Fair Catch?!

[tomballvol]

Didn’t a Duke player last night call for a fair catch on the five yard line and the ball was placed on the 25?

 

[Lars]

It seems to me our defensive line gets held a lot. I thought I saw several tonight that weren’t called. Maybe I don’t understand the current definition of holding.

The refs sure called a lot of holding penalties on our offensive linemen that looked iffy to me, but missed calls when the bammer linemen very much appeared to be holding. Folks can call this sour grapes. I call it not being deaf, dumb, and blind.

 

[vol94]

The problem with yesterday is that no fair catch was signaled, yet it was called.

The rule states it’s any movement of the arms, meaning the player does not have to place his hand over his head. I don’t agree w it but it’s the rule.

 

[VFL-82-JP]

Posted this in the OTHER fair catch thread (yes, there are two of them), but some here still seem to believe this was about Dee Williams putting his hands up to his sides. It's not.

Here's that earlier post:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Here's a screen capture of the kickoff. Take note of the fella up front circled in orange:

And here's another screen capture, a second or two later. The fella in question now has his hand above his head:

Why's that player have his arm over his head? No idea. And can't tell who he is from this video, too blurry. But that's what was called.

Here's the video so you can see for yourself: start watching at 1:01:36:



I won't belabor my comments from the other thread. Just pointing out, this is not about Dee Williams' arms.

Go Vols!

 

[Tnphil]

Putting the arms out is pretty much telling the players running full force on the kicking team that you are giving up the kick for a touchback....I see the arms out in every game and every conference I watch. The ball out to the 25 yard line was put into place in 2018...It was done mainly for the safety of the players.

 

[Tnphil]

The rule states it’s any movement of the arms, meaning the player does not have to place his hand over his head. I don’t agree w it but it’s the rule.

Yes...it is in the rule and it was also told to be a emphasis on calls this year. I've seen it called 3 times myself so far and probably missed a few more. Iowa punt returner got a TD called back for it yesterday. You can't try and bait the punt or kickoff teams.

 

[rdl2k7]

First of all I have never seen a fair catch called that way. Secondly if you call for a fair catch before the 25 it automatically goes to the 25. Why didn’t that happen?

These refs are atrocious!!!!!

The intention of him stretching his arms to the side like that is to signal anyone running down the field that there will be no play. Either by touchback, fair catch etc. Whether it's in the rule book or not, and it may have been habit as much as anything he did make a signal that the play won't be live. If you admit he did make that signal with hands extended to the side and admit that he makes that signal for safety to let everybody know the play isn't going to happen, it's not a far stretch to see it as a signal of a fair catch. Given they reviewed it, they had ample time to fix the call if they had messed it up. No commentary on the rest of the game but after watching it, it does make sense. It just sucks for us. I guarantee you in practice this week they aren't telling the players "Keep doing that the refs screwed us" They are telling them to keep their hands down unless it's really a fair catch.

 

[OrangeBloodinTN]

It’s a rule, it was judged correctly, we didn’t get screwed on this call at least.

There were plenty of bad calls, missed calls, absolutely asanine calls, and then just incompetence.

This was not one of those calls

The rule book is full of language left up to interpretation by people with their own motivations.

The selective enforcement and non-enforcement of holding and PI by itself is indefensible. And then the signaling by the returner — this is a common thing that happens on returns. But a ref with their own motivations chooses to pull this nonsense out against the Vols in an already lopsided officiating debacle.

This is acceptable? Nope.

It is very easy to surmise that the officiating crew was not motivated to call the cleanest, fairest game possible.

What was the motivation?

 

[UT_Tix79]

I can’t speak for the rest of the officiating, its horrendousness speaks for itself. I’m simply saying this was correct.

Dee couldn’t get it, he signaled he was letting it go, Cam ran back and caught it, he wasn’t aware the Dee signaled. Just got our signals mixed up.

And then for some reason one of our front line guys actually put his hand straight up and waved like he was calling for a fair catch. It was super weird, and I have no idea why he did it.

 

[knoxchief]

Okay, can someone please explain to me why on a kick off to the VOLS (with two of our guys at the end zone on two sides) they called the run back to the 3 yard line because the player on the opposite side supposedly called for a fair catch? I just don't get it. First I have never know a fair catch signal to be both arms at the side. Second, he wasn't the guy catching the ball. Third, I thought any fair catch on a kick off would be placed onn the 25 yard line if inisde the 10.

 

[goldvol]

Go check out the other threads where this has been discussed and explained. Then come back here, and summarize it for the class.

 

[TexasVolfan1]

BS call good way to steal a drive from us.

 

[knoxchief]

BS call good way to steal a drive from us. View attachment 589751

How is this a fair catch signal? Rules say fair catch is waving hand over head!

 

[CAVPUT]

Go check out the other threads where this has been discussed and explained. Then come back here, and summarize it for the class.

But maybe STOP YELLING?

 

[TexasVolfan1]

How is this a fair catch signal? Rules say fair catch is waving hand over head!

exactly complete BS. Stole a good return and put us at the 4 yard line.

 

[knoxchief]

It is a rule, if anyone calls fair catch, the ball cannot be touched again by any player except the player calling the fair catch.

Once a fair catch is called the ball is dead at the point of touching by the next player to touch the ball unless muffed by the player who calls for a fair catch.

Had Cam fumbled, it wouldn’t have counted either, since the ball was dead as soon as it was touched

So the issue is what is a legal fair catch signal? Rules say raising arm above the head and waiving arm sideways! He didn't do this.

 

[TexasVolfan1]

I remember the flag on kamara for retuning one after he called a fair catch on a punt but that’s not at all what the referee crew called on us.

 

[knoxchief]

The rule states it’s any movement of the arms, meaning the player does not have to place his hand over his head. I don’t agree w it but it’s the rule.

No it doesn't

 

[utvolpj]

The rule states it’s any movement of the arms, meaning the player does not have to place his hand over his head. I don’t agree w it but it’s the rule.

Then lifting your arms to catch the ball could be called as a fair catch. Players lift their arms higher when sprinting than what Ballenger yesterday. What if you stumble while running to catch it and dare to wave an arm to maintain balance?

What Dee did was a signal to his team not a fair catch. Ref blew it dead and then there's no way to take it back. We were automatically screwed at that point

 

[UT_Tix79]

One of the front line men, 10 yards off away from the kickoff, raised his arm and waved as soon as the ball was kicked. Weirdest thing I’ve ever seen. Coach seems to believe that’s where the call came from, not Dee’s signal

 

[vol94]

Then lifting your arms to catch the ball could be called as a fair catch. Players lift their arms higher when sprinting than what Ballenger yesterday. What if you stumble while running to catch it and dare to wave an arm to maintain balance?

What Dee did was a signal to his team not a fair catch. Ref blew it dead and then there's no way to take it back. We were automatically screwed at that point

I’m not trying to argue but read the rule. It’s different than the fair catch rule for the punt. Doug Matthews explained the rule again this morning though he was unaware of it. I didn’t know that moving your arms (like return man fielding punts does signaling to stay away from the ball) is a signal for fair catch on kick offs. I don’t like it and I can tell you if the refs have been consistent this yr w the call but……they called it yesterday.

 

[vol94]

No it doesn't

Read the kickoff rule on fair catch. Not the same as a punt

 

[macrovol]

It was the correct call.

The application of the rule was correct, but there was no signal for fair catch.

 

[calban]

Nothing will change if an impotent NCAA continues to turn a BLIND EYE. Should be used to it by now. Most predicted the Outcome of this game. Hope it's true 3 rd Sat in Oct is coming to an end.

 

[CAVPUT]

The rule states it’s any movement of the arms, meaning the player does not have to place his hand over his head. I don’t agree w it but it’s the rule.

I'm old school so a distinct over-the-head wave is how it was and still should be. This nonsense about "any movement of the arms" leaves the door wide open for officials to influence games. Sometimes rules have to be changed, but I'm not sure why the powers that be decided there was a problem with something as basic and long accepted as the fair catch signal? It's like laws in this country. You can't possibly know them all and every single one of us breaks one or more every day without even realizing it. Now we're officiating the movements of players arms off the ball? Odd that they can be that attentive yet completely whiff on choke holds at the point of attack on a passing play. With every podcast advertising gambling along with that epidemic sweeping this country, one has to wonder if all this is a deliberate attempt to really muddy the rule book waters so fewer and fewer people know or understand it so that they've now got the ability to manipulate these games using the officials. And there's no way anyone will ever convince me that some of these refs don't have some of their own side action that they're looking out for. Games like this one certainly raise red flags with folks....or at least it should. It's been a long time since I've blindly accepted what I'm seeing or being told. So sad that we now can't trust that a college football game is being called straight up and instead is being manipulated and the outcome determined because of gambling or an attempt to make sure certain high profile teams are kept in the playoff chase in order to get a bigger cut of the money pool. You know advertisers really want names like bama on tv and in the playoffs because they bring the eyeballs. Yeah, I went there.