How to Regulate NIL

[Elhanan]

Why is there a need to limit earning potential of other citizens?

Shouldn’t these guys be able to get as much as possible while they are still physically able?

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Why is there a need to limit earning potential of other citizens?

Shouldn’t these guys be able to get as much as possible while they are still physically able?

This x 1,000

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Though I'm not very familiar, I think European Premier Futbol does something like that where teams can "bubble up" or "sink" in the tier system depending on their performance.

I can see this. The incentive to rise up is in the "cut" of each level. Better performance = more money.

The issue, of course, remains the "parity controls" or moving up becomes extremely difficult.

The English and other European soccer leagues generally relegate the bottom 3 teams to the next lower league at the end of each season. Except for the Premier League, the top 3 in each league move up a level for the next year.

That's not going to work in college football, because there's no unified national tiered system. The other complicating factors are that each football conference is independent, and that the English soccer leagues are all pros.

Soccer teams that get relegated often have to cut payroll. They can choose to trade some if their most expensive (i.e. "best") players, or loan them to a team in another country for a season or two to cut payroll. There's no way to make that work in our college football system.

 

[Devo182]

With all thats going on with the Lawsuit and the wild wild west of the NIL world. I would love to hear some of your takes on how to set rules and regulations on this matter. Here is my opinion, it may be a bad one so dont judge me to harshly.

1.) i think the collective needs to have a salary cap. I feel like doing this wouldnt limit a potential athlete on how much he can make and wouldnt violate the sherman act. You Limit on how much the collective can offer athletes over a given period.

2.) Something has to be done with the transfer portal. I feel like Tampering is out of control and if an athlete isnt getting what he wants he just ups and leaves. I think we go back to 2006 transfer rules. Either you have to have graduated or require a 1 time transfer waiver. By doing this, you also put another kink in the salary cap of the collective. Because now they would be stuck paying the player who doesnt produce.

3.) We should go back to 1 signing day. Not 2. You make it in December and have a very long recruiting dead period for the holidays. These coaches are not getting enough time with their players or their families as it is. Then you add the current state of NIL and Transfer portal and coaches are just jumping to the NFL at the first chance they get.

#1 - illegal

#2 - collectives can't make contracts based on playing at a school.

#3 - Don't care.



The answer:

Contracts with the schools and a CBA. It's the only answer, as every pro sport figured out decades ago.

It would help if the universities/ncaa effed off. They're going to do everything to keep their power and dear money.

 

[Devo182]

Why is there a need to limit earning potential of other citizens?

Shouldn’t these guys be able to get as much as possible while they are still physically able?

Apparently the "American Dream" right to earn your market value only applies to old, mostly white, coaches, but not when people start talking young college athletes, ...

Funny how nobody complained for decades and decades when coaches made millions...real sus.

 

[Devo182]

A new governing body is needed. The NCAA has run its course.

As long as the unis still are the enforcement body, same shiz...new name.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

#1 - illegal

#2 - collectives can't make contracts based on playing at a school.

#3 - Don't care.



The answer:

Contracts with the schools and a CBA. It's the only answer, as every pro sport figured out decades ago.

It would help if the universities/ncaa effed off. They're going to do everything to keep their power and dear money.

2. That rule will likely be thrown out by the courts. It's anti- competitive just like any attempt to regulate NIL is.

I can't wait to see how the judge in Greenville rules. It may be the death knell for the NCAA and their exploitation.

 

[BanditVol]

False Dilemma. Colleges and universities that have varsity sports programs are both academic institutions and minor league sports teams, especially football and basketball.

Um...what? You state that its a false dilemma, then state the "dilemma" as if it's true?

Regardless of your seeming issues with logic, I completely reject your premise. Academic institutions are first and foremost academic institutions and can do what they want academically. The NCAA has never regulated academics and has no charter to do so.

Whether Universities WILL put academics over money is very debatable as I indicate above. That they SHOULD is indisputable.

 

[BanditVol]

I appreciate the academic argument but are you going to stop ALL students from transferring multiple times too?

The schools are going to have to PROVE academic harm from multiple transfers, not just imply it could occur. You're talking about an individual's rights to control their education.

There are academic organizations which monitor transfer credits, major requirements, accreditation of schools, etc and that's understandable. I'm unsure the NCAA is the correct organization to attempt to wade into academics.

Their attempt to go after UNC for fake courses failed because they even said: "We don't have the authority to tell UNC what is a legitimate academic course. We're a sports organization." They merely reported UNC to the academic monitors and walked off.

I am not talking about stopping transfers...just putting back in some limits, such as they can't play for a year. They could still get paid during that year for NIL, but having to sit out a year would seem likely to slow down the transfer rate.

 

[BanditVol]

Non athlete students can transfer as many times as they wish. Why should the rules athletes be any different?

Because playing sports is a privilege and not a right. Or is the University forced to accept players they don't want?

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I am not talking about stopping transfers...just putting back in some limits, such as they can't play for a year. They could still get paid during that year for NIL, but having to sit out a year would seem likely to slow down the transfer rate.

The NCAA transfer rules have been suspended by a Federal Judge in the WV case as a violation of Antitrust.

The NCAA likely will lose that case and can't regulate transfers like that.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Because playing sports is a privilege and not a right. Or is the University forced to accept players they don't want?

Treating athletes as inde tired servants and not letting them earn their full market value while exploiting it is despicable.

Being exploited is certainly NOT a privilege.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Um...what? You state that its a false dilemma, then state the "dilemma" as if it's true?

Regardless of your seeming issues with logic, I completely reject your premise. Academic institutions are first and foremost academic institutions and can do what they want academically. The NCAA has never regulated academics and has no charter to do so.

Whether Universities WILL put academics over money is very debatable as I indicate above. That they SHOULD is indisputable.

You framed this as an either/or proposition.
That's a truly false dilemma. It's a logic fail.

College sports are both college teams and functionality are minor league sports teams, especially football.

Academics over money is ANOTHER false dilemma. To be a functional university, the schools have to be a out both. Try to run a university without money and see how fast the doors close.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Because playing sports is a privilege and not a right. Or is the University forced to accept players they don't want?

After a transfer, the other school doesn't HAVE to sign an athlete.

For instance, Harrison Bailey apparently transferred from UNLV, where I believe he had a scholarship, to walk on at Louisville. Edited for a "closer to home" example: Navy Shuler was on scholarship at App State, transferred to UT but as a preferred walk on, not on a scholarship. It's not guaranteed if you transfer, you will play or get a scholarship like you had.

Transferring and receiving a scholarship and/or making the team are not connected.

Granted, it is ridiculous to assume a 5* athlete from Ohio State like Quinn Ewers WOULDN'T make the team at Texas, but that's about his talent, not his right to a scholarship.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Not so. NO ONE or NO institution can set any limits or cap on NIL earnings. Your "data point" argument is meaningless, because NIL is a contract between the athletes and the NIL collectives. The schools nor the NCAA can regulate or cap a financial agreement between two other parties.

You can argue all you want but your argument isn't going anywhere because you're advocating an illegal restraint of trade. That violates the federal Sherman Antitrust Act.

Any player can get any amount of NIL MONEY and be eligible to play at any NCAA School that will accept the cap hit. Unlikely some team will not take a player worth that investment when the money does not come out of their pocket. Found money. Just like a kid can get a huge NIL deal and NOT get one of a teams 85 counters, or maybe PWO either. The schools are ACCEPTING the limitation just like counters and visits. They are free to do that.

End of story.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Any player can get any amount of NIL MONEY and be eligible to play at any NCAA School that will accept the cap hit. Unlikely some team will not take a player worth that investment when the money does not come out of their pocket. Found money. Just like a kid can get a huge NIL deal and NOT get one of a teams 85 counters, or maybe PWO either. The schools are ACCEPTING the limitation just like counters and visits. They are free to do that.

End of story.

Dude, stop it. There is NO cap on NIL. There can be no cap on NIL.

You are insisting on something that is a violation of federal antitrust law.

It's never going to happen.Youre just wasting bandwidth now. You have no credibility on this. That's the actual end of story.

 

[BanditVol]

Treating athletes as inde tired servants and not letting them earn their full market value while exploiting it is despicable.

Being exploited is certainly NOT a privilege.

LMAO!!

Dude, they don't HAVE to play. And no school HAS to have an athletic program.

When the law for instance, says having a driver's license is a privilege, same thing. Its not an inherent right granted by the Constitution, but an optional license regulated at the State level.

You are delusional bro.

 

[BanditVol]

After a transfer, the other school doesn't HAVE to sign an athlete.

For instance, Harrison Bailey apparently transferred from UNLV, where I believe he had a scholarship, to walk on at Louisville. Edited for a "closer to home" example: Navy Shuler was on scholarship at App State, transferred to UT but as a preferred walk on, not on a scholarship. It's not guaranteed if you transfer, you will play or get a scholarship like you had.

Transferring and receiving a scholarship and/or making the team are not connected.

Granted, it is ridiculous to assume a 5* athlete from Ohio State like Quinn Ewers WOULDN'T make the team at Texas, but that's about his talent, not his right to a scholarship.

Great points. But the schools can find a way to limit the number of transfers if they want. They still control their own athletic departments, or one would think so anyway.

 

[BanditVol]

You framed this as an either/or proposition.
That's a truly false dilemma. It's a logic fail.

College sports are both college teams and functionality are minor league sports teams, especially football.

Academics over money is ANOTHER false dilemma. To be a functional university, the schools have to be a out both. Try to run a university without money and see how fast the doors close.

First of all, either/or ...what? I absolutely did not frame this as "either/or" aside from whatever strawman false dilemma you are (very unsuccessfully) trying to create.

And I absolutely did not say this was "academics vs athletics". That would a false dilemma, because Universities are inherently academic. That is their purpose, period, dot. Athletics is a side show that happened to become profitable.

But back to the "false dilemma"...I am not pitting academics against athletics, what I am saying is that at the end of the day, the University has the sole discretion to decide whether a student is academically eligible or not, And if the University says "you haven't completed a semester in two years due to multiple transfers, you are not eligible", it's completely within their rights to do so.

Or are you saying a Federal court can order a University to admit a student academically against its own rules? That would only happen in a fantasy world of your making, but based on some of your other posts, you seem to live in one.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Any player can get any amount of NIL MONEY and be eligible to play at any NCAA School that will accept the cap hit. Unlikely some team will not take a player worth that investment when the money does not come out of their pocket. Found money. Just like a kid can get a huge NIL deal and NOT get one of a teams 85 counters, or maybe PWO either. The schools are ACCEPTING the limitation just like counters and visits. They are free to do that.

End of story.

You've still never answered my question and it completely breaks your system:

Game #3 and Hooker and Hyatt start REALLY getting it together. Companies start to notice and start wanting to give them NIL deals. You can't stop them from signing big NIL deals, so they do. Those deals put UT over the cap.

What happens?

To make this very realistic:

Every year, the team starts below the cap, then after game #1, suddenly players sign NIL deals which put UT over the cap, but those deals end before next season starts. Next year, after game #1, again UT was under the cap and the players suddenly sign deals which put them over the cap but end before next year starts.

Given the open transfers, it makes sense to have one year NIL, so you can't ding the school for that. Given that it's illegal to prevent the players from signing an NIL at any time, you can't ding that. Given that UT was under the cap after the first game, you can't ding that.

Your plan is BS. You can't enforce it.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

First of all, either/or ...what? I absolutely did not frame this as "either/or" aside from whatever strawman false dilemma you are (very unsuccessfully) trying to create.

And I absolutely did not say this was "academics vs athletics". That would a false dilemma, because Universities are inherently academic. That is their purpose, period, dot. Athletics is a side show that happened to become profitable.

But back to the "false dilemma"...I am not pitting academics against athletics, what I am saying is that at the end of the day, the University has the sole discretion to decide whether a student is academically eligible or not, And if the University says "you haven't completed a semester in two years due to multiple transfers, you are not eligible", it's completely within their rights to do so.

Or are you saying a Federal court can order a University to admit a student academically against its own rules? That would only happen in a fantasy world of your making, but based on some of your other posts, you seem to live in one.

Wrong. Universities are NOT inherently academic. That claim flies in the face of reality. They are inherently business institutions as well. They are inherently athletic programs as well. Apparently you missed the millions of dollars and hundreds of administrative staff members that universities have. Apparently you missed the 100K-plus fans that pack football stadiums every fall Saturday.

Your claim that universities are inherently academic is cherry picking at best. It's denial of reality at worst. Your claims are bogus. They don't reflect reality. The fantasy world here is yours.

Fortunately for the universities, their business, their funding, and their athletic teams, you are not the arbiter of what they are or how they operate.

And speaking of Strawman, that perfectly describes your last paragraph. I said no such thing and you know it. More fantasy.

 

[RAVOL]

I truly believe the money will slow down because even Rich people don't like losses in investment and for most programs it's a losing investment. Just like Vegas. In CHRIST Alone

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I truly believe the money will slow down because even Rich people don't like losses in investment and for most programs it's a losing investment. Just like Vegas. In CHRIST Alone

Players have been paid under the table for decades and decades.

It was primarily rich people footing the bill for some very mediocre football at even Bama and Ohio State during some stretches and it still continued.

 

[RAVOL]

Players have been paid under the table for decades and decades.

It was primarily rich people footing the bill for some very mediocre football at even Bama and Ohio State during some stretches and it still continued.

Money under the table was not even close to Money now.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

You've still never answered my question and it completely breaks your system:

Game #3 and Hooker and Hyatt start REALLY getting it together. Companies start to notice and start wanting to give them NIL deals. You can't stop them from signing big NIL deals, so they do. Those deals put UT over the cap.

What happens?

To make this very realistic:

Every year, the team starts below the cap, then after game #1, suddenly players sign NIL deals which put UT over the cap, but those deals end before next season starts. Next year, after game #1, again UT was under the cap and the players suddenly sign deals which put them over the cap but end before next year starts.

Given the open transfers, it makes sense to have one year NIL, so you can't ding the school for that. Given that it's illegal to prevent the players from signing an NIL at any time, you can't ding that. Given that UT was under the cap after the first game, you can't ding that.

Your plan is BS. You can't enforce it.

NIL interference by the NCAA is illegal , regardless if it's against an individual, a team, or a collective. It's a restraint of trade.