How to Regulate NIL

[GUNTERSVOL]

You still don't answer.

It's so easy to get around the "cap" by just signing the deals after the season starts. The deal ends before the next season starts and a new one is signed after the next season starts.

You can't dismiss players for NIL signed after the season started. That's an instant lawsuit. You can't ding the team, they were under the cap when the season started.

What can the NCAA do?

It's a worthless cap idea.

The actual transfer of money takes place during one period or the other and it is part of that seasons cap.

A deadline for NIL deals to be declared is established for each athlete. Probably a week or so before signing days. The school agrees to accept that cap hit. Any modification during an established period has to be submitted to the school for approval. Kind of like a contract, you can negotiate in the middle, but the school may NOT have space or may not elect to use their cap that way. The player gets the money for any completed deal whether or not he can continue to get on the field or not. The counter is burned for that period. It is a business risk the player gets to take at his option. If the deal is completed but payment for a later period, it hits the cap of the school where he is at that time, OR the school when signed if the player does not move to any other roster, otherwise those sneaky collectives would wink at the school and push it out knowing the player is going pro early. JUST LIKE THE PLAYERS HAVE TO SIGN DURING ESD AND NSD WINDOWS THEY WOULD HAVE TO DECLARE DURING WINDOWS. Possible to let them declare their number for the period, whether it is completed or not and the school buys it or does not. Same TYPE structure for portal guys.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

The actual transfer of money takes place during one period or the other and it is part of that seasons cap.

A deadline for NIL deals to be declared is established for each athlete. Probably a week or so before signing days. The school agrees to accept that cap hit. Any modification during an established period has to be submitted to the school for approval. Kind of like a contract, you can negotiate in the middle, but the school may NOT have space or may not elect to use their cap that way. The player gets the money for any completed deal whether or not he can continue to get on the field or not. The counter is burned for that period. It is a business risk the player gets to take at his option. If the deal is completed but payment for a later period, it hits the cap of the school where he is at that time, OR the school when signed if the player does not move to any other roster, otherwise those sneaky collectives would wink at the school and push it out knowing the player is going pro early. JUST LIKE THE PLAYERS HAVE TO SIGN DURING ESD AND NSD WINDOWS THEY WOULD HAVE TO DECLARE DURING WINDOWS. Possible to let them declare their number for the period, whether it is completed or not and the school buys it or does not. Same TYPE structure for portal guys.

Why are you obsessed with an idea that violates federal law? Stop it.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The actual transfer of money takes place during one period or the other and it is part of that seasons cap.

A deadline for NIL deals to be declared is established for each athlete. Probably a week or so before signing days. The school agrees to accept that cap hit. Any modification during an established period has to be submitted to the school for approval. Kind of like a contract, you can negotiate in the middle, but the school may NOT have space or may not elect to use their cap that way. The player gets the money for any completed deal whether or not he can continue to get on the field or not. The counter is burned for that period. It is a business risk the player gets to take at his option. If the deal is completed but payment for a later period, it hits the cap of the school where he is at that time, OR the school when signed if the player does not move to any other roster, otherwise those sneaky collectives would wink at the school and push it out knowing the player is going pro early. JUST LIKE THE PLAYERS HAVE TO SIGN DURING ESD AND NSD WINDOWS THEY WOULD HAVE TO DECLARE DURING WINDOWS. Possible to let them declare their number for the period, whether it is completed or not and the school buys it or does not. Same TYPE structure for portal guys.

Negative. You CANNOT restrict the ability of a player to sign an NIL deal at any time during the season.

NIL isn't JUST a sports thing like an athletic scholarship or roster space, it's a legal contract between 2 parties, not just athletes.

The NCAA isn't God nor the government. They can't control when and what NIL is signed.

You fail.

 

[txbo]

Why are you obsessed with an idea that violates federal law? Stop it.

With the current ruling in place, NIL is un regulatable.

 

[TheDeeble]

Multiple transfers hurt their ability to get a degree,

its simply about not letting the portal cost a college athlete his degree.

What is it about transferring that hurts someone's ability to get a degree?

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

What is it about transferring that hurts someone's ability to get a degree?

Exactly. Transfers don't hamper getting a degree at all. Thousands of college students do it every year.

 

[GoodTimeVol]

With the current ruling in place, NIL is un regulatable.

Why does NIL need to be regulated? If businesses/collectives want to pay these players then by law they have every right…

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Satan weighs in on controlling NIL via the schools rolling "marketing rights" into the athletic scholarship, so the amount could be "capped."

I'm not remarkably surprised Saban proposes something where old fashioned "dark money" would be back in play.

Death, taxes, and Saban looking to restore the edge to what Bama does best...... pay under the table.

Saban plans to speak out for 'meaningful change'

Nick Saban said Wednesday he plans to take stronger stances on issues such as NIL and the transfer portal because "what we have now is not college football."

www.espn.com

 

[volfanhill]

Satan weighs in on controlling NIL via the schools rolling "marketing rights" into the athletic scholarship, so the amount could be "capped."

I'm not remarkably surprised Saban proposes something where old fashioned "dark money" would be back in play.

Death, taxes, and Saban looking to restore the edge to what Bama does best...... pay under the table.

Saban plans to speak out for 'meaningful change'

Nick Saban said Wednesday he plans to take stronger stances on issues such as NIL and the transfer portal because "what we have now is not college football."

www.espn.com

Every coach would prefer that. They want control

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Oh but this is interference in practically every state law. Most have restrictions on endorsements or contracts with gaming, alcohol, tobacco & cannabis. No interference in my proposal, just compliance that the income is legit & reported. IRS shouldn’t have any problem with that.

It's not the schools' place to regulate any contract between two third parties.

It's none of their business.

If something is against the law, that's up to law enforcement and the justice system.

If income taxes aren't paid, that's up to the IRS.

 

[BanditVol]

What is it about transferring that hurts someone's ability to get a degree?

Great question! I have a friend who took courses all through his military service. When he got back to Knoxville, they didn't allow hardly any of them as transfer credits.

The accepting school has to accept your credits from the previous institution and they are not very motivated to (why accept courses from another school when you can make the student pay for them all over again?)

 

[Snapper58]

Exactly. Transfers don't hamper getting a degree at all. Thousands of college students do it every year.

The NCAA president was quoted saying that athletes actually transfer less than the rest of the student body. I thought that was interesting.

 

[turbovol]

Unsurprisingly, once NIL was created, for legitimate reasons, it was corrupted by the schools and the collectives and now it's
just a massive mess, and the courts aren't helping. The original reason for NIL was of course legit. You have star players, and if a college or a private business wants to sell merch with their name, image, likeness, or engage them for promotional purposes, they deserve a cut of any money earned by the product/appearance.

But then it quickly morphed into offering deals to high-school prospects before they even got to college--all of them, apparently--and so instead of a after-the-fact benefit for a few established star players--like a Manning or a Wilson, guys who've BECOME stars in college, NIL was corrupted and suddenly schools were offering deals to everybody---and before they've become even established players, much less stars. And now you've got this crazy, crass, money-grubbing muddle, and now you've got all the high-school prospects expecting deals and money; you've got the collectives, and sorting all this out in a way retains the idea of players still being full-time students in college, not pros, is going to be very difficult.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The NCAA president was quoted saying that athletes actually transfer less than the rest of the student body. I thought that was interesting.

I also wonder what they're calling a transfer. Joe Milton graduated from MI and did his grad work at UT. That's not really a transfer, though the NCAA calls it a grad transfer.

Also, lots of students do "pre-XXX" at one school then transfer to UT-Memphis or another professional school.

For financial reasons or maturity reasons, some students spend a year or two at a nearby Community College, then transfer to a 4 year school to finish.

Trying to say transfers hurt someone's potential for getting a degree is really false flag tossed up by people trying to slow down free agency via the portal.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Unsurprisingly, once NIL was created, for legitimate reasons, it was corrupted by the schools and the collectives and now it's
just a massive mess, and the courts aren't helping. The original reason for NIL was of course legit. You have star players, and if a college or a private business wants to sell merch with their name, image, likeness, or engage them for promotional purposes, they deserve a cut of any money earned by the product/appearance.

But then it quickly morphed into offering deals to high-school prospects before they even got to college--all of them, apparently--and so instead of a after-the-fact benefit for a few established star players--like a Manning or a Wilson, guys who've BECOME stars in college, NIL was corrupted and suddenly schools were offering deals to everybody---and before they've become even established players, much less stars. And now you've got this crazy, crass, money-grubbing muddle, and now you've got all the high-school prospects expecting deals and money; you've got the collectives, and sorting all this out in a way retains the idea of players still being full-time students in college, not pros, is going to be very difficult.

The fact it developed shows the game isn't actually amateur. A paid market exists because the skills the players possess are valuable to the schools.

It's the very definition of why professional labor markets exist. The skills are there in the labor force and the teams are willing to bid for their services.

The NCAA can't insist the teams aren't professional athletes when it's obvious to everyone they are being paid NIL strictly because of their athletic skills.

Schools can't "uncreate" a market by insisting "we provide them with enough non-monetary compensation" while those same schools have consistently secretly, and now openly, provided money + non-monetary benefits to players for their skills for many, many decades.

That the NCAA and the schools didn't see this decades ago and prepare for it and develop some self-policing market limits (caps on the media deals, caps on the expenditures for facilities, etc) to keep the game smaller, more regional, and less lucrative.

Is that stifling to competition? Yes. College football was never intended to be a "live or die" competitive environment but an adjunct to an educational experience. The business overcame the educational aspect...... and here we are.

 

[Snapper58]

The fact it developed shows the game isn't actually amateur. A paid market exists because the skills the players possess are valuable to the schools.

It's the very definition of why professional labor markets exist. The skills are there in the labor force and the teams are willing to bid for their services.

The NCAA can't insist the teams aren't professional athletes when it's obvious to everyone they are being paid NIL strictly because of their athletic skills.

Schools can't "uncreate" a market by insisting "we provide them with enough non-monetary compensation" while those same schools have consistently secretly, and now openly, provided money + non-monetary benefits to players for their skills for many, many decades.

That the NCAA and the schools didn't see this decades ago and prepare for it and develop some self-policing market limits (caps on the media deals, caps on the expenditures for facilities, etc) to keep the game smaller, more regional, and less lucrative.

Is that stifling to competition? Yes. College football was never intended to be a "live or die" competitive environment but an adjunct to an educational experience. The business overcame the educational aspect...... and here we are.

Technically, they are not professionals in athletics. They are getting their money for NIL, not playing a sport. This is a grey area because their NIL value will increase the better the player they are, but they are not technically being paid to play.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Technically, they are not professionals in athletics. They are getting their money for NIL, not playing a sport. This is a grey area because their NIL value will increase the better the player they are, but they are not technically being paid to play.

It's obvious WHY they are getting NIL and why players have been paid under the table for decades. They're being compensated for their athletic skills.

Technically, yes..... OMG!!!! I can't believe you think they're being paid to play! Absolutely not!

If we're not going to live in the real world, yes..... they are amateurs and have never been paid for their athletic abilities.

"And I am Marie of Romania"

 

[Voltopia]

It's not the schools' place to regulate any contract between two third parties.

It's none of their business.

If something is against the law, that's up to law enforcement and the justice system.

If income taxes aren't paid, that's up to the IRS.

No, but it is the schools' business to determine who is eligible to compete.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

No, but it is the schools' business to determine who is eligible to compete.

That has nothing to do with NIL.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

No, but it is the schools' business to determine who is eligible to compete.

With your idea of revenue sharing then deducting tuition, board, cost of meals, etc, most schools are priced out of athletics.

Most schools don't generate revenue. If the revenue generating schools WOULD leave the NCAA and form a pro league (revenue share) that would solve some problems for most schools.

At a school like UT, however, what of the tennis team? I doubt they generate revenue and probably ride on the back of football revenue. Do they get a share? Do they sue if they don't? Does UT just drop all non-revenue sports?

Are we that "revenue centric" at the university that other sports are expendable because they don't generate money? Is that really what UT sports should be about?

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Unsurprisingly, once NIL was created, for legitimate reasons, it was corrupted by the schools and the collectives and now it's
just a massive mess, and the courts aren't helping. The original reason for NIL was of course legit. You have star players, and if a college or a private business wants to sell merch with their name, image, likeness, or engage them for promotional purposes, they deserve a cut of any money earned by the product/appearance.

But then it quickly morphed into offering deals to high-school prospects before they even got to college--all of them, apparently--and so instead of a after-the-fact benefit for a few established star players--like a Manning or a Wilson, guys who've BECOME stars in college, NIL was corrupted and suddenly schools were offering deals to everybody---and before they've become even established players, much less stars. And now you've got this crazy, crass, money-grubbing muddle, and now you've got all the high-school prospects expecting deals and money; you've got the collectives, and sorting all this out in a way retains the idea of players still being full-time students in college, not pros, is going to be very difficult.

NIL wasn't "created". It has existed as long as there have been endorsements. The reason that it now exists is that the schools and the NCAA were making millions of dollars of profit from the athletes' labor and talents while the athletes couldn't get a dime of it.

That was a violation of federal law. Stopping it simply have the athletes the legal ability to make money that was rightfully theirs all along. That created a new market, one over which the NCAA has no legal way to control.

The NCAA's entire sports model is illegal, according to Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh in his concurring opinion in NCAA vs Alston.

If it's crazy for people to want to profit from their labor and their NIL, then everyone that works a job or has any endorsement deals is crazy.

 

[Voltopia]

With your idea of revenue sharing then deducting tuition, board, cost of meals, etc, most schools are priced out of athletics.

Most schools don't generate revenue. If the revenue generating schools WOULD leave the NCAA and form a pro league (revenue share) that would solve some problems for most schools.

At a school like UT, however, what of the tennis team? I doubt they generate revenue and probably ride on the back of football revenue. Do they get a share? Do they sue if they don't? Does UT just drop all non-revenue sports?

Are we that "revenue centric" at the university that other sports are expendable because they don't generate money? Is that really what UT sports should be about?

Erm, I've never really argued about revenue sharing and deductions for expenses, as far as I know. Though I agree schools are about to be priced out of college athletics.

 

[BanditVol]

The problem in your argument is that the most recent "tightening" of restrictions on eligibility for 2nd transfers was caused by the NCAA wanting to lessen the use of the portal and they made ZERO claims about it being about education.

I think the original restrictions against letting 2nd transfer athletes be immediately eligible was claimed by the NCAA to help avoid schools tampering with players and enticing them to transfer.

Your argument might hold water if the NCAA had ever even TRIED to claim multiple transfer eligibility was linked to problems with students getting a degree....... but they haven't.

I never said the NCAA should do anything (I know you are coming into this late)

I was saying the SCHOOLS can do something.

And if they wanted to, the schools could force the NCAA to do something, since technically it answers to all the Presidents/Chancellors.

 

[BanditVol]

Why does NIL need to be regulated? If businesses/collectives want to pay these players then by law they have every right…

Every business in America is regulated and subject to law.

Otherwise when Home Depot, for instance, sells you a broke refrigerator you would have no right to return it.

So when you say they "have every righ..."....yes. Up to and as allowed by law and regulations.

 

[GoodTimeVol]

Every business in America is regulated and subject to law.

Otherwise when Home Depot, for instance, sells you a broke refrigerator you would have no right to return it.

So when you say they "have every righ..."....yes. Up to and as allowed by law and regulations.

There is difference between selling a product and the restrictions there by law and buying someone’s name, image and likeness, so that example doesn’t hold water here…