How to Regulate NIL

[woodpusher]

Now you're just throwing out Red Herring and Strawman logical fallacies.

Your ignorance of the rules of logic is as appalling as your ignorance if the rules of proof.

Ignorance in your part doesn't equal dishonesty in anyone else's part. Duh.

"I didn't do it."
"Nobody saw me do it."
"You can't prove anything" -- Bart Simpson

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Absolutely. I've no idea what I'm saying.

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You claimed that the coaches are in on it.
The Vol Club isn't the coaches, Skippy.

Your credibility meter is pegged on zero.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

"I didn't do it."
"Nobody saw me do it."
"You can't prove anything" -- Bart Simpson

Doesn't matter. When you make a public accusation, the onus of proof is on you.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

You claimed that the coaches are in on it.
The Vol Club isn't the coaches, Skippy.

Your credibility meter is pegged on zero.

Hehehehe. You miss the part where it specifically says "our Tennessee athletes." Hmmm. I wonder who selects the athletes at UT?

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Hehehehe. You miss the part where it specifically says "our Tennessee athletes." Hmmm. I wonder who selects the athletes at UT?

So now you're confusing athletes who are e rolled at Tennessee with coaches. Bwahahahaha. You can't keep your story straight for even two posts in a row.

Pathetic.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

So now you're confusing athletes who are e rolled at Tennessee with coaches. Bwahahahaha. You can't keep your story straight for even two posts in a row.

Pathetic.

The lawsuit TN is currently in is to allow TN to openly use Spyre, as they apparently did with Nico signing with Spyre BEFORE he was signed with TN.

That's exactly, as I believe Danny White or Donde said "what every similar school has been doing."

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

The lawsuit TN is currently in is to allow TN to openly use Spyre, as they apparently did with Nico signing with Spyre BEFORE he was signed with TN.

That's exactly, as I believe Danny White or Donde said "what every similar school has been doing."

Another change of story from you?
Bwahahahaha!

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Another change of story from you?
Bwahahahaha!

I hope you're enjoying yourself. Everyone knows Spyre is an arm of UT, unofficially yes, but offering players FOR UT.

That you won't acknowledge that speaks volumes about your honesty.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

The lawsuit TN is currently in is to allow TN to openly use Spyre, as they apparently did with Nico signing with Spyre BEFORE he was signed with TN.

That's exactly, as I believe Danny White or Donde said "what every similar school has been doing."

TN wasn't involved with Spyre signing Nico.
Everyone that has sent the contract says that there was no requirement for him to go to UT.
Again, you're making bogus allegations.
Here's your credibility meter again.

 

[turbovol]

Who regulates NIL? This opens the door for the NCAA to step in and maintain their status. The NCAA is a failed organization and has shown that they cannot govern the members of the NCAA in a manner that gets the right results in a timely manner. Plus they play favorites.

Let's be candid: You don't know anything--you're just blathering. You think it's easy to govern a sport that's been spinning out of control for many years, with a crazy programs driven by crazy fans?

The idea of a cap on NIL collectives is a good one--though there should be no NIL in recruiting, period. Even if legal, the schools should stop doing it. There's no advantage in it for anybody but the 18-year-olds who must laugh when rich-crazy-old-men funded collectively shower money on them, not even knowing if they can play college football or not.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

TN wasn't involved with Spyre signing Nico.
Everyone that has sent the contract says that there was no requirement for him to go to UT.
Again, you're making bogus allegations.
Here's your credibility meter again.

I'm fine. You're dishonest and blocked, immediately after you reply. Have a wonderful night.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

I hope you're enjoying yourself. Everyone knows Spyre is an arm of UT, unofficially yes, but offering players FOR UT.

That you won't acknowledge that speaks volumes about your honesty.

"Everyone knows"??? That's ANOTHER logical fallacy. You're confusing your False Generalizations with your Ad Populum fallacies.

"Everyone knows?? I really can't wait to see the mental gymnastics, equivocation, and illogic you'll post trying to prove that one.
I'll pop some popcorn and wait. LMAO.

 

[Sudden Impact]

Let's be candid: You don't know anything--you're just blathering. You think it's easy to govern a sport that's been spinning out of control for many years, with a crazy programs driven by crazy fans?

The idea of a cap on NIL collectives is a good one--though there should be no NIL in recruiting, period. Even if legal, the schools should stop doing it. There's no advantage in it for anybody but the 18-year-olds who must laugh when rich-crazy-old-men funded collectively shower money on them, not even knowing if they can play college football or not.

Let's be candid as I can as well. You are pretty much a joke on this board. I don't know much you are right but I know more than you do. Learn to read I never said anything about a cap. You must have me confused with someone else. Get a life. You are a whack job.

 

[OldVol]

With all thats going on with the Lawsuit and the wild wild west of the NIL world. I would love to hear some of your takes on how to set rules and regulations on this matter. Here is my opinion, it may be a bad one so dont judge me to harshly.

1.) i think the collective needs to have a salary cap. I feel like doing this wouldnt limit a potential athlete on how much he can make and wouldnt violate the sherman act. You Limit on how much the collective can offer athletes over a given period.

2.) Something has to be done with the transfer portal. I feel like Tampering is out of control and if an athlete isnt getting what he wants he just ups and leaves. I think we go back to 2006 transfer rules. Either you have to have graduated or require a 1 time transfer waiver. By doing this, you also put another kink in the salary cap of the collective. Because now they would be stuck paying the player who doesnt produce.

3.) We should go back to 1 signing day. Not 2. You make it in December and have a very long recruiting dead period for the holidays. These coaches are not getting enough time with their players or their families as it is. Then you add the current state of NIL and Transfer portal and coaches are just jumping to the NFL at the first chance they get.

I think the problem with your suggestion is there is no limit on how many collectives can represent a program. Not only that, but if collectives agree on their own to limit payouts, that is collusion. That violates the antitrust laws. Also, individual athletes can sue any entity that establishes rules that limit their ability to earn.

It’s a really hard mess. The guy who figures out a workable solution will become very popular.

 

[Delmar]

Well, you're either not bright about how Spyre works or dishonest.

Obviously, Spyre doesn't "willy nilly" make NIL offers but offers the people the coaches recruit, yet you deny they work at the behest of the coaches.

It's pathetic.

If people think all of these collectives aren’t taking at least some direction from their respective school’s coaching staff, I’ve got some swampland I’d like to talk to them about. Naïveté run amok.

It’s really a simple question. How do these collectives know who to offer if the coaches don’t at least give them a hint? And I suspect it’s deeper than just casual conversation.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

If people think all of these collectives aren’t taking at least some direction from their respective school’s coaching staff, I’ve got some swampland I’d like to talk to them about. Naïveté run amok.

It’s really a simple question. How do these collectives know who to offer if the coaches don’t at least give them a hint? And I suspect it’s deeper than just casual conversation.

The guy was just trying to wind me up, I suspect. No big deal.

 

[Delmar]

The guy was just trying to wind me up, I suspect. No big deal.

Oh I know. I just wish somebody would answer the question. How do the collectives know who to sign if the coaches aren’t directing them in some way? Can’t just go out and randomly offer prospects if a program isn’t interested. We’ll, I guess they could but it would be awfully dumb.

 

[Snapper58]

3. There has to be more than one signing day because it is for recruits and excludes portal players. There have to be at least two signing days for football to account for kids that graduate from high school in December and fir those that don't graduate until after their spring semester, and don't necessarily know where they're getting admitted to college in December.

There actually doen't have to be another signing day. Even before the December signing day, students could graduate early and enroll at an university, they can sign thier financial aid papers (esentually their scholarship paperwork) . They even do that now. Some students come to the college and start bowl practice before signing day in december, just sign thier financial aid paperwork.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Oh I know. I just wish somebody would answer the question. How do the collectives know who to sign if the coaches aren’t directing them in some way? Can’t just go out and randomly offer prospects if a program isn’t interested. We’ll, I guess they could but it would be awfully dumb.

It appears that's part of the NCAA/TN issue. Keeping "completely separate" when the recruits are interested in, among other things, the NIL available from your school is impossible. It's a part of recruiting now. Not being able to present your NIL is like not being able to mention or show facilities or meet the head coach, just ridiculous.

The NCAA would be crazy to expect the players to look up hundreds of collectives and try to figure out which one REALLY represents a school they're interested in and contact them blind.

Imagine being at a collective and fielding calls without being able to say you work with UT: "Yes, we're based in Knoxville. Yes, we like orange. Yes, we're called the Vol Club. No, according to the rules, we've no idea who the hell you are and why you contacted us. We can't talk to you until after you sign." Craziness.

 

[sjt18]

With all thats going on with the Lawsuit and the wild wild west of the NIL world. I would love to hear some of your takes on how to set rules and regulations on this matter. Here is my opinion, it may be a bad one so dont judge me to harshly.

1.) i think the collective needs to have a salary cap. I feel like doing this wouldnt limit a potential athlete on how much he can make and wouldnt violate the sherman act. You Limit on how much the collective can offer athletes over a given period.

Serious questions to test your rationale.

If that were applied to you in whatever field you are a professional in... how would you respond?

What you are effectively saying is that some governing body somewhere can arbitrarily decide what someone's NIL is worth in the marketplace while the collective and athlete are incapable of working that out on their own.

The better answer to what you are pointing at is to create a new CFB division made up of programs that can compete at the elite level. It would probably have to operate separate from the old conference structures. You'd be looking effectively at the Big 10 and SEC plus the remaining big programs in the other conferences like Clemson, FSU, Miami, Oklahoma State, Utah, et al.

Trying to cling to nostalgia just isn't practical any more.

2.) Something has to be done with the transfer portal. I feel like Tampering is out of control and if an athlete isnt getting what he wants he just ups and leaves. I think we go back to 2006 transfer rules. Either you have to have graduated or require a 1 time transfer waiver. By doing this, you also put another kink in the salary cap of the collective. Because now they would be stuck paying the player who doesnt produce.

It is connected but not really part of NIL. IMO, you control the portal by having smaller, more defined windows to declare, recruit/visit, and sign. Those windows should not be the current ones. At least not the one in December. Maybe open the window after the NC game and run it through NSD then have another window following spring semester?

I also think non-participation not related to an injury should restrict a player's ability to qualify for immediate eligibility at the next school. IOWs, if you pass on a few games or the bowl... then you might not be eligible at a new school the next fall.

3.) We should go back to 1 signing day. Not 2. You make it in December and have a very long recruiting dead period for the holidays. These coaches are not getting enough time with their players or their families as it is. Then you add the current state of NIL and Transfer portal and coaches are just jumping to the NFL at the first chance they get.

Disagree. The early signing period should allow HS players and programs to sign. Portal guys get to fill the open slots then everyone signs by NSD in February.

 

[Delmar]

It appears that's part of the NCAA/TN issue. Keeping "completely separate" when the recruits are interested in, among other things, the NIL available from your school is impossible. It's a part of recruiting now. Not being able to present your NIL is like not being able to mention or show facilities or meet the head coach, just ridiculous.

The NCAA would be crazy to expect the players to look up hundreds of collectives and try to figure out which one REALLY represents a school they're interested in and contact them blind.

Imagine being at a collective and fielding calls without being able to say you work with UT: "Yes, we're based in Knoxville. Yes, we like orange. Yes, we're called the Vol Club. No, according to the rules, we've no idea who the hell you are and why you contacted us. We can't talk to you until after you sign." Craziness.

Yep. It is completely unrealistic to think these collectives aren’t/won’t be communicating in some way with the schools that they are close to. If NIL is going to be allowed, it is going to be part of recruiting and I don’t see it being controlled or limited. It’s called a free market and athletes are free to make as much as the market will allow.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

Let's be candid: You don't know anything--you're just blathering. You think it's easy to govern a sport that's been spinning out of control for many years, with a crazy programs driven by crazy fans?

The idea of a cap on NIL collectives is a good one--though there should be no NIL in recruiting, period. Even if legal, the schools should stop doing it. There's no advantage in it for anybody but the 18-year-olds who must laugh when rich-crazy-old-men funded collectively shower money on them, not even knowing if they can play college football or not.

You cannot cap NIL money.

 

[Remy]

You cannot cap NIL money.

Correct. If you cannot cap a coach's pay rate making endorsements then you certainly cannot cap the players pay rate for making endorsements either. If Nike wants to pay Saban $5 million per year for his endorsement of their products, so be it. You likewise cannot arbitrarily decide athletes can get endorsements but something less than what Saban gets. The courts have decided the athletes get what the fair market value is, not some artificial limit.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Serious questions to test your rationale.

If that were applied to you in whatever field you are a professional in... how would you respond?

What you are effectively saying is that some governing body somewhere can arbitrarily decide what someone's NIL is worth in the marketplace while the collective and athlete are incapable of working that out on their own.

The better answer to what you are pointing at is to create a new CFB division made up of programs that can compete at the elite level. It would probably have to operate separate from the old conference structures. You'd be looking effectively at the Big 10 and SEC plus the remaining big programs in the other conferences like Clemson, FSU, Miami, Oklahoma State, Utah, et al.

Trying to cling to nostalgia just isn't practical any more.

It is connected but not really part of NIL. IMO, you control the portal by having smaller, more defined windows to declare, recruit/visit, and sign. Those windows should not be the current ones. At least not the one in December. Maybe open the window after the NC game and run it through NSD then have another window following spring semester?

I also think non-participation not related to an injury should restrict a player's ability to qualify for immediate eligibility at the next school. IOWs, if you pass on a few games or the bowl... then you might not be eligible at a new school the next fall.

Disagree. The early signing period should allow HS players and programs to sign. Portal guys get to fill the open slots then everyone signs by NSD in February.

I think dividing up the elite football programs is relatively easy but with basketball you have some small schools in relatively obscure conferences who field talented basketball teams. Creighton, Marquette, Gonzaga, etc.

The conference structure helps with football because the elites are concentrated in the SEC and B1G. There's a large difference between P4 teams and G5.

With basketball, which is also extremely lucrative, I'm unsure how you can group them without blowing up the conferences.

 

[sjt18]

I think dividing up the elite football programs is relatively easy but with basketball you have some small schools in relatively obscure conferences who field talented basketball teams. Creighton, Marquette, Gonzaga, etc.

The conference structure helps with football because the elites are concentrated in the SEC and B1G. There's a large difference between P4 teams and G5.

With basketball, which is also extremely lucrative, I'm unsure how you can group them without blowing up the conferences.

You don't give the NCAA an option. They don't have cards to play. They cannot make demands when the P 4/5 conferences are also by far the most lucrative in basketball too.

And there are ways to structure that leave the conferences in tact.

Missouri HS sports are weird. They have conferences and conference champions but they reclassify schools every year. The last few games of the football season are essentially play in games for a 4 round playoff. They have to be played against "district" teams that are defined by the annual reclass. Something similar might work for the "big" football schools. Let's say there's 40 of them. They would still play conference games to compete for the conference championship. But they would have 4 or 5 games against the "big 40" to play their way into an 8 game playoff following the conference championship games. Only those 4 or 5 games would count toward the play-in record even if you played more games against those big 40.

Ostensibly, Vandy could win the SEC but would not be part of the Big 40... and could not play for the top level NC.

The simplest way would be to scrap the traditional conferences for football. But there are other ways that it can be made to work.