Goodbye Oregon Football

#627
#627
Lol, Bearcat. If he wants to believe this is an elaborate conspiracy, you won't be able to change his mind.
 
#628
#628
I just have this really weird feeling that wheaton will never agree with you guys, and you guys will never agree with wheaton. Doubt it's worth anyone's time or effort.
 
#629
#629
MaehlMan said:
I just have this really weird feeling that wheaton will never agree with you guys, and you guys will never agree with wheaton. Doubt it's worth anyone's time or effort.
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If someone told me that the sky is turquoise, I wouldnt agree with them either.
 
#631
#631
#635
#635
BearCat204 said:
If the taxi driver was sleeping over at your house and had an established personal relationship with you outside of a normal scouting relationship and the taxi driver was being paid by the school, yes. Its in black and white, why you refuse to read and understand the rule is beyond me.
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Ok. So, why don't you quote the "black and white" that says that a scout can't have a personal relationship with a PSA?

BearCat204 said:
Yes there is a rule against "services" be provided by someone paid by the University and if the person or recruiting service providing has a relationship outside of a normal one. I am the NCAA calls "sleeping over for a few nights" improper.
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Ok. Instead of insisting there is one or giving a number. Give me the "black and white" that supports your claim.

BearCat204 said:
13.2.14 (b) clearly states what is deemed a "representative of the University". Therefore when Lyles was having his sleepovers, he had clearly violated this bylaw.
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How does sleeping over make him a representative of the university?

BearCat204 said:
13.2.14 and 13.2.13
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What in those rules do you think supports your claim?

BearCat204 said:
Much like Bruce Pearl, complying after the fact that you have been caught is, in fact, a cover up
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Caught by who? The NCAA wasn't involved at all at that point.

BearCat204 said:
What he is saying and what his actions were (according to him) are very different.
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So you agree that when he says that he "believes" that he "crossed a line", it may mean nothing consequential?

BearCat204 said:
Tired of wasting my breath......13.2.14 and 13.2.13
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Are you breathing heavily?

BearCat204 said:
No, and in the bylaws is actually states that the University can pay a taxi driver to transport a PSA
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That's not the right comparison. That would be regarding benefits to PSAs. Programs can pay for services without them being ruled boosters. For example, paying for inside information and taxi rides.

BearCat204 said:
You should read it again
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You should support your claims.
 
#636
#636
Why did Oregon football stoop so low, they had all the prospects creaming over their unis. Whether or not Kelly is the stand up straight as an arrow guy or not it certainly does lend some cred to to what Droski has been saying for years now.
 
#638
#638
wheaton4prez said:
Ok. So, why don't you quote the "black and white" that says that a scout can't have a personal relationship with a PSA?



Ok. Instead of insisting there is one or giving a number. Give me the "black and white" that supports your claim.



How does sleeping over make him a representative of the university?



What in those rules do you think supports your claim?



Caught by who? The NCAA wasn't involved at all at that point.



So you agree that when he says that he "believes" that he "crossed a line", it may mean nothing consequential?



Are you breathing heavily?



That's not the right comparison. That would be regarding benefits to PSAs. Programs can pay for services without them being ruled boosters. For example, paying for inside information and taxi rides.



You should support your claims.
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Needs more extremist political cartoon images for full commitment to the stubborn bat**** crazy approach.
 
#642
#642
wheaton4prez said:
Ok. So, why don't you quote the "black and white" that says that a scout can't have a personal relationship with a PSA?



Ok. Instead of insisting there is one or giving a number. Give me the "black and white" that supports your claim.



How does sleeping over make him a representative of the university?



What in those rules do you think supports your claim?



Caught by who? The NCAA wasn't involved at all at that point.



So you agree that when he says that he "believes" that he "crossed a line", it may mean nothing consequential?



Are you breathing heavily?



That's not the right comparison. That would be regarding benefits to PSAs. Programs can pay for services without them being ruled boosters. For example, paying for inside information and taxi rides.



You should support your claims.
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Ok, I'm done. There comes a point to where it is just sad. I really could care less if you get it or not by now.
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#643
#643
OK, I'm not taking up for W4Prez by any stretch. I think (a) he is an ostrich with his head in the sand and (b) Oregon gets nailed for this. The NCAA has no choice but to make an example in a case like this, IMHO. BUT!

Looking at: http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/D111.pdf , I can't even find articles 13.2.13/14 that BearCat references. Period. They're not there. I do, however, find the following, which I believe is enough to fry UO.



13.2.1 General Regulation. An institution’s staff member or any representative of its athletics interests shall
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not be involved, directly or indirectly, in making arrangements for or giving or offering to give any financial aid or
other benefits to a prospective student-athlete or his or her relatives or friends, other than expressly permitted by
NCAA regulations. Receipt of a benefit by prospective a student-athlete or his or her relatives or friends is not a
violation of NCAA legislation if it is determined that the same benefit is generally available to the institution’s prospective
students or their relatives or friends or to a particular segment of the student body (e.g., international students,
minority students) determined on a basis unrelated to athletics ability.​
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​
(Revised: 10/28/97, 11/1/00, 3/24/05)​
13.2.1.1 Specific Prohibitions.​
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Specifically prohibited financial aid, benefits and arrangements include, but
are not limited to, the following:
(a) An employment arrangement for a prospective student-athlete’s relatives;
(b) Gift of clothing or equipment;
(c) Cosigning of loans;
(d) Providing loans to a prospective student-athlete’s relatives or friends;
(e) Cash or like items;
(f ) Any tangible items, including merchandise;
(g) Free or reduced-cost services, rentals or purchases of any type;
(h) Free or reduced-cost housing;
(i) Use of an institution’s athletics equipment (e.g., for a high school all-star game);
(j) Sponsorship of or arrangement for an awards banquet for high school, preparatory school or two-yearcollege
athletes by an institution, representatives of its athletics interests or its alumni groups or booster
clubs; and
(k) Expenses for academic services (e.g., tutoring, test preparation) to assist in the completion of initial-eligibility
or transfer-eligibility requirements or improvement of the prospective student-athlete’s academic​

profile in conjunction with a waiver request. (Adopted: 4/23/08)
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So, ol' Willie's most recent interviews pretty much read: "I'm just the guy's friend, trying to represent him and get him into the college of his choice! I know I crossed some lines in doing it, but it was just my love and commitment to my friend and nothing else. Honest Injun!"

The problem is that he got $$$ from oregon to help his friend, and that's a bnig no-no according to the rules. Not helping in ANY way:

(a) Signed notes thanking him for his help. This indicates he is a representative of Oregon's recruiting while being paid to help his friend.
(b) The materials supposedly purchase from recruit's friend were useless, outdated, provided after-the-fact, and admittedly cobbled together by Kelly's request hours before the story broke ("Just give me anything!")
(c) Kelly's lies, dishonesty and apparent attempted cover-up after the fact, giving strong indication that the dealings were improper and he knew about it!

Kelly is a pig on a silver platter with an apple in his mouth, period. W4Prez... There is your black and white. If you can hear me with your head in the sand, just give up and come up for air. All the denial is pitiful and unbecoming.

BearCat, if I missed particulars in the articles you listed but I couldn't find, I would be interested in seeing them. Not calling you out; I really would be interested in any particulars that I don't have.

Peace all. I have a feeling Kelly and UO is about to be the college football version of "The Restaurant at the End of the Universe."
 
#645
#645
KB5252 said:
Why did Oregon football stoop so low, they had all the prospects creaming over their unis. Whether or not Kelly is the stand up straight as an arrow guy or not it certainly does lend some cred to to what Droski has been saying for years now.
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ewwwww. This just brought back memories of Monica Lewinsky & Bill Clinton
 
#646
#646
Follow-Up: Sorry BearCat. I found them. Ouch. If that's the case:

OU paid a friend of a recruit, which is expressly prohibited by the rules.
If Lyles is deemed a representative of OU (not sure how he couldn't with the hand-written notes), then everything Lyles did (like petition courts for change of guardianship, suggest a recruit move out of state to skirt eligibility issues...), OU is considered to have done.

13.02.13 Recruiting.

Previous Cite: 13.02.12.2 Institutional Orientation Session. Next Cite: 13.02.13.1 Recruited Prospective Student-Athlete. Recruiting is any solicitation of a prospective student-athlete or a prospective student-athlete's relatives (or legal guardians) by an institutional staff member or by a representative of the institution's athletics interests for the purpose of securing the prospective student-athlete's enrollment and ultimate participation in the institution's intercollegiate athletics program.



13.02.14.1 Duration of Status.

Previous Cite: 13.02.14 Representative of Athletics Interests. Next Cite: 13.02.15 Telephone Calls. Once an individual, independent agency, corporate entity or other organization is identified as such a representative, the person, independent agency, corporate entity or other organization retains that identity indefinitely. (Revised: 2/16/00)




13.02.14 Representative of Athletics Interests.

Previous Cite: 13.02.13.1 Recruited Prospective Student-Athlete. Next Cite: 13.02.14.1 Duration of Status. A "representative of the institution's athletics interests" is an individual, independent agency, corporate entity (e.g., apparel or equipment manufacturer) or other organization who is known (or who should have been known) by a member of the institution's executive or athletics administration to: (Revised: 2/16/00)
(a) Have participated in or to be a member of an agency or organization promoting the institution's intercollegiate athletics program;
(b) Have made financial contributions to the athletics department or to an athletics booster organization of that institution;
(c) Be assisting or to have been requested (by the athletics department staff) to assist in the recruitment of prospective student-athletes;
(d) Be assisting or to have assisted in providing benefits to enrolled student-athletes or their families; or
(e) Have been involved otherwise in promoting the institution's athletics program.
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#649
#649
IPorange said:
This is actually the most blatant rules violation we've seen in the last year.
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And Oregon wants you to believe that they just made a paperwork mistake and then tried to clear it up. Oregon will burn and Kelly will be without a job this time next year(actually depends on how slow the AA will be with this). I dont see how anyone can read the bylaws and recruiting rules and come up with a conclusion that Oregon and/or Kelly did nothing wrong.
 
#650
#650
I especially liked the radio interview with Canzaco(sp?) when Lyles was saying he just got off work. When asked about his job, he commented on it being in a deli
 
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