Is Barnes the best coach EVER at UT?

[Jravol78]

.
General Neyland and Ray Mears, I'm not sure how many people know/care about them or their accomplishments outside of UT

Warning- long post .If TLDR
Ray Mears is held in relatively high regard nationally by members of the media and other coaches who are old enough to have been involved in the sport at the time that he was coaching . I think the knowledgeable CBB observer would also consider him a good but not great coach . I would say the younger and or more casual CBB fan outside of the SEC has never heard of him . A search of several lists of
“All time best CBB coaches“ failed to chart CRM . I found one from a few years back when Barnes was still @ Texas that had him in the top 50 and Coach Don Devoe (a name I don’t believe I have even seen enter the conversation here ) listed in the top 100. Coach DeVoe is remembered by many around VN for his mediocrity but he also won an NIT @VA Tech In the early 70’s back when winning the NIT was still Considered a major accomplishment . The first half of his tenure here was highly successful with an SEC tourney title over UK .That season saw a 3 game sweep of UK. He also won the conference outright and made a Sweet 16 appearance . The advent of the shot clock seems to have had a detrimental effect on CDD’s success @ UT. He also had a decent run at Navy. In his career he won 3 CCOTY honors @ UT & 3@
Navy.

Coach Robert R Neyland is another story . May not be a household name to the casual CFB observer under the age of 30 but to anyone else I believe the name and accomplishments of Coach Neyland are well known . Bear Bryant said that Bob Neyland taught him everything that he knew about Defense . Sports illustrated named him DC on their all time great CFB dream team. Last year to commemorate 150 yrs of CFB ESPN compiled their top 150 all time best coaches and had Neyland listed @ #36. I believe if that list had been compiled 30 years ago that he would be in the top 20. Hell pretty much every team from Pop Warner to the NFL have adopted some form of his 7 maxims that they recite before their games .

I would still put him in the top 20 but perhaps I am a bit biased . As far as the OP I would put him at the top of the list of all time coaches of any sport @ UT. Pat Summit would closely follow but to me it’s Neyland at the top. Rick Barnes is already firmly placed in my top 4 but needs to make some deeper NCAAT runs.

 

[The Dog]

Warning- long post .If TLDR
Ray Mears is held in relatively high regard nationally by members of the media and other coaches who are old enough to have been involved in the sport at the time that he was coaching . I think the knowledgeable CBB observer would also consider him a good but not great coach . I would say the younger and or more casual CBB fan outside of the SEC has never heard of him . A search of several lists of
“All time best CBB coaches“ failed to chart CRM . I found one from a few years back when Barnes was still @ Texas that had him in the top 50 and Coach Don Devoe (a name I don’t believe I have even seen enter the conversation here ) listed in the top 100. Coach DeVoe is remembered by many around VN for his mediocrity but he also won an NIT @VA Tech In the early 70’s back when winning the NIT was still Considered a major accomplishment . The first half of his tenure here was highly successful with an SEC tourney title over UK 3 in which that season saw a 3 game sweep of UK. He also won the conference outright and made a Sweet 16 appearance . The advent of the shot clock seems to have had a detrimental effect on CDD’s success @ UT. He also had a decent run at Navy. In his career he won 3 COTY honors @ UT & @
Navy.

Coach Robert R Neyland is another story . May not be a household name to the casual CFB observer under the age of 30 but to anyone else I believe the name of accomplishments of Coach Neyland are well known . Bear Bryant said that Bob Neyland taught him everything that he knew about Defense . Sports illustrated named him DC on their all time great CFB dream team. Last year to commemorate 150 yrs of CFB ESPN compiled their top 150 all time best coaches and had Neyland listed @ #36. I believe if that list had been compiled 30 years ago that he would be in the top 20. Hell pretty much every team from Pop Warner to the NFL have adopted some form of his 7 maxims that they recite before their games .

I would still put him in the top 20 but perhaps I am a bit biased . As far as the OP I would put him at the top of the list of all time coaches of any sport @ UT. Pat Summit would closely follow but to me it’s Neyland at the top. Rick Barnes is already firmly placed in my top 4 but needs to make some deeper NCAAT runs.

Good post

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Barnes seems to have no problem interacting with Bobby Maze, one of Pearls former players. You know, the reason Springer and Keon are on the roster.

Is he a thug?

Why would you ask such a ridiculous question???? The answer is, "hell no!". Damn!

 

[volball57]

Warning- long post .If TLDR
Ray Mears is held in relatively high regard nationally by members of the media and other coaches who are old enough to have been involved in the sport at the time that he was coaching . I think the knowledgeable CBB observer would also consider him a good but not great coach . I would say the younger and or more casual CBB fan outside of the SEC has never heard of him . A search of several lists of
“All time best CBB coaches“ failed to chart CRM . I found one from a few years back when Barnes was still @ Texas that had him in the top 50 and Coach Don Devoe (a name I don’t believe I have even seen enter the conversation here ) listed in the top 100. Coach DeVoe is remembered by many around VN for his mediocrity but he also won an NIT @VA Tech In the early 70’s back when winning the NIT was still Considered a major accomplishment . The first half of his tenure here was highly successful with an SEC tourney title over UK 3 in which that season saw a 3 game sweep of UK. He also won the conference outright and made a Sweet 16 appearance . The advent of the shot clock seems to have had a detrimental effect on CDD’s success @ UT. He also had a decent run at Navy. In his career he won 3 COTY honors @ UT & @
Navy.

Coach Robert R Neyland is another story . May not be a household name to the casual CFB observer under the age of 30 but to anyone else I believe the name of accomplishments of Coach Neyland are well known . Bear Bryant said that Bob Neyland taught him everything that he knew about Defense . Sports illustrated named him DC on their all time great CFB dream team. Last year to commemorate 150 yrs of CFB ESPN compiled their top 150 all time best coaches and had Neyland listed @ #36. I believe if that list had been compiled 30 years ago that he would be in the top 20. Hell pretty much every team from Pop Warner to the NFL have adopted some form of his 7 maxims that they recite before their games .

I would still put him in the top 20 but perhaps I am a bit biased . As far as the OP I would put him at the top of the list of all time coaches of any sport @ UT. Pat Summit would closely follow but to me it’s Neyland at the top. Rick Barnes is already firmly placed in my top 4 but needs to make some deeper NCAAT runs.

I thought about Devoe too, but only for the fact that I thought he was on one of the NCAA nominating committees (or some committee). I figured he had to be either good, or well thought of. Like I said, I didn't start following UT until O'Neil's last season.
You could be right about Neyland. I'm just 37 and never played football. I only started following UT's Football team after becoming a UT Basketball fan.
Neyland had a stadium named after him and Summitt had the court named after her. The only reason I'd put her at the top is that she's credited with helping get the Women's game started. You couldn't go wrong with either one though.[/QUOTE]

 

[chuckiepoo]

I thought about Devoe too, but only for the fact that I thought he was on one of the NCAA nominating committees (or some committee). I figured he had to be either good, or well thought of. Like I said, I didn't start following UT until O'Neil's last season.
You could be right about Neyland. I'm just 37 and never played football. I only started following UT's Football team after becoming a UT Basketball fan.
Neyland had a stadium named after him and Summitt had the court named after her. The only reason I'd put her at the top is that she's credited with helping get the Women's game started. You couldn't go wrong with either one though.

...on behalf of @volball57
I thought about Devoe too, but only for the fact that I thought he was on one of the NCAA nominating committees (or some committee). I figured he had to be either good, or well thought of. Like I said, I didn't start following UT until O'Neil's last season.
You could be right about Neyland. I'm just 37 and never played football. I only started following UT's Football team after becoming a UT Basketball fan.
Neyland had a stadium named after him and Summitt had the court named after her. The only reason I'd put her at the top is that she's credited with helping get the Women's game started. You couldn't go wrong with either one though.

@volball57 careful with the formatting. Get all the way to the bottom before typing into a formatted reply.

 

[ColinS]

She built the program starting from a closet of an office in her early/mid 20s, washing uniforms herself, and driving players in a van to away games. She went a long way in creating her competition by advocating & putting the sport on the map. Any "decline" at the end of her career was likely due to preliminary stages of early-onset Alzheimer's. Such a loss for our University. Wish she was still with us, healthy, & maybe even AD. Doubt she'd put up with what's going on in a certain sector of UT Sports right now.

Oh, I agree she built the sport and built her on competition basicly. Just saying that the lack of competition inflated her numbers some. Just basic math. Five or so teams trying to win is a lot different landscape than 75 teams. Naturally, your just not gonna win as much.

 

[Jravol78]

I thought about Devoe too, but only for the fact that I thought he was on one of the NCAA nominating committees (or some committee). I figured he had to be either good, or well thought of. Like I said, I didn't start following UT until O'Neil's last season.
You could be right about Neyland. I'm just 37 and never played football. I only started following UT's Football team after becoming a UT Basketball fan.
Neyland had a stadium named after him and Summitt had the court named after her. The only reason I'd put her at the top is that she's credited with helping get the Women's game started. You couldn't go wrong with either one though.

[/QUOTE]You’re correct on “could not go wrong with either”. Neylands name has been diminished by the passage of time and the emergence of a lot of really good coaches in the last 40+ years but a quick glance of his accomplishments and his coaching tree confirm that he is still one of the greatest HC’s of all time . Just off the top of my head Bobby Dodd and Bowden Wyatt are both members of the CFB both as players and HC’s . There are only 4 men who have achieved this honor so 50% were Neyland protégés. Another coach closely associated with Neyland was Johnny Majors. Majors was recruited by Neyland but did not play for him. CBN retired at the end of ‘52 and Majors freshman year was ‘53. After retirement Neyland became AD and still attended practices so I’m sure Majors would have been influenced by Neyland. Majors is in the hall of fame as a player and has a strong case to hopefully be inducted as a coach as well some day.

For the record Bobby Dodd was 165-64-8 as a HC @ GT with 2 sec championships and a national championship in 1952 which was coincidentally the year after Neylands last NC @ UT.

Bowen Wyatt had a record of 99–56–5 with one SWC & one SEC conference championship .

Majors record not quite as strong because his last stint @ PITT was not successful but his final record was a respectable 185-137-10 with 3 SEC championships @ UT and a natty @ Pitt.

 

[jarnol32]

call me back when he has 1,098 wins, eight NCAA championships and 32 Southeastern Conference titles until then Pat is best. As a matter of fact she will still be the best even if Barnes were to make those accomplishments. Pat almost single handed built women's basketball at the collegiate level.

Call me back when the women’s basketball team actually turns a profit...

 

[chuckiepoo]

Call me back when the women’s basketball team actually turns a profit...

@Rickster Will you forgive me? We need the button...

 

[volball57]

...on behalf of @volball57
I thought about Devoe too, but only for the fact that I thought he was on one of the NCAA nominating committees (or some committee). I figured he had to be either good, or well thought of. Like I said, I didn't start following UT until O'Neil's last season.
You could be right about Neyland. I'm just 37 and never played football. I only started following UT's Football team after becoming a UT Basketball fan.
Neyland had a stadium named after him and Summitt had the court named after her. The only reason I'd put her at the top is that she's credited with helping get the Women's game started. You couldn't go wrong with either one though.

@volball57 careful with the formatting. Get all the way to the bottom before typing into a formatted reply.

Thanks, I accidentally deleted the last part of the quote "[QUOTE)]" when I put it back I forgot to add the "]". Should've previewed it.

 

[cobbwebb0710]

This thread is fixing to be swarmed with the Pearl lovers.

Just give it a little time. We’ll drop a game or two that we aren’t “supposed to” and Barnes will be back to being the old, washed up, cruising to retirement coach, we all know and love.
But as far as ranking, I’d go:
Pat as the obvious #1, with the General at #2, followed closely by Rick Barnes, Fulmer and the Weekly’s.
Pearl would be top 10.
GBO!!

 

[cobbwebb0710]

Barnes seems to have no problem interacting with Bobby Maze, one of Pearls former players. You know, the reason Springer and Keon are on the roster.

Is he a thug?

Barnes has “thug life” tatted across his belly, prolly.
GBO!!

 

[the_great_pumpkin]

Pearl dominates in the thug players department.

yeah and he serves a mean brisket as well !!!

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Summitt, Huntsman, Bussard, and Neyland in no particular order. A recent post noted that Summitt had inferior competition but the SEC was deep and strong long before she gathered most of her natties. Ole Miss, Georgia, and Auburn were especially strong in the 10 team SEC. Nationally Stanford, USCw, Texas, La Tech, UCLA, ODU, and Delta State were all powers.

I hated it when Texas stole Huntsman from UT. I’d also put Chuck Rohe in the mix. Huntsman wouldn’t have been nearly as successful had Rohe not put TN on the map.

Vol Track Coaching Legend Chuck Rohe Named to Florida Sports Hall of Fame - University of Tennessee Athletics

 

[vegasvolfan]

Any sport?

Look at how he has rebuilt men's basketball. Started by bringing in "diamond in the rough" 2 and 3 star players who were eager to learn and improve. He took some heat from the fan base his first 2 years. Some ignorantly saying he didn't care as much now and was coasting into retirement.

By 2019 that base of players had UT at no. 1 in the rankings for a period of time longer than anyone in recent seasons. Indicative of a head coach AND his staff having top shelf coaching and player development skills. Especially true of our team identity: DEFENSE

2021: those "diamond in the rough" types, unfortunately, only get mop-up time

This might be our most basketball skilled roster ever. Mid 70s rosters had those too. We have more now plus Barnes. I loved Mears. Great coach
Fun teams with a flair! Barnes is in another level of great.

Maybe Summitt. Maybe Broussard. Not Dickey, Majors or Fulmer

Not even close and he will never be close.

Pat Summit = 32 conference championships, 8 national titles in 42 years.

Rick Barnes = 4 conference championships, 0 national titles in 43 years

That said, I like having him. We are very lucky to have landed him. I hope he can get his first NC with us before he retires.

 

[Volinnooga]

Many of you are too young but Ray Meats made Tennessee competitive with Kentucky. He really raised the bar for Bog Orange basketball.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Many of you are too young but Ray Meats made Tennessee competitive with Kentucky. He really raised the bar for Bog Orange basketball.

He also coined the phrase "Big Orange Country".

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Not even close and he will never be close.

Pat Summit = 32 conference championships, 8 national titles in 42 years.

Rick Barnes = 4 conference championships, 0 national titles in 43 years

That said, I like having him. We are very lucky to have landed him. I hope he can get his first NC with us before he retires.

It wasn't "most accomplished" coach. It was "best". Lots of posters believe those terms are synonymous. They're not

 

[Roustabout]

yeah and he serves a mean brisket as well !!!

Nothing more thug than hosting a white kid at a bbq in Gettysvue!!

 

[beamerman]

I don't like women's BB, but Pat is the best coach if you are throwing them all together.

pat was great and I am not a women’s bb fan. However, the greatest bb coach at UT was Ray Mears. He built the program and showed bb could be king. In fact, in the 60’s bb was so much more popular than football that the AD, Woodruff, cut his budget to prevent even more disparity. Mears went over his head to the UT President to get his funding. This ultimately caused Mears being forced to retire, causing bb to slide and football to rise. If you look at UT BB and the former football coach as AD there is a pattern. Fulmer, Dickey, Woodruff, all football. Dave Hart got us Barnes, in fact, Dickey had a chance at Barnes before he went to Texas and Dickey refused to pursue. Football ADs have not been kind to UT bb.

 

[walkenvol]

pat was great and I am not a women’s bb fan. However, the greatest bb coach at UT was Ray Mears. He built the program and showed bb could be king. In fact, in the 60’s bb was so much more popular than football that the AD, Woodruff, cut his budget to prevent even more disparity. Mears went over his head to the UT President to get his funding. This ultimately caused Mears being forced to retire, causing bb to slide and football to rise. If you look at UT BB and the former football coach as AD there is a pattern. Fulmer, Dickey, Woodruff, all football. Dave Hart got us Barnes, in fact, Dickey had a chance at Barnes before he went to Texas and Dickey refused to pursue. Football ADs have not been kind to UT bb.

Fulmer has been supportive to bball and all the sports teams

 

[DULL_BOY]

Rick Barnes record as a HC:
707 wins 375 losses
NCAA Regional—Final Four (2003)
Big East Tournament (1994) Champions
3 Big 12 regular season (1999, 2006, 2008) Champions
SEC regular season (2018) Champions
Tournaments
24–24 (NCAA Division I)
5–4 (NIT)
0–1 (CBI)
6–4 (SEC)
When he was hired and the $#!T show he walked into here people said he was washed up...getting a retirement income...blah blah blah.
Basketball HC’s tend to coach well into their later years. A man of that caliber didn’t tally that record being lazy. He is by far the greatest Men’s Basketball HC Tennessee has ever had...it is not even close and he built it from hard work and pure coaching ability!
He didn’t inherit an already stellar program like Fulmer or Warlick.
In Tennessee History...as a HC:
1. Neyland
2. Summit
3. Fulmer
4. Barnes
I know Barnes doesn’t have National Championship on his resume...that is the only reason I give an edge to Fulmer....the only reason.
Fulmer is not half the HC Barnes is as a whole body of work without that NC ring.

 

[JohnWardForever]

Barnes is Great.. And Barnes does it Right; no baggage. So, gimme some Barnes for Men's BB, on par with Mears; so far. The General for all time greatest UT Coach ever.

 

[VolDaddy61]

This conversation begins and ends with Pat Summit. She's sits solidly on the Rushmore of Coaches.

 

[beamerman]

Rick Barnes record as a HC:
707 wins 375 losses
NCAA Regional—Final Four (2003)
Big East Tournament (1994) Champions
3 Big 12 regular season (1999, 2006, 2008) Champions
SEC regular season (2018) Champions
Tournaments
24–24 (NCAA Division I)
5–4 (NIT)
0–1 (CBI)
6–4 (SEC)
When he was hired and the $#!T show he walked into here people said he was washed up...getting a retirement income...blah blah blah.
Basketball HC’s tend to coach well into their later years. A man of that caliber didn’t tally that record being lazy. He is by far the greatest Men’s Basketball HC Tennessee has ever had...it is not even close and he built it from hard work and pure coaching ability!
He didn’t inherit an already stellar program like Fulmer or Warlick.
In Tennessee History...as a HC:
1. Neyland
2. Summit
3. Fulmer
4. Barnes
I know Barnes doesn’t have National Championship on his resume...that is the only reason I give an edge to Fulmer....the only reason.
Fulmer is not half the HC Barnes is as a whole body of work without that NC ring.

I would agree but add Fulmer is not a quarter of the coach that Barnes is. Makes me sad knowing we had a chance at him before Texas but AD went cheap.