Homelessness in Portland

#105
#105
LouderVol said:
Because Americans dont want to work. Heck I dont want to work.

We arent seeing the same payments going out, so if anything your chart backs me up. Once the money dried up more people had to go back to work.

Although I will say Kemp is apparently going to be sending out some more covid checks, one of the few things by him I have had a big problem with.
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Would you still work if the .gov were giving you $10k/yr?
 
#106
#106
DonjoVol said:
It's not a libertarian ideal. What you are doing is trying to pass off your "democrat" or left wing ideals as libertarian. People aren't buying it.
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IDC if stubborn people buy it. I didn't invent the idea of voucher programs. I think it was a libertarian named Milton Friedman, but maybe he just popularized it.

Educate yourself.
 
#107
#107
Milton Friedman also advocated welfare for working people. OMG, how could he do that? Well, he did it because it was a more libertarian idea than the existing welfare setup. Far too nuanced for some people (who probably support some form of welfare) to understand.
 
#109
#109
n_huffhines said:
Would you still work if the .gov were giving you $10k/yr?
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Me, yes. Average American on government welfare, no. Some chunk of Americans earning minimum wage, no. Or you would see them reduce hours to receive increased benefits.

The issue UBI deals with is it is not going to change those who arent productive into productive. Doesnt matter the reason really. You are still paying them for nothing. You still have them dependent on the government.
 
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#110
#110
n_huffhines said:
Milton Friedman also advocated welfare for working people. OMG, how could he do that? Well, he did it because it was a more libertarian idea than the existing welfare setup. Far too nuanced for some people (who probably support some form of welfare) to understand.
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Yeah, I said that already. You’re behind
 
#111
#111
LouderVol said:
Me, yes. Average American on government welfare, no. Some chunk of Americans earning minimum wage, no. Or you would see them reduce hours to receive increased benefits.

The issue UBI deals with is it is not going to change those who arent productive into productive. Doesnt matter the reason really. You are still paying them for nothing. You still have them dependent on the government.
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They lower income class already get a UBI. handouts and tax exemptions, Child welfare credits, ad nauseam.
 
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#113
#113
LouderVol said:
Consent. Interactions should only being constentual. A big part for true consent is being reasonably informed.
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If a business owner can run their business the way they want then it isn't their job to make sure anyone else is reasonably informed. Someone can find out how they run their business when they get there. Right?
 
#114
#114
DonjoVol said:
If a business owner can run their business the way they want then it isn't their job to make sure anyone else is reasonably informed. Someone can find out how they run their business when they get there. Right?
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No. Common sense is a mutual agreement.

You aren't allowed to act like a c*** and expect this to be your profession.
 
#115
#115
T Clifton said:
No. Common sense is a mutual agreement.

You aren't allowed to act like a c*** and expect this to be your profession.
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They don't have to have a mutual agreement according to these guys. After all they are the ones claiming private businesses can do what they want.

So they can either do what they want or they can't. There is no middle ground here.
 
#116
#116
n_huffhines said:
Milton Friedman also advocated welfare for working people. OMG, how could he do that? Well, he did it because it was a more libertarian idea than the existing welfare setup. Far too nuanced for some people (who probably support some form of welfare) to understand.
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Some working people already receive government assistance.
 
#117
#117
n_huffhines said:
IDC if stubborn people buy it. I didn't invent the idea of voucher programs. I think it was a libertarian named Milton Friedman, but maybe he just popularized it.

Educate yourself.
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I never said I was for any kind of education voucher. If people are that concerned about where anyone goes to school then they should be able to pool their money and resources together and help these kids out themselves.
 
#118
#118
n_huffhines said:
Milton Friedman also advocated welfare for working people. OMG, how could he do that? Well, he did it because it was a more libertarian idea than the existing welfare setup. Far too nuanced for some people (who probably support some form of welfare) to understand.
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He also helped the treasury department come up with the idea for income tax withholding, which was probably THE biggest factor in the government's ability to become a super-bloated mess. He didn't see the unintended consequences (which were disastrous long-term) of what he was advocating for. Can't help but wonder if there aren't a few potentially disastrous unintended consequences waiting to be unleashed by UBI.
 
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#119
#119
SamRebel35 said:
He also helped the treasury department come up with the idea for income tax withholding, which was probably THE biggest factor in the government's ability to become a super-bloated mess. He didn't see the unintended consequences (which were disastrous long-term) of what he was advocating for. Can't help but wonder if there aren't a few potentially disastrous unintended consequences waiting to be unleashed by UBI.
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Here's a VERY likely unintended consequence of UBI - homeless drug addicts saying thank you very much for the monthly stimulus payments that they'll use to buy more drugs while remaining homeless. As it turns out, homeless drug addicts aren't reliable stewards of cash.
 
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#124
#124
DonjoVol said:
If a business owner can run their business the way they want then it isn't their job to make sure anyone else is reasonably informed. Someone can find out how they run their business when they get there. Right?
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I am fine with it being listed at the door as long as it isnt in a lawyer font size. As I stated reasonably informed, some of that is on the end user, and not everything has to be public about the business operation itself. I just think for the owner to have the right to refuse customers on a preconceived item, aka Bama fan, it has to be posted. Customer is a Jack hole they can get refused afterwards, but straight denial of service should be posted.
 
#125
#125
DonjoVol said:
They don't have to have a mutual agreement according to these guys. After all they are the ones claiming private businesses can do what they want.

So they can either do what they want or they can't. There is no middle ground here.
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Why is there no middle ground? I have already mentioned a specific middle ground I would like to see, informed consent.

Apparently in your world there is only complete anarchy or totalitarian government bs.
 
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