Fulmer is still the best name.

#304
#304
...in working like heck. Definitely the best name in working like heck. Also, motivational clapping.
 
#307
#307
People have got their eye on the wonders Bill Snyder is working over in Manhattan, Kansas.

But there is a decided difference.

Bill Snyder left K-State at the top of his game.

Phil Fulmer departed Tennessee on a downward cycle.

Every strong coach hits a period where things working for them earlier no longer work out. Some break out of the rut to become better than ever. Others never escape. Fulmer was in that situation at Tennessee and I can't see it being any different a second time around.

This all being said, I hope he gets another shot at a program where he can make a fresh start. I think he would do good work in a setting entirely new to him.
 
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#308
#308
TheDeeble said:
Fulmer is the reason we're in this mess. It's like fans have battered wife syndrome with him.
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Previous to Fulmer era

N.C. 51'
Biggest win in 30+ years was Sugar Bowl 86'

Fulmer came in 6 years later and gave this program hope for a N.C. and 6yrs later delivered. Sure he had his down yrs at the end, but what position would you be in without him? He put this program on the the map as a serious national contender year in and year out.

Now I'm for getting the best coach that we can get, but make sure their proven winners in the SEC. We don't need to take a chance on someone unproven. Remember this is the SEC it not as easy as the other conferences. We have seen plenty come in with winning records and have epic fails. Just like we have seen coaches like Spurrier go to the pros and end up back in the college ranks, it's just different.

As of right now I believe Fulmer is our best bet. Realistically I don't think there is anyone who has a better proven record in the SEC than Fulmer.
 
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#309
#309
The idiots that jumped off the Dooley wagon just climbed on the Fulmer freight train.
 
#310
#310
T.N. Buckingham said:
People have got their eye on the wonders Bill Snyder is working over in Manhattan, Kansas.

But there is a decided difference.

Bill Snyder left K-State at the top of his game.

Phil Fulmer departed Tennessee on a downward cycle.

Every strong coach hits a period where things working for them earlier no longer work out. Some break out of the rut to become better than ever. Others never escape. Fulmer was in that situation at Tennessee and I can't see it being any different a second time around.

This all being said, I hope he gets another shot at a program where he can make a fresh start. I think he would do good work in a setting entirely new to him.
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So Snyder leaving KSU with a 9-13 record is on top of his game? Fulmer was 15-11 in his last two years. If going by how they ended their first tenure, Fulmer>Snyder. Your words, not mine.
 
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#313
#313
Fulmer is and will be a Tennessee legend. If he were to be offered and come back all he could do is tarnish his legacy unless he won like he didn't his last 7 years. Hiring him again wouldn't bring excitement to the fan base majority since we've been there done that. To compare Snyder to Fulmer isn't the correct analysis. That comparison would be to the General Neyland himself to have come back. Snyder is by far the most successful coach it their history. Fulmer isn't the greatest in Tennessee history.
 
#314
#314
JMSqb11 said:
So Snyder leaving KSU with a 9-13 record is on top of his game? Fulmer was 15-11 in his last two years. If going by how they ended their first tenure, Fulmer>Snyder. Your words, not mine.
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Yep. He was still the same quality coach. Fulmer was a quality coach on a downward trajectory.

That same team finished with a winning record under a far less capable coach the following year. Stands to reason Snyder would've done far better had he stayed on. His track record proves it.

This current crop of Wildcats finished one win over .500 in Snyder's first two years. Since then, they are 20-3. Where I'm from, we call that rebuilding.

Big difference between being engaged in a rebuilding process, as Snyder was doing at Manhattan, and being stuck in decline as Fulmer existed in Knoxville.

Fulmer's program wasn't in rebuilding mode. It was in decline. The loss to Wyoming and the absolute lack of offensive firepower during the last season proves the point. We were no longer with the elite; the elite were pulling away from us. Instead of having a coach whose ambition represented championships, we had a coach whose ambition went no further than an 8-win season and a contract extension.

You can bring Fulmer back to Knoxville. But you will never be able to bring the Fulmer of the 1990s back. That Fulmer is dead and buried.
 
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#315
#315
T.N. Buckingham said:
\

Stands to reason Snyder would've done far better had he stayed on. His track record proves it.


You can bring Fulmer back to Knoxville. But you will never be able to bring the Fulmer of the 1990s back. That Fulmer is dead and buried.
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Guessing is fun, isnt it
 
#316
#316
T.N. Buckingham said:
\

Yep. He was still the same quality coach. Fulmer was a quality coach on a downward trajectory.

That same team finished with a winning record under a far less capable coach the following year. Stands to reason Snyder would've done far better had he stayed on. His track record proves it.

This current crop of Wildcats finished one win over .500 in Snyder's first two years. Since then, they are 20-3. Where I'm from, we call that rebuilding.

Big difference between being engaged in a rebuilding process, as Snyder was doing at Manhattan, and being stuck in decline as Fulmer existed in Knoxville.

Fulmer's program wasn't in rebuilding mode. It was in decline. The loss to Wyoming and the absolute lack of offensive firepower during the last season proves the point. We were no longer with the elite; the elite were pulling away from us. Instead of having a coach whose ambition represented championships, we had a coach whose ambition went no further than an 8-win season and a contract extension.

You can bring Fulmer back to Knoxville. But you will never be able to bring the Fulmer of the 1990s back. That Fulmer is dead and buried.
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Well done!!!! :good!: :salute:
 
#318
#318
T.N. Buckingham said:
An educated guess based on current operations and the history of the head coach in question

Take a good look at the rankings. And then look at how Snyder started with this team.
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still, its a guess. An "educated guess" also says Fulmer would have led us to a 9 win season then a trip to yet another SECCG.

Either way, we nor anyone else know what would happen so we're neither right nor wrong.
 
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#319
#319
T.N. Buckingham said:
\

Yep. He was still the same quality coach. Fulmer was a quality coach on a downward trajectory.

That same team finished with a winning record under a far less capable coach the following year. Stands to reason Snyder would've done far better had he stayed on. His track record proves it.

This current crop of Wildcats finished one win over .500 in Snyder's first two years. Since then, they are 20-3. Where I'm from, we call that rebuilding.

Big difference between being engaged in a rebuilding process, as Snyder was doing at Manhattan, and being stuck in decline as Fulmer existed in Knoxville.

Fulmer's program wasn't in rebuilding mode. It was in decline. The loss to Wyoming and the absolute lack of offensive firepower during the last season proves the point. We were no longer with the elite; the elite were pulling away from us. Instead of having a coach whose ambition represented championships, we had a coach whose ambition went no further than an 8-win season and a contract extension.

You can bring Fulmer back to Knoxville. But you will never be able to bring the Fulmer of the 1990s back. That Fulmer is dead and buried.
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That's a good post. Not being sarcastic. I just can't see why people know its 200% percent definite that Fulmer wouldn't work out if he came back. Yes I understand the slide of the last 3-5 years of his tenure, but coaches have caught fire when having time off. My parents are 56 and they work long week hours like a lot of people in that demographic. The stress they have is almost unhealthy.

Being a college coach is almost a 168 hour/week job. Couple that with 100,000s of people being your biggest fan or enemy at any given point, it can break a man.

I feel that Snyder is doing well because he is a good coach, but also, he stepped away and reenegized him self. I don't think for one minute Phil wouldn't want this opportunity to right our ship and bring this base together. Tennessee blood can heal this division faster than anything.
 
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#320
#320
GreveHaller said:
still, its a guess. An "educated guess" also says Fulmer would have led us to a 9 win season then a trip to yet another SECCG.

Either way, we nor anyone else know what would happen so we're neither right nor wrong.
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If you can make such an observation based on something other than raw emotion, then please back it up.

I point to Snyder's last four years for my guess. Also can cite his previous 11-4 team that, two year earlier, went 6-6.

What did you see in Fulmer's last year, or his career as a whole, to indicate he would've done any better than Lane Kiffin?

Snyder had experience rebuilding a program. In this case he built a program that had never been built, the worst in college football history.

Fulmer never experienced a rebuilding job. He took over a Top 10-15 program with the bulk of the work already done for him.

There is no indication at all Fulmer would've been able to respond to the new challenge, especially given the evident decline in his expectations for himself and his program.
 
#321
#321
T.N. Buckingham said:
If you can make such an observation based on something other than raw emotion, then please back it up.

I point to Snyder's last four years for my guess. Also can cite his previous 11-4 team that, two year earlier, went 6-6.

What did you see in Fulmer's last year, or his career as a whole, to indicate he would've done any better than Lane Kiffin?

Snyder had experience rebuilding a program. In this case he built a program that had never been built, the worst in college football history.

Fulmer never experienced a rebuilding job. He took over a Top 10-15 program with the bulk of the work already done for him.

There is no indication at all Fulmer would've been able to respond to the new challenge, especially given the evident decline in his expectations for himself and his program.
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If we are going in experience, the only thing I can back up Fulmer on is his coaching record. He has one losing season. Shook things up and made a change. 5-6 to 9-4. His last season, he made the wrong hire. 5-7 to LK 7-6. Fulmer always responded well following a season of 7 wins or less. There were so few of them. With Fulmer, we beat UCLA, Auburn, and Ole Miss in 08. That's what I feel. I am not saying that woulda definitely happened, but I say we woulda prolly won because those three games LK got away from pounding with the run game.

My point, Fulmer always followed a season of a low wins with a season if improvement.
 
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#322
#322
JMSqb11 said:
That's a good post. Not being sarcastic. I just can't see why people know its 200% percent definite that Fulmer wouldn't work out if he came back. Yes I understand the slide of the last 3-5 years of his tenure, but coaches have caught fire when having time off. My parents are 56 and they work long week hours like a lot of people in that demographic. The stress they have is almost unhealthy.

Being a college coach is almost a 168 hour/week job. Couple that with 100,000s of people being your biggest fan or enemy at any given point, it can break a man.

I feel that Snyder is doing well because he is a good coach, but also, he stepped away and reenegized him self. I don't think for one minute Phil wouldn't want this opportunity to right our ship and bring this base together. Tennessee blood can heal this division faster than anything.
Click to expand...

Frank Solich inherited a similar situation to Coach Fulmer. He was fired. But he took that dismissal and spent the next couple of years learning the latest trends in the game, especially modern offense. I think he's a far better coach now at Ohio than he ever was at Nebraska.

I'd want to see something similar out of Fulmer, some sign he takes the blame for what happened at Tennessee and doesn't see the fault resting primarily with Tennessee itself.

The vibe I was getting, especially from Sexton, was that Tennessee could never consistently compete amongst the elite of the SEC as it was currently constituted. That 8-win provision in Fulmer's contract seemed to confirm that outlook.

We need a coach who believes Tennessee's place is in with the Big Four of the SEC. We need that coach to be someone who never settles for average. We need that man to be someone who responds to championships not with satisfaction, but rather with a drive and a pure old-fashioned greed to win even more.

If Fulmer came back with the same attitude he had before, then I don't think we'd see anything but the same results he left with.
 
#323
#323
There are reasons that CPF has not been offered a job in the last 4 years.

Here is the math:
Fulmer-Cutcliff=mediocrity.
 
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