HOLLY could be the worst coach....

Your point:

That elite men's teams losing to an unranked team is completely different than LV. Men's teams with quality players lose because of the composition of the team, not because of poor coaching.

Therefore, LV losing with AA is still Holly's fault.

(Which is wrong. )

Generally speaking, the reasons are different. Sometimes coaching is the reason, but not as often as in the women's game. Because it's a longer established and more of a revenue generating proposition, men's basketball draws, on the whole, better coaches than the women's game does.
If you read my other post in this thread, you would know that my expectations for this team this year is on par with how they've performed, so far.
Let me ask you a question. What was the last full season that the LV's played to or exceeded your expectations ?
 
I was among the 12,000 enthusiastic LV fans that attended last Sunday’s game against Georgia. There were U-T students, families with young kids, retired folks who have been avid fans since the PHS era, and school bus loads of high schoolers from all over East Tennessee. And we all were unified by our love for the Lady Vols. We came to see some great basketball and enjoy the unique atmosphere of a filled arena of screaming fans. We were not disappointed! We cheered some great plays by our Ladies, laughed at some silly plays by our inexperienced, but talented (and rapidly learning), freshmen. These fans were not thinking “Fahr Holly.” They were enjoying a great fan experience. The uncertainty of winning added excitement to the experience. The fans were trying their best to “will” the team to win. And they did! It was great fun.

I realize that there are thousands of Lady Vol fans across the country that cannot attend a game in person. I get that. But let’s think about the fallout of a coaching change:

1) We would most likely lose not just Holly, but ALL of the existing coaches.
2) We would most likely lose some of our existing players (who were Holly recruits) and signed and unsigned recruits.
3) Recruiting would most likely suffer for several years as the new coaching staff establishes its credibility and develops a new recruiting pipeline.
4) The fan base would most likely split into two opposing factions—those who supported Holly and those who support the coaching change (That could get very nasty.).

So, for those who are screaming for a coaching change, I suggest you think about the unintended fallout that could occur from that change. There is much that is good about our team and coaches. As the old saying goes: “If you break it, you’ve bought it.” As for myself, I am going to be in the other camp: “If it’s not broken, don’t fix it.”
 
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Oh my God, all this nonsensical dissection of minutiae within a text eviscerates value from statements and drowns the thread.
 
Worst Coach! Yawns!

Same ole broken record. Skip the season if the coaching sucks that bad.

A young team with only 4 losses. wuteva.

I back Pat and roll with Holly!
 
I think anybody who isn't a troller on this site, all want a quick return to prominence. By most accounts, we ARE prominent now. But those of us who experienced the Pat Summitt experience as it was happening and felt saw what such a dominating coach could do for a university and even more, a gender....Yes, we all want to get back to top four and stay there.

We opened the season with a historic run...We went through a "last year" flashback for 6 games...We are now on a win streak again... "Perfect Storm" time again

We've got a top recruiting class following a top recruiting class...this shows that it's not only us who want a return to greatness,,,the ones who recruited those kids must want it too.........and those recruits who chose UT over other programs,,,They're not coming here for anything other than a chance to propel us to greatness.

It's all "there" and ready for that return

The talent is there, Yes. Yet, actions speak louder than words. As a coach are you telling me that you thought, given the talent on this team that we had "prominent wins" over most of the cupcakes on this schedule we should have dominated?

Other than the part of your post I bolded, let's agree to disagree.
 
The talent is there, Yes. Yet, actions speak louder than words. As a coach are you telling me that you thought, given the talent on this team that we had "prominent wins" over most of the cupcakes on this schedule we should have dominated?

Other than the part of your post I bolded, let's agree to disagree.

:horse:

Tonight we play ALA..Prominent?...No...Unless you factor in what they have done to us in the last three meetings....Then, is it prominent?

Every win is prominent because each one we don't have is a drop in the standings.

As a coach, I can see flaws in wins. And I can see growth in defeats. And I often point both out.

This team this year is the closest thing that our program has had to players continuously maturing and growing. (Both staff and players).
 
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I refuse to rate Holly, but the results are real - the same crap year after year.

People continually say the Lady Vols are a great rebounding team - WRONG! They used to be.

They either refuse to or are not coached to drive in and take it to basket for 40 minutes. They simply cannot handle a good 2-3 zone.

There is no sense of urgency or continuous energy level for pacing and pressure.

Now, with all this talent, the same results again? Sure, they are better this year, but it'll be a miracle if they make it past the Sweet 16.

Holly does not effectively encourage or teach toughness. Given my limited respect for Geno, at least you can see his results - girls who are relentless and play above their individual reputation and ranking - Maya Moore and couple others notwithstanding.

If you really want to be a winner, then you should copy the best. Auriema has emplored teams to step up and play at his level. Study him and play like him. Beat him. COMPETE!

Mississippi and South Carolina have a clue!

It is simply time for Holly to go. Watching this is far too frustrating. Fulmer needs to be a real AD and make the change.

Peace Out!
 
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:horse:

Tonight we play ALA..Prominent?...No...Unless you factor in what they have done to us in the last three meetings....Then, is it prominent?

Every win is prominent because each one we don't have is a drop in the standings.

As a coach, I can see flaws in wins. And I can see growth in defeats. And I often point both out.

This team this year is the closest thing that our program has had to players continuously maturing and growing. (Both staff and players).

This is either masterful sarcasm or you write for The Onion.

I suppose there's a third possibility...that you're one of those hapless Holly backers who sees LV basketball "turning the corner" at every TV time out.
 
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I was among the 12,000 enthusiastic LV fans that attended last Sunday’s game against Georgia. There were U-T students, families with young kids, retired folks who have been avid fans since the PHS era, and school bus loads of high schoolers from all over East Tennessee. And we all were unified by our love for the Lady Vols. We came to see some great basketball and enjoy the unique atmosphere of a filled arena of screaming fans. We were not disappointed! We cheered some great plays by our Ladies, laughed at some silly plays by our inexperienced, but talented (and rapidly learning), freshmen. These fans were not thinking “Fahr Holly.” They were enjoying a great fan experience. The uncertainty of winning added excitement to the experience. The fans were trying their best to “will” the team to win. And they did! It was great fun.

I realize that there are thousands of Lady Vol fans across the country that cannot attend a game in person. I get that. But let’s think about the fallout of a coaching change:

1) We would most likely lose not just Holly, but ALL of the existing coaches.
2) We would most likely lose some of our existing players (who were Holly recruits) and signed and unsigned recruits.
3) Recruiting would most likely suffer for several years as the new coaching staff establishes its credibility and develops a new recruiting pipeline.
4) The fan base would most likely split into two opposing factions—those who supported Holly and those who support the coaching change (That could get very nasty.).

So, for those who are screaming for a coaching change, I suggest you think about the unintended fallout that could occur from that change. There is much that is good about our team and coaches. As the old saying goes: “If you break it, you’ve bought it.” As for myself, I am going to be in the other camp: “If it’s not broken, don’t fix it.”

I believe your comments are true if UT hires an unproven assistant coach as HC. Your comments are not true if they hired a Vic Schaefer or Muffet McGraw. BTW, the LV program is broke.
 
I don't think Holly is necessarily the 'worst' coach. I do think she's way in over her head in Knoxville. No doubt she was a crackerjack assistant all those years and could cut it at a reasonably decent high school program.
 
Pat always emphasized getting the ball inside but the difference she had players that had movement and could get open playing inside. Russell has no movement she may walk from one side of the lane to the other then she just stands with arms outstretched and other teams arms already slapping her arms. She has nothing as far as speed or moves to shed defenders and she certainly can't take it one on one and make a play.
If you get her the ball over a 60 percent chance she will make the shot but what good is that if ten times a game it is a turnover. Your successful 10 times she makes six for 12 points then you have to add the ten turnovers making her 6 for 20 or 30 percent.
Teams don't want her to get the ball and they have seen how much Tennessee turns it over in their efforts to get it to her. They like the percentages especially thinking that the other four players can't make a perimeter shot successfully. Teams are willing to gamble look for more of it in all the games left.
Davis and Jackson step up and make the offense other than the many turnovers successful last night. We need that to continue minus the turnovers.

Four players can't make a perimeter shot successfully.
So true, Hayes is always open at the three line and has no
NO shot from the three. So sad.
 
In reality Tennessee AD and boosters are very contented to win 20 games in women's basketball and make the NCAA tourney. Expectations have been lowered because if not true Holly would've never survived the last two seasons. No Lady Vol basketball team has lost 12 and 14 in two seasons if that didn't get her fired she is safe.
 
UT doesn't demand excellence in sports, we hope for great coaches and only by luck did we have Pat. Few really cared about women's BB until Pat won big. We've let that ONE sport at Tennessee that did demand excellence fall to also ran. It's sickening to watch our program just languishing.
 
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Pat set the championship standard at UT, not UTAD. It was her determination, persistence and demand for excellence that hung those banners in the rafters. We benefited from her presence and now we're suffering from her absence.

To be great, our coaches and players have to have the desire and the competitive drive to achieve greatness. I don't see that anywhere around this program. Not anymore.
 
:horse:

Tonight we play ALA..Prominent?...No...Unless you factor in what they have done to us in the last three meetings....Then, is it prominent?

Every win is prominent because each one we don't have is a drop in the standings.

As a coach, I can see flaws in wins. And I can see growth in defeats. And I often point both out.

This team this year is the closest thing that our program has had to players continuously maturing and growing. (Both staff and players).

For me, that is why the Bama loss has more sting than others this season (and the meltdown against ND was pretty painful). Essentially it was a replay of the LSU debacle. Bama used the same formula of high energy, attack the boards, and press the ball. And for most of the game, the LVs were not matching Bama's effort. Had Bama not missed a score of easy buckets at the rim, the Lvs could have easily been down 10 at half. Now, the game changed in the 3rd quarter--when led by Meme--the LVs changed gears and showed they could dominate Bama with skill, speed, and athleticism.

But, once they got the game "in control", they fell back into something that looked like a lethargic complacency. Their mindset seemed to be "okay, we asserted ourselves and now Bama will just slink away". But Bama kept grinding and fighting and then due to fatigue or nerves or something else, the LVs once again collapsed down the stretch. It was like Bama's "body blows" eventually took them out, to use a boxing analogy.

I am NOT in the fire Holly camp but she bears responsibility for this tendency. I don't think it is just about when she does or does not take time-outs.

My new pet theory is that this LV team (for all their positive qualities) are more interested in show time flash than the down and dirty side of the game. They have shown "grit" in periodic moments but they do not seem fully committed to the CPS mantra of "defense and rebounding win championships." Perhaps, they believe that a win can be pulled off down the stretch with highlight reel passes and flashy one-one-one plays.

A great team has to have the offensive spark AND the proverbial "blue collar" work ethic. We have seen some games where the LVs put both sides together and then they look a potential Final Four team.

But, teams like LSU and Bama who are a bit smaller, very quick (and least when they play us) are willing to hustle for 40 minutes, force the issue. It is hard to stay after such "pesky" teams for 4 quarters and at some point, the LVs, as CPS would have said, do the one thing you can never do-- "give into fatigue" (mental or physical).

In the early season, Green often provided the blue collar energy spark when she came off the bench but that has not been doing that of late. Dunbar is just not physically built to be that kind of player. Annie could (and should) play that role but her defensive play is often subpar and half hearted, so she perpetuates the problem.

I am not sure what the solution is but Meme is the one LV player who seems to be carrying the CPS mindset forward game in and game out. CHW needs to get the rest of the team following her example.
 
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Nared, Meme and Davis are our fighters. If the LVs are going to keep the season alive, those are the ones who'll lead the charge. MR will hit shots if they can get her the ball in position, but she wears down and disappears. KK doesn't have the conditioning to play many minutes, but if we can get 10-15 quality minutes from her, that could help.
 
All true, but she will not be fired. There are simply not enough people who care to make the change happen.
I am afraid you are right. Everyone know Holly can't coach, but Phil Fulmer being a long time friend of Holly is what worries me. I am afraid he will not fire Holly.
 
She has yet to get the right mix of 5 star/McDonalds All American players to really gauge her performance. Only 8 of them on this roster.
With all the All Americans she has recruited she should have won the SEC every year she has been HC. She has been very good at recruiting, but can't HC. It will be like this with her as long as she is HC. Can't communicate with players. Have you ever listened to her post game enter views? She can't get her points over. Ever notice how many times she says I don't know?
 
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Nared, Meme and Davis are our fighters. If the LVs are going to keep the season alive, those are the ones who'll lead the charge. MR will hit shots if they can get her the ball in position, but she wears down and disappears. KK doesn't have the conditioning to play many minutes, but if we can get 10-15 quality minutes from her, that could help.

Evina was a fighter early in the season. Lately she has struggled in a variety of ways.
The only consistent fighter we have is Meme. But the problem is that she has off nights scoring like any player, but, she can’t affect a game offensively like Nared can.
Even nared doesn’t fight sometimes, especially on defense. I don’t think rennia likes playing defense that much either. There’s a reason we have to play zone a lot; players don’t want to put in the effort to get down in a stance and guard someone. It will hurt their games at the next level. Say what you want about shekinna Strickland/glory Johnson years; those players play in the WNBA because they can guard somebody.
Our real problem is that we have lacked a good point guard since Shannon bobbit. Our offensive style demands someone who can run the offense with confidence and poise. Holly has her faults, but I think her biggest is that seemingly she cannot coach or demand excellence from a point guard after having been one herself. This year it’s the worst it’s ever been because we have two top ten guards who, though freshmen, can’t get it together to produce at least a 2:1 turnover ratio. Evina certainly has the abilities, but she isn’t getting coached to do better! It will be CHW’s failure if evina leaves or doesn’t become the player she’s capable of being. Annie suffers from a lack of confidence and a weak jump shot. We must demand leadership and excellence at the point guard position if we are going to do better.
 
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At the first of the season I expressed the view that we would struggle this year because we had no center, no coach, and no bench. The Holly huggers tore me a new one. So now I say this team will because they have no center, no coach, and no bench.
 
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