Hot Take on Pruitt and rebuilding

[BloomuVol]

Why would Dabo leave Clemson to follow in Nick Saban’s footsteps? Why would any coach want to?

💰💰💰💰, and his alma mater

 

[WiseOlVol]

Once Pruitt starts beating Saban, he's not going back.

 

[BloomuVol]

Once Pruitt starts beating Saban, he's not going back.

I can't wait the day.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

I don't doubt some or most of those guys mentioned play but will it result in more wins?

Imo at most it means 1 more win but that is unlikely and that isn't enough of a boost to make it worth it.

It's all speculation at this point either way.

But you've gotta think the 2 grad transfers will be the difference in a win or two, especially if we deal with any injuries at their positions. We should be in a position to do really well for ourselves on the back end of the schedule against Charlotte, UK, Mizzou, and Vandy. But if JG and Chandler get banged up in the killer stretch against UGA, Auburn, Bama, and USCe, then we'll be happy we're not marching out McBride under center and that we won't have to lean on a true freshman as our only power back.

I have lost count to be honest. We now have 3 grad transfers and 3 more blue shirts by my count. How many of those can count toward the 18 class?

One grad transfer is a walk-on (the kicker). The Blue shirts would count against 2019, wouldn't they? The grad transfers would count against 2018, IIRC. Either way, worst case scenario we can take 20 kids in 2019.


That's not a very big hit, TBH. Recruiting is about getting the right kids rather than a lot of kids. Look at Clemson, they've as successful recruiting as well as anyone in the country and the last 3 years they've signed 21, 14, and 17 kids. But the average rating of the kids they do sign is really high. That's the model we need to try and replicate, IMO. Taking a smaller class is fine as long as the guys you fill it with are quality players.

 

[KBVol]

Kirby wants to do at his alma mater what Saban's done at Bama. Don't know that it's possible but I believe that it's his ultimate goal. Pruitt's pedigree is more ingrained at Bama, but they won't hire him if he's not successful at UT. Which would make for a strange situation.

It’s not possible. No offense.

 

[BruinVol]

It's all speculation at this point either way.

But you've gotta think the 2 grad transfers will be the difference in a win or two, especially if we deal with any injuries at their positions. We should be in a position to do really well for ourselves on the back end of the schedule against Charlotte, UK, Mizzou, and Vandy. But if JG and Chandler get banged up in the killer stretch against UGA, Auburn, Bama, and USCe, then we'll be happy we're not marching out McBride under center and that we won't have to lean on a true freshman as our only power back.







One grad transfer is a walk-on (the kicker). The Blue shirts would count against 2019, wouldn't they? The grad transfers would count against 2018, IIRC. Either way, worst case scenario we can take 20 kids in 2019.


That's not a very big hit, TBH. Recruiting is about getting the right kids rather than a lot of kids. Look at Clemson, they've as successful recruiting as well as anyone in the country and the last 3 years they've signed 21, 14, and 17 kids. But the average rating of the kids they do sign is really high. That's the model we need to try and replicate, IMO. Taking a smaller class is fine as long as the guys you fill it with are quality players.

If Pruitt cleans house like most new coaches with new systems signing 20 is a big difference between signing 25.

You bring up Clemson as a model and that is a good one I agree but it was a very slow grind to the top. Reducing classes by 20% to get grad transfers and overlooked juco guys isn't building at a slow pace like Clemson

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

If Pruitt cleans house like most new coaches with new systems signing 20 is a big difference between signing 25.

20% is kind of disingenuous because it makes it seem more significant than 5 people. And we don't know for sure what the number is or will be. That's a worst case scenario assuming all 3 blue shirts and 2 grad transfers will count against 2019. I'm not sure if that's the case or not. If the GTs count against 2018, then theoretically we could take 22 in 2019.

You bring up Clemson as a model and that is a good one I agree but it was a very slow grind to the top. Reducing classes by 20% to get grad transfers and overlooked juco guys isn't building at a slow pace like Clemson

Yeah it's not a perfect analogy because we just aren't where they are at the moment.


But the top priority is to get there. Making sure we have the pieces in place to get to a bowl game is a really important first step for that, IMO. If we want to win recruiting battles against Bama, Clemson, and UGA, we've gotta be able to sell tangible results. And those extra 15 bowl practices can be big for development as well.



IMO, London and Chryst are insurance on us being able to make it to a bowl game. If it turns out that we didn't need them to get there, it will be unfortunate. If JG or Chandler end up missing any time, though, we'll be happy we have added them IMO.

 

[BruinVol]

20% is kind of disingenuous because it makes it seem more significant than 5 people. And we don't know for sure what the number is or will be. That's a worst case scenario assuming all 3 blue shirts and 2 grad transfers will count against 2019. I'm not sure if that's the case or not. If the GTs count against 2018, then theoretically we could take 22 in 2019.




Yeah it's not a perfect analogy because we just aren't where they are at the moment.


But the top priority is to get there. Making sure we have the pieces in place to get to a bowl game is a really important first step for that, IMO. If we want to win recruiting battles against Bama, Clemson, and UGA, we've gotta be able to sell tangible results. And those extra 15 bowl practices can be big for development as well.



IMO, London and Chryst are insurance on us being able to make it to a bowl game. If it turns out that we didn't need them to get there, it will be unfortunate. If JG or Chandler end up missing any time, though, we'll be happy we have added them IMO.

Chryst is the only one I think that even has a chance to make a difference between a W/L. The difference between CFA(or any of our other backup RBs) or London isn't enough to matter imo. Same with the CB

 

[wfd53]

Ok let's make this clear I like Pruitt and think he is a great fit with one big IF and that is IF he doesn't bolt for Bama in the next few years.

Now with that said I think what we are seeing now with how he is recruiting and burning spots for the 2019 class with grad transfers and this latest juco commit is a coach that is prioritizing a long shot at winning now over Buiding for the future.

Imo these spots we keep burning for 2019 are showing a short sided approach to the rebuilding process. I think we need to be saving spots so that the 2019 class can begin to get us back on track.

Now for the hot take part but I am starting to think there may be some truth to this. Pruitt knows Saban is retiring in a few years and he is desperately trying to win an extra game or two this first year or two so that he puts himself into a better spot to go home. He doesn't really care about taking the approach of rebuilding this thing for the long haul which saving spots for later classes requires.

Following Saban at AL is a good career move? Unless Saban has far less success prior to his retirement, his successor has a high probability of failure.

 

[BruinVol]

Following Saban at AL is a good career move? Unless Saban has far less success prior to his retirement, his successor has a high probability of failure.

No doubt the next coach likely fails. I just tend to think Pruitt loves the Tide like many of us love the Vols. I'd give my left nut knowing I would fail and eventually lose my right one to lead the Vols thru the T!

 

[njvols]

I remember when some poor soul asked, pre-year 4, if we should be worried about whether Butch would bolt for Big 10 country, where he's from.

Pruitt is a different cat though. He's not dolling out Butchism quotes...just going to work. I'd hope we're worried about him bolting to Bama in a few years. It would mean he's built UT back to where it should be.

 

[njvols]

It’s not possible. No offense.

But our D will be stellar...

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

Chryst is the only one I think that even has a chance to make a difference between a W/L. The difference between CFA(or any of our other backup RBs) or London isn't enough to matter imo. Same with the CB

CFA's future as a RB isn't certain though. Given the type of RBs we're pursuing and the fact that they're giving Fant a look there, it doesn't seem like CFA is a very good fit at RB in our new system. So London rounds out our top 3 (Chandler, London, Jordan) pretty well and should allow us to bring Banks along more slowly instead of having to rely on him immediately.


The CB has 3 years to play though, so you've gotta think a bit more long term with him than with London and Chryst. IMO, it's likely we have one or two DBs who will transfer before fall 2018. We probably have some guys who will give the spring a go, see where they stand with the new staff, and then move on. Adding the JUCO CB will mean we have the numbers to get through 2018 for sure. But ultimately he shouldn't be judged on his 2018 impact. We won't really know until the 2019 season at the earliest whether he was a good addition or not.


On the other hand, we'll know by December whether London and Chryst were good or necessary additions. If we miss a bowl, then yeah they were failures. If we make one, but neither had much impact, then they were unnecessary risks. If we make a bowl and they both had meaningful contributions towards that, then Pruitt made a smart call bringing

 

[volbeast33]

No I am not willing to wait but I dang sure would take winning 6 this year, 7 the next and 10 in year 3 over winning 7 games in each of his first 3 years.

So winning 7 games 3 straight years will get him the Bama job?

 

[BruinVol]

So winning 7 games 3 straight years will get him the Bama job?

No that woudnt be good but winning 7 in year 1 might just do it

 

[BruinVol]

CFA's future as a RB isn't certain though. Given the type of RBs we're pursuing and the fact that they're giving Fant a look there, it doesn't seem like CFA is a very good fit at RB in our new system. So London rounds out our top 3 (Chandler, London, Jordan) pretty well and should allow us to bring Banks along more slowly instead of having to rely on him immediately.


The CB has 3 years to play though, so you've gotta think a bit more long term with him than with London and Chryst. IMO, it's likely we have one or two DBs who will transfer before fall 2018. We probably have some guys who will give the spring a go, see where they stand with the new staff, and then move on. Adding the JUCO CB will mean we have the numbers to get through 2018 for sure. But ultimately he shouldn't be judged on his 2018 impact. We won't really know until the 2019 season at the earliest whether he was a good addition or not.


On the other hand, we'll know by December whether London and Chryst were good or necessary additions. If we miss a bowl, then yeah they were failures. If we make one, but neither had much impact, then they were unnecessary risks. If we make a bowl and they both had meaningful contributions towards that, then Pruitt made a smart call bringing

The thing with London and CFA for me is this.

Which is better?

1) a very capable backup that doesn't fit the system

Or

2) a backup that isn't very good that fits the system.


Imo neither is good and thus neither wins us an extra game which is why I'd save that spot for 2019.

Time will tell that is for sure

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

The thing with London and CFA for me is this.

Which is better?

1) a very capable backup that doesn't fit the system

Or

2) a backup that isn't very good that fits the system.


Imo neither is good and thus neither wins us an extra game which is why I'd save that spot for 2019.

Time will tell that is for sure

In reality though, things are that black and white. There's a whole range of places in between those two options where London's time at Tennessee might end up falling.


In reality, for him to be a success for us we need him to be able to compliment Chandler and possibly carry the load if Chandler is injured. The question you should be asking is if we have anybody we're certain can do this. IMO Jordan is promising, but the answer is a resounding "no." London brings some competition to the back field to help with that without the cost of counting as depth that 2019 RBs might be concerned about.


Also, are we sure GTs count against the 25 in 2019's class?

 

[BruinVol]

In reality though, things are that black and white. There's a whole range of places in between those two options where London's time at Tennessee might end up falling.


In reality, for him to be a success for us we need him to be able to compliment Chandler and possibly carry the load if Chandler is injured. The question you should be asking is if we have anybody we're certain can do this. IMO Jordan is promising, but the answer is a resounding "no." London brings some competition to the back field to help with that without the cost of counting as depth that 2019 RBs might be concerned about.


Also, are we sure GTs count against the 25 in 2019's class?

No they can count against the 18 class but it's full so they have to count forward.

I am think we are 4 over at the moment but not sure of that

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

No they can count against the 18 class but it's full so they have to count forward.

I am think we are 4 over at the moment but not sure of that

Are we sure that the 2018 class is over, though? I could have sworn we had 23 spots available for the 2018 class. As of right now, we've had 20 kids sign a LOI for us in the 2018 class and have 3 kids (including the JUCO DB) set to blue shirt. So if the blue shirts count against the 2019 class, then in theory we'd have room for the GTs to count against the 2018 class.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

So towards the bottom of this thread someone quotes Hubbs saying the number of 2019 scholarships available is

23 right now if the two blueshirts arrive.

So adding the JUCO as a blue shirt brings us to 22 spots available for 2019. Of course we could blue shirt some 2019 prospects if we wanted to add another one or two, but that would mean borrowing from 2020 scholarships.


Edit: also, after browsing through London's thread in the RF, it became clear: GTs count against 2018 class, blue shirts count against the 2019 class.






So there's that at least.

 

[tomq_123]

 

[onevol74]

If he brings us back to the point where Bama(postNick) believed he was the right guy, then that would mean he had totally turned us around. I'm not sure leaving to follow what looks to end up being the greatest in CFB history, is in his best interest. Especially when the place you are would have fallen head over heels 8n love with you. Money and family might get him, but we'll would have $$$ then too. Not a given IMO.

Let's just try to beat Vandy right now.

Reference: Doug Dickey, 1969

 

[BruinVol]

So towards the bottom of this thread someone quotes Hubbs saying the number of 2019 scholarships available is



So adding the JUCO as a blue shirt brings us to 22 spots available for 2019. Of course we could blue shirt some 2019 prospects if we wanted to add another one or two, but that would mean borrowing from 2020 scholarships.


Edit: also, after browsing through London's thread in the RF, it became clear: GTs count against 2018 class, blue shirts count against the 2019 class.






So there's that at least.

Good talk. Yea I read where they want the grad transfers to count toward 18 and I assume that is because that allows more flexibility for when they start. They can count toward 19 though if we are full which there has been some confusion about Wiggins costing us a spot. I think you migut be right as we are either at 22 or 21 for next year at the moment.


Good talk on the roster as well.

 

[swampfoxfan]

Ok let's make this clear I like Pruitt and think he is a great fit with one big IF and that is IF he doesn't bolt for Bama in the next few years.

Now with that said I think what we are seeing now with how he is recruiting and burning spots for the 2019 class with grad transfers and this latest juco commit is a coach that is prioritizing a long shot at winning now over Buiding for the future.

Imo these spots we keep burning for 2019 are showing a short sided approach to the rebuilding process. I think we need to be saving spots so that the 2019 class can begin to get us back on track.


Now for the hot take part but I am starting to think there may be some truth to this. Pruitt knows Saban is retiring in a few years and he is desperately trying to win an extra game or two this first year or two so that he puts himself into a better spot to go home. He doesn't really care about taking the approach of rebuilding this thing for the long haul which saving spots for later classes requires.

What are you thinking, CJP hasn't coached a game yet, let alone win one, and you experts have him bolting to Alabama. I remember when the same was said about Dooley bolting to Georgia.

 

[butchna]

Reference: Doug Dickey, 1969

He supplanted Florida’s version of Saban?