Fulmer's Worst 4 years still better than last 4 years

#79
#79
Gramps said:
I think it was past time for Fulmer to be fired or retire.
The problem was the hires...Kiffin leaving after one year just before signing day was a disaster for the program. Dooley was a major, major mistake.
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If you are not likely to hire someone better, then you don't fire the person you have. Organization management 101.
 
#80
#80
I'll post the argument/point that I make to Fulmerites that I have never received a legitimate response to.

If a coach has 2 losing seasons in 4 years at Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, LSU, Texas, USC, Nebraska, Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Miami, etc., he would be fired. Period. If Tennessee is on par with those programs traditionally, why shouldn't the coach be fired at UT as well?

Heck, at most if not all of those schools listed above, a coach would be fired for 2 .500 seasons in 4 years, or 1 losing season period.
 
#81
#81
114VOL said:
It's pretty f'ing simple. Fulmer left the program much worse than he got it.
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It is simple; you're wrong.

1. Before Fulmer took over recruiting and the offense, Majors had a stunningly mediocre program in a mostly weak SEC era. If you need to remember, just go back and look at most seasons from 1977 to 1988.

2. The roster Fulmer left at Tennessee included 2 NFL tight ends, 2 NFL offensive tackles, 2 NFL running backs, 1 NFL fullback, 1 NFL wideout, 2 NFL QBs, and a defense tailor-fit for Chavis' schemes. In total, the roster left for Kiffin included 19 players who would either make NFL rosters, or would get all-SEC honors in their careers. The roster Fulmer took over in 1993 was almost identical, with 19 players who would either make the league or win all-SEC honors of some form.
 
#82
#82
drewwes01 said:
I'll post the argument/point that I make to Fulmerites that I have never received a legitimate response to.

If a coach has 2 losing seasons in 4 years at Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, LSU, Texas, USC, Nebraska, Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Miami, etc., he would be fired. Period. If Tennessee is on par with those programs traditionally, why shouldn't the coach be fired at UT as well?

Heck, at most if not all of those schools listed above, a coach would be fired for 2 .500 seasons in 4 years, or 1 losing season period.
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Because your assumption is wrong -- Tennessee is not "on par" with the talent-rich programs. The only program comparable to Tennessee in that list is Nebraska, and they were a weaker team from 2002-2008 than Tennessee was during that era, by most objective observations. But for their playing a weaker schedule, Nebraska would have run a similar risk of losing seasons as Tennessee.

One last note: Fulmer was fired before he had a losing season in 2008 just so he couldn't go on a winning streak to close the season and deter Hamilton's goals of hiring the "great" Lane Kiffin.
 
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#83
#83
Weezer said:
Firing Fulmer was a good decision. A sad one, but a good one. The bad decision was promoting Hamilton to AD as he proved more than once he was horrible at coaching searches.

If firing Fulmer was such a bad idea, why is it no other school ever swept in to snatch him up? So many job openings over the years, yet Fulmer never got one of them. Hmmmm.....:question:
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i thought it was because he wanted to stay in Tn and be with his family ? as a true Vol would
 
#85
#85
VegasVol said:
Because your assumption is wrong -- Tennessee is not "on par" with the talent-rich programs. The only program comparable to Tennessee in that list is Nebraska, and they were a weaker team from 2002-2008 than Tennessee was during that era, by most objective observations. But for their playing a weaker schedule, Nebraska would have run a similar risk of losing seasons as Tennessee.

One last note: Fulmer was fired before he had a losing season in 2008 just so he couldn't go on a winning streak to close the season and deter Hamilton's goals of hiring the "great" Lane Kiffin.
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So Tennessee isn't 8th in D-1A/FBS history in all time wins (801)? Or 3rd all time in bowl appearances (49)? UT doesn't have multiple consensus national championships and 13 SEC championships (2nd in SEC history)?

Why shouldn't the expectations at Tennessee, given the program's history, be any different than they are at comparable programs?

One last note: At most of the power programs, if a coach has 1 losing season he will likely be fired, let alone 2. Many of those programs fire coaches for going .500 or even a little better. So Fulmer used his get out of jail free card in 2005, and 2008 was just window dressing.
 
#86
#86
114VOL said:
Sewanee???

I am retired from GE and former a former letterman of UT. Plus, I likely give more money to the University in one year than you have in your lifetime

He didn't build that team. He did recruit some of the players but I stand by my statement. It's fact. The team he inherited he got in 1992 was miles better than the one he left. No matter how ignorantly you try to spin that in his favor, you lose this one. And lose very badly.
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Since you are so successful, buy a dictionary and find words other than "ignorant" and "delusional". They are getting old. :eek:lol:
 
#88
#88
VegasVol said:
It is simple; you're wrong.

1. Before Fulmer took over recruiting and the offense, Majors had a stunningly mediocre program in a mostly weak SEC era. If you need to remember, just go back and look at most seasons from 1977 to 1988.

2. The roster Fulmer left at Tennessee included 2 NFL tight ends, 2 NFL offensive tackles, 2 NFL running backs, 1 NFL fullback, 1 NFL wideout, 2 NFL QBs, and a defense tailor-fit for Chavis' schemes. In total, the roster left for Kiffin included 19 players who would either make NFL rosters, or would get all-SEC honors in their careers. The roster Fulmer took over in 1993 was almost identical, with 19 players who would either make the league or win all-SEC honors of some form.
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Do you wish to go through position by position, including depth of the 1992 team and the 2008 team? Really? Provide some detail of the players your mentioning. Stats are meaningless without detail. Statistics 101

2 NFL QBS? LMFAO
 
#90
#90
volfanecs said:
Since you are so successful, buy a dictionary and find words other than "ignorant" and "delusional". They are getting old. :eek:lol:
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I didn't say anything about being "so successful"

Provide some informed opinions. Delusional and ignorant are the words that best fit your opinions on this subject.
 
#93
#93
photovol said:
Majors last 4 years were better than Fulmers last 4 years? No?
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Yes they were

Fulmer had 4 full seasons and coached in 50 games. In those 50, he was 29-21 (58%), 1-1 in bowls, no SEC Championships, no NCs

In Majors' last 50 games, he was 39-9-2(78%), 2-1 in bowls, 2 SEC championships, no NCs
 
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#94
#94
GAVol said:
We've got to talk about this. Do you go in the garage, start your car, wait until you feel woozy and then start threads? You start, without a doubt, the most god awful new threads in the history of VN.
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I love awful threads that close in on 100 responses.
 
#95
#95
Sure would have been nice to have Chavis back the last four years.
 
#96
#96
CountVolcula said:
Yes they were

Fulmer had 4 full seasons and coached in 50 games. In those 50, he was 29-21 (58%), 1-1 in bowls, no SEC Championships, no NCs

In Majors' last 50 games, he was 39-9-2(78%), 2-1 in bowls, 2 SEC championships, no NCs
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Who was the OC and recruiting coordinator during those years?

Not slighting Johnny but people like to credit Cut for Fulmer's success so....



Also, I think the OP was saying if you took Fulmer's worst 4 years from his entire career not just the last 4. A lot of people seem to be missing that. 2 of those did come on the last 4 though.
 
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#97
#97
utfantilidie said:
Take his worst 4 years of wins and losses the entire time he coached here still tops UT's last 4 years. wins 6.5 losses 5.5

Last 4 years before Jones
W-5.75- L-6.75
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Of course, Fulmer's last four years were worse than Majors' last four years, and Battle's last four, and Dickey's, etc..
 
#98
#98
I think we all can agree that after Fulmer won the NC in 98, he got very lazy and complacent. I mean don't get me wrong there were some good years after that like 2001, 2004, 2006, and 2007.....but for the majority of those years the on field product was just not up to snuff with what he had in the 90's. You can also attribute some of that to SEC getting stronger and more balanced.

I love CPF as much as the next guy but It was time for him to go because it seemed like he was becoming uninspired to coach football. I do blame Fulmer for some of the reason why this program is like it is now , but the majority of the blame should be placed on Mike Hamilton. First, for bringing in that spoiled brat Kiffin whom everyone except Hamilton knew that UT was just a stepping stone until the USC job came open.

Then Hamilton goes and hires his next coach based on his legendary last name...Dooley. That apple definitely fell farther from the tree. I mean the man had a career losing record. You could see from the very beginning that Dooley was in over his head.
 
#100
#100
Fulmer needed to be replaced but the way it happened was pure incompetency thanks to Hamilton.

Making the Lame Kiffin hire based mostly on an 'all-star' recruiting staff and his daddy was totally ludicrous. Hire a HC based on the HC's resume, not a bunch of peripheral B.S.

Of course no one expected it to end up the way it did but it was stupid hiring strategy to begin with and then to follow it up with a losing coach from La Tech was just icing on this crapcake.

Bottomline is Fulmer needed to go if we were to get back to the top, but thanks to Hamilton we ended up even worse off.
 
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