Iowa...

#326
#326
rmsmith said:
My views initially started young when I thought about how God really could manifest himself anytime he wanted if he wanted everyone to believe. Not rely on disciples to spread the word for him. Then i thought about how creation was explained and there is so much other proof that it didn't happen in 7 days. And why does the Bible leave out everything that happened before man came about? (Dinosaurs, Ice Age. etc.)
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The primary goal of the Bible is to tell of the death and resurrection of Jesus. That's the main reason it doesn't tell everything.

And if you do read the OT, God did manifest himself at Mt. Sinai, and the people still didn't turn whole-heartedly to him.
 
#328
#328
T-TownVol said:
were your questions answered about the Bible telling us not to cause others to sin?
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No, because I was fed some scat about the Bible entrusting believers to warn sinners. Fine and good, but when you go out and vote against a lifestyle that freaks you out, that's not warning... that's enforcing. You're doing God's job.
 
#329
#329
rmsmith said:
My main problem with the Bible is instructing people how to live their lives. If God wanted us to live a certain way he wouldn't have given us a brain.
Instructions on sexuality is secondary.
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That where we see it differently, it is our moral guide. I had a free will to accept or reject how to live my life with that same brain.

Basic
Instructions
Before
Leaving
Earth
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#330
#330
tigervol9802 said:
The primary goal of the Bible is to tell of the death and resurrection of Jesus. That's the main reason it doesn't tell everything.

And if you do read the OT, God did manifest himself at Mt. Sinai, and the people still didn't turn whole-heartedly to him.
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He has once, in the earths 4 billion year history?
 
#332
#332
I'm not running away, but I need to go eat dinner while i have a chance(at work). Be back in a few.
 
#333
#333
rmsmith said:
I'll admit, i haven't read all of it. But at least 80%

But if living like Christ is the goal then why enable us to think for ourselves?
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Good question.

Had a friend explain it to me this way, that I thought was interesting.

Would you rather your wife honestly love you on her own accord. Or love you because she has no other choice?
 
#334
#334
DinkinFlicka said:
T-town and Oldvol, you gotta understand. When a non-believer reads the Bible, he/she is just as capable of understanding it as ya'll are. The bible can be interpreted in many different ways, and just because our interpretations differ does NOT mean one party understands it less than the other. That's the sort of logic that paints an ugly color on the congregation.
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not according to the Bible's own words there DF
 
#335
#335
BigPapaVol said:
I'm not comparing. I'm saying one can vote an issue that doesn't impact him.

I don't care who it does or doesn't hurt and I'm personally all for gay marriage, but lack of hurt isn't any kind of criterion.
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How isn't it viable criterion? There isn't a LOGICAL reason why it shouldn't be legislated.

There are a million reasons to vote for/against healthcare reform. It does affect everyone. As I stated before, there are a slew of long term liabilities that come with the healthcare bill.

I think abortion would have been a better example to get your point across... I'm just not seeing why, of all things, you chose healthcare as an example. It's not a good argument.
 
#336
#336
rmsmith said:
He has once, in the earths 4 billion year history?
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Well, in the pre-fall, God walked daily on the earth with Adam and Eve.

If Jesus was indeed Immanuel, "God with us", then he also did it again for 33ish years and people still rejected him.
 
#337
#337
T-TownVol said:
not according to the Bible's own words there DF
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Oh crap, I have an acronym on VN now. Oh well :)

The bible's own words contradict the concept of reading comprehension there, cowboy. Fact is, it's a text with many analogies, metaphors, and stories. No one is really better at interpreting it than anyone else.
 
#339
#339
DinkinFlicka said:
T-town and Oldvol, you gotta understand. When a non-believer reads the Bible, he/she is just as capable of understanding it as ya'll are. The bible can be interpreted in many different ways, and just because our interpretations differ does NOT mean one party understands it less than the other. That's the sort of logic that paints an ugly color on the congregation.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry DK but you are only reading the words. You can understand it's basic teachings, it wouldn't be of value if you couldn't. What you don't understand is that the Bible itself tells us that there are deeper understandings (mysteries) with the help of the Holy Spirit. That's the part a non believer cannot understand. Because it challenges the natural man.
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#340
#340
Crap, guys. This was finally getting good, and it's time to pick up my old lady from work.

I will return within the hour.
 
#341
#341
DinkinFlicka said:
No, because I was fed some scat about the Bible entrusting believers to warn sinners. Fine and good, but when you go out and vote against a lifestyle that freaks you out, that's not warning... that's enforcing. You're doing God's job.
Click to expand...

So you can understand why believers warn non believers.

You see where we are coming from at least.
 
#342
#342
DinkinFlicka said:
Oh crap, I have an acronym on VN now. Oh well :)

The bible's own words contradict the concept of reading comprehension there, cowboy. Fact is, it's a text with many analogies, metaphors, and stories. No one is really better at interpreting it than anyone else.[/QUOTE]

wrong
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#343
#343
DinkinFlicka said:
How isn't it viable criterion? There isn't a LOGICAL reason why it shouldn't be legislated.

There are a million reasons to vote for/against healthcare reform. It does affect everyone. As I stated before, there are a slew of long term liabilities that come with the healthcare bill.

I think abortion would have been a better example to get your point across... I'm just not seeing why, of all things, you chose healthcare as an example. It's not a good argument.
Click to expand...

I don't need an argument. All I need is to show something with two sides that unaffected representatives vote for.

As to your logical comment, you don't get to be arbiter. People believe in the Bible and have a voice. You dont get to dismiss their vote because youdon't like it. I think they're lunatics, but they are a voting bloc and vote their morals, your logic notwithstanding.
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#344
#344
Oldvol75 said:
I'm sorry DK but you are only reading the words. You can understand it's basic teachings, it wouldn't be of value if you couldn't. What you don't understand is that the Bible itself tells us that there are deeper understandings (mysteries) with the help of the Holy Spirit. That's the part a non believer cannot understand. Because it challenges the natural man.
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Click to expand...

That's kind of elitist considering you're talking to a former believer who tried for years to "get it," but found too much logic in the other argument. Point is, there was a time when I gave it my all, but I kept drawing the same conclusions.
 
#345
#345
BigPapaVol said:
I don't need an argument. All I need is to show something with two sides that unaffected representatives vote for.

As to your logical comment, you don't get to be arbiter. People believe in the Bible and have a voice. You dont get to dismiss their vote because youdon't like it. I think they're lunatics, but they are a voting bloc and vote their morals, your logic notwithstanding.
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Click to expand...

I resemble that remark!
 
#346
#346
BeecherVol said:
So you can understand why believers warn non believers.

You see where we are coming from at least.
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I somewhat agree with DF here.

IMO, since the early 80s, too many Christians have become more concerned with impacting the laws of the land instead of simply preaching the Gospel. And I'm not buying the argument that impacting laws and preaching the Gospel are one in the same.
 
#347
#347
DinkinFlicka said:
That's kind of elitist considering you're talking to a former believer who tried for years to "get it," but found too much logic in the other argument. Point is, there was a time when I gave it my all, but I kept drawing the same conclusions.
Click to expand...

there are meds for that
 
#348
#348
DinkinFlicka said:
That's kind of elitist considering you're talking to a former believer who tried for years to "get it," but found too much logic in the other argument. Point is, there was a time when I gave it my all, but I kept drawing the same conclusions.
Click to expand...

You and I probably arent very far removed in viewpoint, I simply choose the side of a creator with a plan and a savior son for a few reasons. The bastardized version of religion today repulses me.
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#349
#349
DinkinFlicka said:
That's kind of elitist considering you're talking to a former believer who tried for years to "get it," but found too much logic in the other argument. Point is, there was a time when I gave it my all, but I kept drawing the same conclusions.
Click to expand...

There in is the problem, " you" tired to do it yourself.
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#350
#350
BigPapaVol said:
You and I probably arent very far removed in viewpoint, I simply choose the side of a creator with a plan and a savior son for a few reasons. The bastardized version of religion today repulses me.Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

Grew up in that type religion, want no part of it again.
People over think salvation to the point that it tears them apart and clouds the brain.
 
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