Joe being Joe? China's One-child Policy okay

#26
#26
vols4sure said:
So you don't think he was in anyway condoning the Chinese policy. Other than the problem with not having enough young workers to pay for the retirements of others (i.e., a ponzi scheme), he "fully understands" the policy.
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In context, no, I don't think he hit the "like" button on China's facebook page.
 
#28
#28
lawgator1 said:
I'm sorry but I -unlike the OP and a lot of others itt - am principled and cannot get past the fact that he's absolutely right that we cannot second guess the Chinese government's decision on this.

TRUE limited government conservatives are COMPELLED to agree with him.

Only partisan hacks, masquerading as conservatives, think the vice president of the United States has ANY business commenting on Chinese social policy.

I can't believe we are even having this discussion.
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I asked the question above to a couple other posters, I will rephrase it for you.

Is Biden's stance strictly that, hey China if thats how you handle your population so be it. Who am I or the US to guess?

I gonna give you credit til you lose it, but I am gonna assume that if the US government decides that we that problem (which is hard to stomach considering our leaders) would you look to China as a model to address it, or seek advice?
 
#29
#29
Put it this way in terms of the last two posters:

I think that the notion that Biden was implying even the remotest support for government-mandated sterilization or abortion, in China or in the U.S., or anywahere, is just ridiculous.

He's recognizing their sovereign decision on the matter. Trying to convert that simple concept -- which I am pretty sure your current political platform demands of you -- into some sort of larger statement about abortion is realy, really, really, reaching.
 
#30
#30
lawgator1 said:
Put it this way in terms of the last two posters:

I think that the notion that Biden was implying even the remotest support for government-mandated sterilization or abortion, in China or in the U.S., or anywahere, is just ridiculous.

He's recognizing their sovereign decision on the matter. Trying to convert that simple concept -- which I am pretty sure your current political platform demands of you -- into some sort of larger statement about abortion is realy, really, really, reaching.
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So you think he misspoke and you are crediting him with a more politically correct statement than what he actually said. Has he even tried to clarify after the fact what he meant?
 
#31
#31
lawgator1 said:
Put it this way in terms of the last two posters:

I think that the notion that Biden was implying even the remotest support for government-mandated sterilization or abortion, in China or in the U.S., or anywahere, is just ridiculous.

He's recognizing their sovereign decision on the matter. Trying to convert that simple concept -- which I am pretty sure your current political platform demands of you -- into some sort of larger statement about abortion is realy, really, really, reaching.
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I'd pick my words a little more carefully considering China's strategy for the problem. If your recognizing their sovereignty on the matter (but secretly not agreeing with it) using "we can learn together" is what is ridiculous.

I will give Biden the benefit of the doubt on his comments, and lean more toward VNB's idea of ignorance and leave it at that.
 
#32
#32
lawgator1 said:
I believe that so-called limited government conservatives like yourself, who falsely proclaim that your criticisms are pure and not partisan-driven, show your true colors when you complain about the VP not being willing to jump on the way another country conducts its completely internal business.

Had it been a GOP vp, you'd have commended him for showing restraint in not getting involved in a matter we have no business being involved in.
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BS - I'd have still disagreed.

In this case I consider it a gaffe more than an endorsement. That's why I said Joe being Joe.
 
#34
#34
VOLatile said:
...

I'm with Weezy on this one.
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I assume you are pro-choice (maybe I'm wrong).

How do you on one hand say the government shouldn't tell a woman what to do with her body then say you understand why the Chinese tell their women what to do with their body?

What's the distinction?
 
#35
#35
volinbham said:
I assume you are pro-choice (maybe I'm wrong).

How do you on one hand say the government shouldn't tell a woman what to do with her body then say you understand why the Chinese tell their women what to do with their body?

What's the distinction?
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plus one
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#36
#36
lawgator1 said:
I'm sorry but I -unlike the OP and a lot of others itt - am principled and cannot get past the fact that he's absolutely right that we cannot second guess the Chinese government's decision on this.
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What can we second guess other governments on?

Why do we even make human rights statements about other countries? Are you against those as well? As I stated earlier, I believe US human rights position on this policy was against (I bet Joe didn't know).
 
#37
#37
volinbham said:
What can we second guess other governments on?

Why do we even make human rights statements about other countries? Are you against those as well? As I stated earlier, I believe US human rights position on this policy was against (I bet Joe didn't know).
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lol
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#38
#38
vols4sure said:
So you think he misspoke and you are crediting him with a more politically correct statement than what he actually said. Has he even tried to clarify after the fact what he meant?
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Your question assumes, incorrectly, that he said something he in fact did not say, but that you wish he did to satisfy your agenda.
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#39
#39
Then again I ask, what did he mean by "fully understanding" the policy?

"I fully understand your policy" does not equate to "I have no right to question your policy"
 
#40
#40
Weezy said:
IMO, you can take that statement in one direction or another based on your particular feelings to Joe Biden.

I understand why China would have a one-child per family policy. Do I agree with forced abortions or killings, no. But if they want to fine families with more than one child, fine. It's more a less a tax to influence certain practices.

I'm personally glad they are doing something about their population boom.
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Wow. Why is their population boom a problem for you? I can't say that I would like to live in a place so void of freedom they tell you how many kids you can have. There is no justification for that kind of a society.

With economic advancement, the opportunity cost of children increases and people have less children. If China wants to improve the economy and the population boom, while preserving freedom, they just need more laissez faire policy. All they are really interested in is control.
 
#42
#42
Turns out saying the policy is one "I fully understand and am not second guessing" is code for finding the policy "repugnant" and he was really arguing against it. Guess we need to learn Joe-ese.

Vice President Joe Biden backtracks after criticism of one-child policy comment in China

The White House issued a clarification late Tuesday, insisting Biden believes such practices are "repugnant."
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Biden spokeswoman Kendra Barkoff told AFP in a statement that, "The Obama administration strongly opposes all aspects of China's coercive birth-limitation policies, including forced abortion and sterilization," adding Biden "pointed out, in China, that the policy is, as a practical matter, unsustainable. He was arguing against the one-child policy to a Chinese audience."
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What a moron this guy is.
 
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#43
#43
China's policy is also coming back to haunt them. Not only is the one-child policy repugnant, but the policy also heavily favors male children.

China Running Out Of Women - CBS News

(AP) China will have 30 million more men of marriageable age than women in less than 15 years as a gender imbalance resulting from the country's tough one-child policy becomes more pronounced, state media reported Friday.

The tens of millions of men who will not be able to find a wife could also lead to social instability problems, the China Daily said in a front-page report.
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#44
#44
lawgator1 said:
I'm sorry but I -unlike the OP and a lot of others itt - am principled and cannot get past the fact that he's absolutely right that we cannot second guess the Chinese government's decision on this.

TRUE limited government conservatives are COMPELLED to agree with him.

Only partisan hacks, masquerading as conservatives, think the vice president of the United States has ANY business commenting on Chinese social policy.

I can't believe we are even having this discussion.
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Why can one not think we have no right to force our opinions on China, but still have the right to have and express an opinion? How are the two related? Any american has the right to comment about anything and, I think, a moral obligation to comment about wrong things. Being Veep doesn't change that. What we don't have any business doing is trying to force China to act in accordance with our opinions.
 
#45
#45
bidenchinatrip.jpg


guanoj.jpg
 
#46
#46
BeecherVol said:
Is this a China thing so it doesn't affect us much and its easier to hold the view?, or I'd be cool with the US enforcing something similar?
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The US is a population of about 300 million, not billion. So, it's not a worry here, yet. But, if it were the case, I would support limiting family size but absolutely would oppose any sort of forced abortion or adoption. I support a woman's right to choose, and if the government decides to force an abortion, then her choice just flew out the window.
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#47
#47
VOLatile said:
The US is a population of about 300 million, not billion. So, it's not a worry here, yet. But, if it were the case, I would support limiting family size but absolutely would oppose any sort of forced abortion or adoption. I support a woman's right to choose, and if the government decides to force an abortion, then her choice just flew out the window.
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I agree the US doesn't currently have this problem.

How would you enforce limiting family size?
 
#48
#48
VOLatile said:
The US is a population of about 300 million, not billion. So, it's not a worry here, yet. But, if it were the case, I would support limiting family size but absolutely would oppose any sort of forced abortion or adoption. I support a woman's right to choose, and if the government decides to force an abortion, then her choice just flew out the window.
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So how would propose limiting the family size? Fines? What about low income people who can't afford the fine or supporting the child. Do they still receive welfare even though they violated the law by having a child?

Or would you support sterilizing women?
 
#49
#49
It's important to remember that the economic limitations facing China are different than those facing the US. The policy was implemented more as practical matter of not being able to feed all of those mouths. If the US only produced enough food to feed 100 million people a year, would this kind of policy be more or less acceptable here?

And, of course, there's the flipside issue of China's treatment of its prison inmates. Should they be allowed to force the sale of the organ's of their prisoners? I would guess many conservatives would be somewhat okay with that?
 
#50
#50
jvol1 said:
It's important to remember that the economic limitations facing China are different than those facing the US. The policy was implemented more as practical matter of not being able to feed all of those mouths. If the US only produced enough food to feed 100 million people a year, would this kind of policy be more or less acceptable here?

And, of course, there's the flipside issue of China's treatment of its prison inmates. Should they be allowed to force the sale of the organ's of their prisoners? I would guess many conservatives would be somewhat okay with that?
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Not unless they were convicted of a capital crime.
 
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