance has been going on for most of a decade. There is/was no way in hell Head Vol Butch Jones was going to be able to fix it in one year.

Climer is right, Next year is going to look a lot like this year. This isn't Philip Fulmer stepping up to be Head Vol in 1992 with a team loaded with talent he could build on and win big games doing so. This is John Majors arriving in 1977 to find that there were teams in the KIL with more - and better - D-1 talent than Tennessee boasted at the time. Combine that with the fact that Majors was able to operate largely free from recruiting restrictions and what you have is a multi-season process to rebuild the program.

I wrote this in 2003 and easily could have just re-posted it in 2008 or 2012:

If Head Vol Jones can get UT competitive in anything less than five years he should be named Coach of the Decade.

You're absolutely correct. I would suggest Dooley = Battle
Butch = Johnny in our current predicament.
However, we threw in the Kiffin debacle to make the job even harder.

This is who we are. Real fans will stay. Negavols will diminish over the next few years. But they will be back when we get turned around.

 

[cwbytruckers]

This board is so wet from the sobbing drunks I don't see how anyone can post without being electrocuted. Will the crying ever stop. Will the wounds ever heel. Will they ever stop playing that damn commercial. Sorry got side tracked. The ledge is behind us. We fell off three years ago. We have hit bottom. We are scraping of the last scab. Its starting to heal. Kentucky will be the last of this debocale. Can we move on to something more uplifting. Besides there will be a few more post on the stupid Florida guys blocking each other today.

 

[92volalum]

NO ONE... that I have seen has suggested it be fixed in one year. What we expected is that they would control and succeed at the things they could do. Being uncompetitive vs every good (and healthy) team UT played outside of USCe, losing to Vandy, and almost losing to USA... are failures that belong exclusively to THIS STAFF.

I agree we just wanted to see hope that ut has hired the right guy. I expected 6 wins n a bowl with great recruiting.. What I see is a staff that is avg at best n the only way the win a sec championship will be to have more talent n maybe they know that.

He is john majors 2.0 but won't have as long..

 

[InVOLuntary]

People need to remember that next year TN will be relying on not only young and inexperienced players but inexperienced coaches as well. Many of these coaches are freshman equivalent and they are really learning on the job. This staff took a major leap from CMU and then Cincy to UT and the SEC. They were most likely not ready for a job this big. Who knows whether they can handle the learning curve or not?

 

[sechamp2012]

BuJo, or anyone else will never have the long leash or number of years that Majors had.

The drive thru /instant gratification crowd have made sure of that. The internet just started wide spread use in the mid 80's about the time Majors was leaving. NOW when guys can get on line start a thread fire coach at halftime. You will not get the time Majors had. I think they win 6 next year make a bowl. Wins over Utah State, Arkansas State, UTC, Kentucky, Missouri and Vandy. This would have us winning 5 home games and Vandy on the road. Still think the fanbase will not be satisfied but it's a step in the right direction.

 

[Memphisvol87]

The best staff in the country defenders will Que in 3,2,1.....

For the record I like BJ but the OC and DC are pathetic

I get as worked up as anyone when Tennessee performs the way it has... but in all fairness these players are terrible.. I understand they give their all and blah blah blah but seriously seniors.. whats left of them have given us 4 losing seasons and 1 bowl game. 4 coaches in 5 years is beyond measure too much to ask from these young men but the same mistakes are being made from day one.. cant rush the ball consistently and our defense is slow and cant tackle. 4 coaches forget to brush up these major details? I dont think so. This offensive line is overrated and this defense lacks speed and fundamentals. New players like cam sutton, whos the best defensive player, are proof we just need a few years are strong recruiting. Not dooley and kiffin recruiting where half of each class is gone that they signed. 2 cents

 

[PACKERVOL]

Next year will be a good look into the future. This legacy class will be winners before they graduate. Lots of talent on the way! GBO!!!

I'm not so sure next year will be a look into the future because we are losing a bunch of experience this year on OL and DL despite how you may feel about their talent. I think 2015 will be the year we can look to see where the program is headed.

 

[volfan411]

I'm expecting a replay of Dooley and Fulmer. Year 3 is going to be do or die with a low probability of success. The only way he breaks that cycle is if they really are an elite staff that for some reason just didn't show it... AT ALL... this year.

The worst possible outcome for the future of the program if you are like me and want to see UT competing for championships would be if this plays out and Jones manages to win 6 or 7 games in '15... still underperforming the talent but enough to save his job.

The really scary thing about last year is that if Dooley had beaten one more team... he probably would not have been fired. If he had beaten two more... he definitely would not have. He would have underperformed the talent on his roster by 2 or 3 games... and still have been retained. It would have been terrible for the program... and would be if any future mediocre or worse coach did the same.

sjt18 as I go back and look at some of your post from the past and the way you adamantly defended Dooley I realize you were right in defending him as I and most others on here underestimated the talent that Dooley had and not all of the bad play was on him as all of this years is not on Jones. As I reflect on the last few years the problem I had with Dooley was I did not believe he was going to get it done on the recruiting trail and his in game management was atrocious to say the least. I agree with you had Dooley won one more game he would still be here but without Sal and I do not think he would have survived this season with the schedule we faced and all ready being on the hot seat. Some forget he got blown out by Vandy last season with the same D and a much better O and with his history of teams quitting on him I just do not see how he would have kept them together with this schedule.