Electric Vehicles

[hog88]

The government isn't a monolithic entity. It's people, just like you and I. Some of them are more flawed than others. Some of them are as fine a human as I've known. The worst of the private sector is motivated by greed. The worst of the government by control. The best of both can be a force for good. I do not inherently trust or distrust one over the other. Flawed people are flawed. Good people are good.

But government by far attracts dumb flawed people who are both greedy and incompetent.

 

[Orangeburst]

Oh I know. Again, my entire thesis is acknowledgement that nothing, private or public, is all good or all bad. it's all shades of grey.

I just chuckle that right leaners tend to trust the private sector, while distrusting the government, but generally supporting the military, while seemingly ignoring that military is government. While left leaners tend toward a complete inverse of that...business bad, government good, but military bad...even though it's government.

For the record, I lean right. I've just mellowed enough in my old age to concede that government does have a role in useful things...at times.

Even EVs. :grin:

I dont disagree. Look at DARPA and all the research programs. I want cutting edge and gov/private partnerships can create masters. Even all the time at the University level.
But then it gets handed to the pols..which dont know crap really.
To see such a life and national economic roll over instituted by the Feds makes me very squeamish. Frankly they do not have the money and are artificially tipping the scales for what is ready.
I have watched them for 25 years..well really since the next coming Ice Age in the 80;s, create this narrative

Only by believing the "time factor" pushed by pols since Al said we have 12 years or so back in what 2000, would one believe such non-sense. Now it is like what 2030?
I dont have anything against EV..but dang they have been incorrect about peak oil and the precipice of Climate for decades.

Frankly..CC is what this is all about and the push. And they have failed that by decades.

 

[SSVol]

But government by far attracts dumb flawed people who are both greedy and incompetent.

Harsh. I was an Army officer, as is my baby sister, and my son-in-law. All bright. All generous. And all with the highest integrity. I guess my experience is different than yours.

 

[Orangeburst]

I was at a MARTA maintenance depot several weeks ago. Even their infrastructure was hodge pod with chargers that were like 115V and a few that were 230V iirc. Fancy EV buses.
Now how is the Multi family complex or public housing to charge their vehicles?

We are talking trillions of dollars

 

[Wireless1]

Tesla just dropped prices by as much as 20% in some models, and the subsidies are still in force. Ultimately the government mandate is forcing all car manufacturers into the space, and Tesla is having to actually compete.

But yeah, gamers will game.

Major law of Economics, something is worth whatever somebody is willing to pay, and to maximize profits you start with prices high for those that will pay that price then discount to find the highest price you can sell your last part produced …..all those “rebates” are profits to the manufacturers, which in this case ended up in the hands of Twitter shareholders

 

[C-south]

And they are the most effective and feared fighting force on the planet. Hence my point. Government is neither as incompetent as some suggest, nor as infallible as others would. Yes, there is a middle ground.

Which, if you ever served, sometimes kinda make you wonder just how messed up the rest of the world is.

 

[SSVol]

Major law of Economics, something is worth whatever somebody is willing to pay, and to maximize profits you start with prices high for those that will pay that price then discount to find the highest price you can sell your last part produced …..all those “rebates” are profits to the manufacturers, which in this case ended up in the hands of Twitter shareholders

Yes, absolutely, agree on all points.

But the rebates have absolutely stimulated buying, whether they lowered the price or not. Much the same as the ironic truth that car dealers make more during "sales" than when cars aren't on sale.

"You bought how much peanut butter?!?"
"Yah...it was on sale!"
"But you hate peanut butter...".
"BUT IT WAS ON SALE!"

 

[RavinDave]

1 word: hydrogen fuel cell.

That’s 3 words. But I get it. We are seeing a lot of Green Hydrogen projects in my business. H2 product has to meet Fuel Cell specifications including max 5 ppm of O2, which is where my company comes in with a catalytic Deoxo reactor design and platinum or palladium catalyst.

 

[FLVOL_79]

That’s 3 words. But I get it. We are seeing a lot of Green Hydrogen projects in my business. H2 product has to meet Fuel Cell specifications including max 5 ppm of O2, which is where my company comes in with a catalytic Deoxo reactor design and platinum or palladium catalyst.

For a car you get just about the same range as you would if using gas and fill up time is almost the same as gas...I think.

The huge downside is hydrogen is like $15 a gallon.

 

[hog88]

Harsh. I was an Army officer, as is my baby sister, and my son-in-law. All bright. All generous. And all with the highest integrity. I guess my experience is different than yours.

Stop with “The military is a fair representation of the federal government” it’s not. And there are/were plenty of Os that are far from bright and just checking a box on the career chart by putting on the uniform.

You and your family could be one of the exceptions and that’s great.

 

[SSVol]

Stop with “The military is a fair representation of the federal government” it’s not. And there are/were plenty of Os that are far from bright and just checking a box on the career chart by putting on the uniform.

You and your family could be one of the exceptions and that’s great.

The military *is* the federal government. It's no more or less representative of the government than any other part. In fact I'd argue that constitutionally, it's one of the few parts of the federal government that should actually exist. Of course there are bad officers, just like there are bad mangers and CEOs in the private sector. The FTX scam was greed plus incompetence and cost many people a lot of money. One example of many.

People are people, whether they work in government or the private sector. If you wanna draw some magic line between them that's up to you, but my 58 years have taught me otherwise.

 

[Voldog1998]

I have a 2015 Nissan Rogue with 76K and it’s running great I will drive it to the wheels come off no EV for me.

 

[Vol737]

Just saw my first Rivian this morning. I was sitting behind the R1/S SUV and looked pretty good overall, so I looked them up. $80K to up over $100K. Those little kids digging up lithium and other REMs in dirt holes must be getting paid pretty handsomely, I’m sure.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Just saw my first Rivian this morning. I was sitting behind the R1/S SUV and looked pretty good overall, so I looked them up. $80K to up over $100K. Those little kids digging up lithium and other REMs in dirt holes must be getting paid pretty handsomely, I’m sure.

What happens when they run out?
It’s not like there’s an unlimited supply.
Unlike bio diesel which is renewable
(He says sitting in his F250 7.3 currently running on biodiesel )

 

[LouderVol]

The government isn't a monolithic entity. It's people, just like you and I. Some of them are more flawed than others. Some of them are as fine a human as I've known. The worst of the private sector is motivated by greed. The worst of the government by control. The best of both can be a force for good. I do not inherently trust or distrust one over the other. Flawed people are flawed. Good people are good.

You are intentionally blurring the lines between the whole government as made up as individuals, vs the government as in the movers and shakers making decisions.

Your few good men/women/whatever are lost in the collective wash of waste that is government.

I believe the government is definitely a case of one bad apple ruining the bunch. And there are far more than 1 in the somewhere less than 600 elected officials running this place.

 

[LouderVol]

Oh I know. Again, my entire thesis is acknowledgement that nothing, private or public, is all good or all bad. it's all shades of grey.

I just chuckle that right leaners tend to trust the private sector, while distrusting the government, but generally supporting the military, while seemingly ignoring that military is government. While left leaners tend toward a complete inverse of that...business bad, government good, but military bad...even though it's government.

For the record, I lean right. I've just mellowed enough in my old age to concede that government does have a role in useful things...at times.

Even EVs. :grin:

The difference is, that as of yet, corporations cant force me to do anything. Especially if I dont use their product. That's what inherently makes the government wrong, force.

Add onto that our system of government which ensures the least common denominator and doesnt even attempt to find the "right" or "best" option. Letting the kids vote ice cream for dinner doesn't mean it's a good system. Especially when you force one ice cream flavor to everyone even the kid who wanted some chicken and baked veggies.

 

[RavinDave]

For a car you get just about the same range as you would if using gas and fill up time is almost the same as gas...I think.

The huge downside is hydrogen is like $15 a gallon.

Looks like EVs with battery power have won the war as far as autos are concerned. At least for now. But Fuel Cells are gaining traction in some areas too.

 

[2EastTnVols]

Electric jeep is stupid

Have you seen the commercial where they plug in their electric rubicon in the middle of nowhere?

 

[GoDucks349]

The traditional car dealership needs to go. Good riddance.
We bought my wife’s Model Y through the website and I’d love to buy all my vehicles going forward this way.

Yea, buying a Tesla is certainly a different experience compared to the traditional car dealerships. Bought our Model Y 2023 in a store in a mall. I'm not very pleased with some of the things Tesla does, but I do love driving an EV. I mean when the remote garage door opener is a $350 "option" it just doesn't feel right.

 

[Franklin Pierce]

Ford Extends F-150 production halt

Auto giant first stopped production last week after a Battery Caught Fire on Feb. 4

The Ford Motor Co. will extend its production halt for the F-150 Lightning electric pickup truck at its plant in Louisville, Kentucky, until March 6.

Ford extends F-150 production halt

 

[C-south]

Ford Extends F-150 production halt

Auto giant first stopped production last week after a Battery Caught Fire on Feb. 4

The Ford Motor Co. will extend its production halt for the F-150 Lightning electric pickup truck at its plant in Louisville, Kentucky, until March 6.

Ford extends F-150 production halt

Must be waiting for dementia Joe to raise the tax credit so they can raise their price.

 

[VolStrom]

Must be waiting for dementia Joe to raise the tax credit so they can raise their price.

They instantly raised their prices by over $7k as soon as the government subsidy passed. F Ford, GM and the rest of these crooks, I'll never buy an electric car.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Tesla just dropped prices by as much as 20% in some models, and the subsidies are still in force. Ultimately the government mandate is forcing all car manufacturers into the space, and Tesla is having to actually compete.

But yeah, gamers will game.

I just took advantage of this little game and ordered a Performance Model 3 for $54990. The cap on the tax credit is $55k. That same car was over 60 several months ago. So, essentially that's a $14000 drop when you include the rebate. And I'll be able to smoke almost everything on the road.

 

[hog88]

They instantly raised their prices by over $7k as soon as the government subsidy passed. F Ford, GM and the rest of these crooks, I'll never buy an electric car.

I can't see myself buying one either.

I saw some sea trials on an electric boat, outboard runabout powered by batteries. It was good for about an hour to hour 1/2 run-time. Sign me up for that!

 

[C-south]

They instantly raised their prices by over $7k as soon as the government subsidy passed. F Ford, GM and the rest of these crooks, I'll never buy an electric car.

I know