I have a question for some of the Political forum regulars....

#203
#203
We should email this thread to Parker and Stone it would make great material for a South Park.

I think every religion simply evolves as nations/people evolve. For all of their enlightened contributions to education muslim nations are largely uneducated and impovrished. The Royal Families and other elements in the Islamic community have used education to halt the evolution. While they may have their sects (just as Christianity does now but it is much more comparable to earlier Christianity) the Imams continue to hold power by withholding education. That enables them to use Jews and "Western Oppression" as a way to stay in power indefinintely.

I'm hip with the OT talk. I understand that atrocities have been committed in the name of the Christian God since the beginning of that religion, but Christianity has evolved and Islam's evolution seems permanently stunted.
 
#204
#204
golfballs03 said:
What Christians damn non-believers to hell instead of trying to save them from hell?
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you are arguing semantics. if you didn't have them going into hell in the first place they wouldn't need to get saved from it. it's kind of like holding someone over a bridge and then bragging about how you saved their life because you didn't drop them.
 
#205
#205
droski said:
every religion picks and choses what to follow and what writings are more important than other writings. are you really telling me you follow ALL of jesus teachings?
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Come to my church and see if that's true. That's truly an uninformed statement right there. You can't pick and choose what's in the Bible, it doesn't work like that.
 
#206
#206
utvolpj said:
oh so it's ok to condemn someone to eternal fire as long as it's not on Earth? Gotcha
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I can only assume you're being sarcastic and just trying to prolong this discussion, 'cause you're to sharp an individual to really believe what you are posting. Christians do not "condemn anyone to hell". Christians share their beliefs. If you choose not to believe them then that is your choice... I fail to see what the Christian did that in any way was violent!
 
#207
#207
utvolpj said:
doesn't it also teach that you will be condemned to roast in hell for all eternity if you don't accept Jesus?
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droski said:
but that's with love. you just don't get it.
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I have a question about that. Would like to get your perspective, since it differs from mine.

If the "roasting in hell" theory is true. As PJ stated you have a choice.

From my perspective cruel would be not having the choice, and or not being aware that there is one.

This is assuming that God is who he says he is according to what I know or believe.
 
#208
#208
droski said:
mohammaded believed christians and jews to be people of hte book and to be respected. he did not damn them to hell like some christains do to non believers. radical islam clearly didn't take those words to heart. i've studied islam in detail. was david really that less violent than mohammed? why aren't the jews all killing people?

woudl you argue that the tenants of judiasm are violence?
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Uh...the Quran talks about 'hell' as a place of judgment for the wicked. Shall we go back and refer to the quotes as to what happens to the unbelievers?

Again, I'm waiting to see where Christ commanded anyone to kill. I keep asking but get no takers. Nothing to 'interpret' here. Just show me quotes - book, chapter, verse.

Did you not read my post above about Judaism?
 
#209
#209
Lexvol said:
We should email this thread to Parker and Stone it would make great material for a South Park.
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Science!

org_1032.jpg
 
#210
#210
Lexvol said:
I understand that atrocities have been committed in the name of the Christian God since the beginning of that religion, but Christianity has evolved and Islam's evolution seems permanently stunted.
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completely agree. and christianity didn't evolve for about a 1000 years. what changed? the age of enlightenment. islam will see a similar change when/if the middle east starts educating it's populace.
 
#211
#211
I've never heard a sermon in which the Pastor damned anybody. Oh, except Barack Obama's Pastor, Reverend Wright. "damn America! It's in the Bible!" But I think that qualifies as lunatic fringe and isn't representative of Christianity has a whole.
 
#212
#212
droski said:
every religion picks and choses what to follow and what writings are more important than other writings. are you really telling me you follow ALL of jesus teachings?
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Nope....have to admit that I miss on most of them.....that is what sets Christianity apart
 
#213
#213
BeecherVol said:
I have a question about that. Would like to get your perspective, since it differs from mine.

If the "roasting in hell" theory is true. As PJ stated you have a choice.

From my perspective cruel would be not having the choice, and or not being aware that there is one.

This is assuming that God is who he says he is according to what I know or believe.
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but according to everyone on here's interpretation of Islam they offer you a choice too. The only difference is it's condemned if it happens on Earth but perfectly ok if enacted in the afterlife.
 
#214
#214
droski said:
every religion picks and choses what to follow and what writings are more important than other writings. are you really telling me you follow ALL of jesus teachings?
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You really like to deflect don't you? Again, look at Muhammed's words and then look at his actions. Do the same with Christ. Compare and get back to me.
 
#215
#215
g8terh8ter_eric said:
Come to my church and see if that's true. That's truly an uninformed statement right there. You can't pick and choose what's in the Bible, it doesn't work like that.
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does your church encourage tithing? the old testament sure did. jesus was against it.
 
#216
#216
Lexvol said:
We should email this thread to Parker and Stone it would make great material for a South Park.

I think every religion simply evolves as nations/people evolve. For all of their enlightened contributions to education they are largely uneducated and impovrished. The Royal Families and other elements in the Islamic community have used education to halt the evolution. While they may have their sects (just as Christianity does now but it is much more comparable to earlier Christianity) the Imams continue to hold power by withholding education. That enables them to use Jews and "Western Oppression" as a way to stay in power indefinintely.

I'm hip with the OT talk. I understand that atrocities have been committed in the name of the Christian God since the beginning of that religion, but Christianity has evolved and Islam's evolution seems permanently stunted.
Click to expand...

Christianity only saw a 200 year time period, where anything like what Islam does can even be equated to it. If it wasn't for the Roman Catholic Church becoming involved in the situation, there is a strong possibility the fights would have been in mostly the main parts of Europe, and then the perception would have been MUCH different.
 
#218
#218
IBlvNTmWrk said:
I can only assume you're being sarcastic and just trying to prolong this discussion, 'cause you're to sharp an individual to really believe what you are posting. Christians do not "condemn anyone to hell". Christians share their beliefs. If you choose not to believe them then that is your choice... I fail to see what the Christian did that in any way was violent!
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once again semantics. just like man christians ridiculous argument that they don't hate gays they just disagree with their actions. it makes it easy for you to hate if you can blame it on the individual. either way you are telling me that if i don't believe i will go to hell. i don't believe a christian god would send someone to hell because they didn't believe he existed. to me that is 100% against jesus teachings.
 
#219
#219
droski said:
does your church encourage tithing? the old testament sure did. jesus was against it.
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Please don't make me show you actual verses that Jesus specifically says to give. Your really fighting a losing battle on that one. Just so you know, tithing is considered to be gifts from the heart, not something that is arbitrarily done in obedience. That's the definition of tithing.
 
#220
#220
droski said:
completely agree. and christianity didn't evolve for about a 1000 years. what changed? the age of enlightenment. islam will see a similar change when/if the middle east starts educating it's populace.
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Ah. Semantics here. Christianity did not evolve. If anything it returned to its roots. The violence in the name of really began around the time of Constantine. Kings and rulers began convenient conversions to win the populace. You can see how paganism was then incorporated in to "aid" conversions of entire tribes. If anything, politics began a perversion of the faith. This actually makes for good fodder in the debate on separation of church and state as well.
 
#221
#221
droski said:
you are arguing semantics. if you didn't have them going into hell in the first place they wouldn't need to get saved from it. it's kind of like holding someone over a bridge and then bragging about how you saved their life because you didn't drop them.
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No, the way I see it, and carrying on with your example, it's like being presented with two bridges over a raging river. one leads to the other side, and the other is impassible and if you try, you will fall into the river. The person has a choice of which bridge to take. You pray or encourage that person to make the right decision.
 
#222
#222
golfballs03 said:
I've never heard a sermon in which the Pastor damned anybody. Oh, except Barack Obama's Pastor, Reverend Wright. "damn America! It's in the Bible!" But I think that qualifies as lunatic fringe and isn't representative of Christianity has a whole.
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it's unbelievable to me that you can agree that christians have a lunatic fringe, yet for muslims this is a key part of their religion. if so why aren't all muslims terrorists?
 
#223
#223
g8terh8ter_eric said:
Christianity only saw a 200 year time period, where anything like what Islam does can even be equated to it. If it wasn't for the Roman Catholic Church becoming involved in the situation, there is a strong possibility the fights would have been in mostly the main parts of Europe, and then the perception would have been MUCH different.
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Millions have died outside of the 200 year period in the name of Christianity. Just ask the fine residents of Salem.

Christianity mainly seperates itself with Jesus' thoughts on government in general. Give Caesar what belongs to Caesar etc..and it is grounded in kingdom theology. He did not set forth to build and exclusive earthly kingdom or theocracy. Whereas with Islam (conservative and moderate alike) that is the ultimate goal/general theme.
 
#224
#224
droski said:
it's unbelievable to me that you can agree that christians have a lunatic fringe, yet for muslims this is a key part of their religion. if so why aren't all muslims terrorists?
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Because, they don't practice the violent parts of Islam, and the true Muslims would kill them just as quick as they would Christians, for not following the teaching of the Qur'an.
 
#225
#225
a muslim walks up to another individual and asks, "Do you believe in Muhammed and agree to follow his teachings?" The individual replies "No", so the man cuts his head off.

a Christian walks up to another individual and asks, "Do you believe Christ died for your sins and will you become a follower?" The individual replies "No", so the Christian says "Go to hell".

A couple of posters would have everyone believe that both of the above scenarios are equivalent as to their "acts of violence". Personally, I fail to see how these are in any way equal.
 
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