Evaluating Martin's recruiting

#26
#26
I think if TN lets Stokes play his senior year and/or other big schools had an opening to take him then we don't get him

so to this point he has landed Hubbs

i would say the jury is still very much out if we plan on competing with KY and Florida and being serious bball contenders
 
#27
#27
SCvol333 said:
I think if TN lets Stokes play his senior year and/or other big schools had an opening to take him then we don't get him

so to this point he has landed Hubbs

i would say the jury is still very much out if we plan on competing with KY and Florida and being serious bball contenders
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You can't not give Cuonzo credit for landing Stokes. He's here, so he's a Cuonzo recruit. Period.
 
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#28
#28
SCvol333 said:
I think if TN lets Stokes play his senior year and/or other big schools had an opening to take him then we don't get him

so to this point he has landed Hubbs

i would say the jury is still very much out if we plan on competing with KY and Florida and being serious bball contenders
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I've heard if KY didn't have room Noel was coming to Tennessee so lets give Martin credit for him then.
 
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#29
#29
You don't fire a coach every 3 years especially under the circumstances that Cuonzo was hired. Coaching prospects will run for the tall grass if UT got that reputation.

I predicted mediocrity once again in the BB program when Pearl left. That seems to be where we are headed. I hope Cuonzo can get us relevant again and he should have at least another year or two to get us there. I really was discouraged by the way the team played the last 2 games. They were ready for spring break instead of playing BB. That has to change.
 
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#30
#30
volroadwarrior said:
You don't fire a coach every 3 years especially under the circumstances that Cuonzo was hired. Coaching prospects will run for the tall grass if UT got that reputation.

I predicted mediocrity once again in the BB program when Pearl left. That seems to be where we are headed. I hope Cuonzo can get us relevant again and he should have at least another year or two to get us there. I really was discouraged by the way the team played the last 2 games. They were ready for spring break instead of playing BB. That has to change.
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Read this VN board posters!
 
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#31
#31
There is no reason we shouldn't be right up there with KY next year battling for the SEC Championship. Maymon, Stokes, Hubbs, Thompson, Golden, McRae, Richardson...

If we aren't we will have grossly underachieved!
 
#32
#32
If we're just giving opinions, my problems with Martin's recruiting are twofold.
First I was under the impression that he and his staff were do more with less or some kind of player development specialists.
Seeing the same problems in our guard play 2 years running sort of disproved that.
I thought at first he could get away with recruiting the unrated players and coaching them up. Doesn't look that way.
Second, he's made some pretty devastating mistakes in his recruiting.
The most blatant is not replacing Washpun with a point guard or 2 instead of loading up on wings.
If he misses on the play ready point guard this season, it wouldn't surprise me a bit if he's chasing the bubble again next February.
 
#33
#33
I hate to be an *******, but Stokes is part of the 2012 class, and that makes a big difference when it comes to looking at those classes.

The 2011 becomes above average, the 2012 class becomes above average, and the 2013 class is still very solid.
 
#34
#34
Also, I'm not sure it would have made a huge difference, but had Dwight Miller been healthy, with Maymon out, I think Miller would have played regular minutes this past year. JMO.
 
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#36
#36
MannyD said:
Every thread on this board is littered with talk of Cuonzo's job stability, and this one shouldn't turn into that. But I'll bite - give him a fourth year. Any coach not named Tony Barbee and Darrin Horn deserves that.
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After the previous coach went 6 for 6 after his arrival, why should the coach following him get a 4th year of he goes 0 for 3?

If you want to argue he wasn't left much, I don't know if I buy that. Pearl won with his recruits and I see no reason he wouldn't have continued winning with them. He turned Tennessee into somewhat of a powerhouse while he was here. No, I don't mean like Duke, MSU, Kansas etc. but he had us in the tournament every year, was beating #1's, got us to #1, top 5 attendance etc. Even with the NCAA sniffing around, the Tennessee basketball brand and resources should have been enough to sustain the success of making the tournament yearly. If CM goes 0 for 3, there is no need for a 4th year.

I guess that's just my opinion though.



And I don't know how I would rank this class in comparison to the others. Haven't seen em play.
 
#37
#37
While Stokes is technically CCM's recruit, I think the groundwork was pretty much laid for him. I'm still impressed with the pull, but it isn't the same as the commitment from Hubbs(which is outstanding).

Moore's ratings were deceiving, he is a great player and has a lot of potential. He is the lone bright spot for me in that class so far.

I'm going to agree with everyone else and say the '14 class is critical for CCM.
 
#38
#38
zjcvols said:
I hate to be an *******, but Stokes is part of the 2012 class, and that makes a big difference when it comes to looking at those classes.

The 2011 becomes above average, the 2012 class becomes above average, and the 2013 class is still very solid.
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Tell me again how the 2011 class would then be above average without Stokes? Seems like you have a slew of non-players and one poor shooting role player. You can't compete for the OVC title with that kind of talent.

IMO without Stokes - you just made the 2011 class way, way below average. Stick him in one class or the other but which ever year you are not going to include him in - recruiting sucked.
 
#39
#39
Fullfillmer said:
Tell me again how the 2011 class would then be above average without Stokes? Seems like you have a slew of non-players and one poor shooting role player. You can't compete for the OVC title with that kind of talent.

IMO without Stokes - you just made the 2011 class way, way below average. Stick him in one class or the other but which ever year you are not going to include him in - recruiting sucked.
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Q and Yemi both have shown flashes of being really good basketball players. They are still young.

And you seriously underrate Richardson. He's one of the best defenders in the South, plus he has the ability to score.
 
#40
#40
SCvol333 said:
I think if TN lets Stokes play his senior year and/or other big schools had an opening to take him then we don't get him

so to this point he has Hubbs
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This is garbage. I hear people say this from time to time. Complete garbage.
 
#41
#41
zjcvols said:
Q and Yemi both have shown flashes of being really good basketball players. They are still young.

And you seriously underrate Richardson. He's one of the best defenders in the South, plus he has the ability to score.
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Yes - Q and Yemi are both projects and have shown that they couldn't break into an average Tennessee line up. Neither at this time can be classified as really good basketball players. Whether they play in the future ?? no one knows. Richardson is a decent defender - actually made the starting line -up and is the role player previously discussed. He really has improved but would be classified by most as an average SEC player. 8 ppg 21% beyond the arc - actually below average as an outside shooter.
 
#42
#42
Actually we've done a little better than what I expected for the last two years. The most disheartening thing so far to me, is the way the Vols laid down on the school and fans in the NIT. Young men are emotional and easily discouraged but that is no excuse. I think after the off season maturing and coaching we will see a much stronger and consistent team. If a big improvement doesn't occur, then I think Tennessee should start looking at alternatives.
 
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#43
#43
Fullfillmer said:
Yes - Q and Yemi are both projects and have shown that they couldn't break into an average Tennessee line up. Neither at this time can be classified as really good basketball players. Whether they play in the future ?? no one knows. Richardson is a decent defender - actually made the starting line -up and is the role player previously discussed. He really has improved but would be classified by most as an average SEC player. 8 ppg 21% beyond the arc - actually below average as an outside shooter.
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It was also his first class.

He got a really good contributor his first year, and role player, and a possible role player, with all three improving.

That's a nice first class.
 
#44
#44
Chris4Vols22 said:
This is an issue that was very hot when Martin got here. Many were worried (which is understandable), so let's take a look at what Martin has done since he's been here at UT

2011
This was a "get what you can" class. We had to reload a depleted roster within 4 months. It was terrible timing, just really unfortunate for Martin. On the whole, this class was a wash, but not a failure.

Wes Washpun - great athlete, good kid, very raw, ultimately not what we needed

Josh Richardson - Martin's best example of players he likes. Athletic, tenacious defender, solid size and frame, solid potential for good offensive game. I think Richardson could jump on almost any NCAA roster and noticeably improve the team.

Yemi Makanjuola - Very raw, athletic, big guy. Has a ton of upside, but lack of organized experience is the biggest thing holding him back. I honestly cannot tell if Yemi will ultimately have a solid NCAA career or not.

Quinton Chievous - Hard worker, athletic, fiery player. Q hasn't seen the floor much, but he's usually productive when he has. The kid hustles, and his moves are quick, deliberate, and fluid. It's hard to tell if Q will in the rotation, but he's making his best case when Martin gives him the opportunities.

Dwight Miller - Wtf? I don't even know. A Jamie Dixon recruit sounded like boobs in the face after watching Brokeback Mountain back-to-back-to-back, but wtf has happened?

Jarnell Stokes - I don't need to break this down for you.

IMO, you give this class a C+ pre-Stokes, B with him.

2012
Martin's first class with a 1.5 year recruiting cycle with UT. We weren't hurting for players, so we only took 3 signees.

Armani Moore - another raw, athletic guard, hustler, excellent help-side defender, struggles on offense but shows flashes of promise. I like Moore, and am glad he in the rotation, but at the time of his recruitment, he is not what we needed.

Derek Reese - Skinny kid with decent jumper, and solid rebounder. Doesn't bring much else to the table, which is why we barely saw him. Was nice to see the big guy stroking the 3 every once in a while though.

D'Montre Edwards - Seemed like a solid, serviceable player. Good size and frame, showed ability to shoot, but apparently not good enough to get in the rotation.

IMO, this was not a good class outside of Moore, and I believe that Moore has overachieved. I doubt he was expecting to be a starter in the SEC as a freshman by the end of his senior year in HS.

2012 gets a D+

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2013

Robert Hubbs - Boom. 5-star, consensus top-20, McD's AA snub. Kid could have gone virtually anywhere he wanted, and Martin pulled him in here. I don't care what you say, a terrible coach doesn't pull in a Hubbs, let alone a Hubbs and Stokes within 3 years. Martin deserves more credit than he's gotten for landing Hubbs

AJ Davis - One of Martin's more highly-ranked non-5star. This is the kind of recruit (along with Josh Richardson) that we want to see Martin pull instead of Reese, Edwards, Washpun, etc. We obviously haven't seen him play yet, but I think he will be solid. I'm hoping he sees 10-15 mpg next season.

Travon Landry - Most peculiar recruit Martin has pursued. Not highly-ranked, very perplexing stats, but revered as a solid PG. 99% of the time, you don't even bat a lash at this kid, but as we all know, we need a PG. I would say this is not worth it, but my god, if he can just dribble the ball up the court against the press, it would be TREMENDOUSLY helpful for us. Since the addition of Thompson, Landry is possibly the one depart from the tentative roster. We'll see.

Darius Thompson - IMO, another kind of recruit you want to see Martin pull in. I'm a little worried about his ball-handling and quickness, but I am confident that Martin is doing everything he can to fix the problem. I think Thompson will end up being a contributor next season, but I admit that he may have the potential to be not be helpful. Again, we'll see.

I think you give this class a B+, maybe even an A-. I think the subtraction of Landry is inconsequential to the final grade.

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So, how are you guys feeling about recruiting nowadays? Seems like it was THE biggest issue a while ago, but I think confidence has grown amongst the fanbase.

The 2014 class has the potential to make us one of the best teams in the country. We are after the 3 big Ls - Lyle, Looney, and Lindsey. I know it's a far shot, but if we even got 2 of those three, we'd POSSIBLY have Lyle, Looney, Hubbs, and Stokes all on one roster.
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You do realize Hubbs is coming ONLY because he wants to stay close to home and playing time. Duke, UNC, Florida couldn't offer that.
 
#47
#47
JMSqb11 said:
You do realize Hubbs is coming ONLY because he wants to stay close to home and playing time. Duke, UNC, Florida couldn't offer that.
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Who the **** cares?

He's coming to Tennessee. Martin got him. Coach K put the full court press on Hubbs and Martin still convinced Robert to come to UT. And if Robert wanted to stay close to home, and get immediate PT, why didn't he choose Memphis, which offers both?

Please.
 
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#49
#49
zjcvols said:
Who the **** cares?

He's coming to Tennessee. Martin got him. Coach K put the full court press on Hubbs and Martin still convinced Robert to come to UT. And if Robert wanted to stay close to home, and get immediate PT, why didn't he choose Memphis, which offers both?

Please.
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Easy, he wanted a power conference. He has said this repeatedly
 
#50
#50
JMSqb11 said:
Easy, he wanted a power conference. He has said this repeatedly
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That would make sense, except......

Memphis Tigers joining Big East for 2013-14 season - ESPN

Report: Top-20 recruit Robert Hubbs commits to Tennessee | SI Tracking Blog

And the Big East didn't evaporate till about February, six months after Hubbs committed to UT.

Also, if Hubbs want to stay close to home and play in a power conference, why not Alabama...or Missouri...or Arkansas, which are all closer than UT is in West Dyer.

And again, who cares about the circumstances? Cuonzo got a five star recruit almost everyone in the country wanted.
 
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