LSU, Oregon, and Oregon State require vaccine or negative test to attend football games [merged]

[99gator]

No, you’re not being selfish, if you wear a mask and reduce contact with others (maintain distance, etc.) But those who insist on their own perceived rights to do whatever they want and ignore how these rights interfere with the rights of others are selfish. Me me me me, over everyone else.

— and that whole “stay home if you’re scared” (as you wrote but not quoted) is very much a me me me thing. It’s saying that you’ll do whatever you like and to hell with others. It’s just as offensive as those saying that if you’re not vaccinated, stay home.

There needs to be a place where those who choose not to be vaccinated can meet those who do, with precautions (masking + social distancing for the unvaccinated) and COMMON COURTESY (whatever happened to that??) by both groups shown to those who choose a different path.

It would start with providing proof that whatever measures used actually work.

Because we've been doing this for a year and a half now and I know more people who have gotten COVID and suffered significant effects in 2021 than in 2020. In my orbit, the last 2 months have made the previous 16 months look like a paper cut in comparison. And yes, these people have been vaccinated. They've masked up, they've vaccinated, they've scrubbed surfaces, and done everything they've been told to do. I know people who died and I know people still in the hospital. And these aren't people who were in a nursing home or in hospice when they got COVID and then have it ruled a COVID death. These were people who were doing just fine until getting COVID.

So, from what I have personally experienced, the government can put out whatever numbers they want to and that's great. But, it doesn't match what I'm seeing and never has.

 

[OrangeEtBlanc]

No, you’re not being selfish, if you wear a mask and reduce contact with others (maintain distance, etc.) But those who insist on their own perceived rights to do whatever they want and ignore how these rights interfere with the rights of others are selfish. Me me me me, over everyone else.

— and that whole “stay home if you’re scared” (as you wrote but not quoted) is very much a me me me thing. It’s saying that you’ll do whatever you like and to hell with others. It’s just as offensive as those saying that if you’re not vaccinated, stay home.

There needs to be a place where those who choose not to be vaccinated can meet those who do, with precautions (masking + social distancing for the unvaccinated) and COMMON COURTESY (whatever happened to that??) by both groups shown to those who choose a different path.

At some point we have to return to normal life.

When COVID first broke-out, I was VERY pro-mask, pro-lockdowns, and pro-vaccines. But, those things were then used as a bludgeon and proved ineffective in stopping the spread. I still remember “14 days to flatten the curve,” where we shut down businesses with the exception of large stores, which caused people to congregate in fewer places in greater concentration, likely increasing the spread.

I’m not arguing that someone shouldn’t be allowed to attend a game and live their normal life. If you are vaccinated and want to go, good; if unvaccinated, then also go, but remember the risks.

No one can live their life risk-free.

It is rank futility to coerce others to conform to actions that are also ineffective in preventing the spread. In fact, someone who is vaccinated may be more likely to infect others if they unknowingly contracted COVID, as the reduced symptoms could go unnoticed, or dismissed as another illness.

I would rather no one attend than to segregate fans in such a way.

Again, if they’re going to mandate something, mandate the negative test and not the vaccine.

 

[VolNExile]

It would start with providing proof that whatever measures used actually work.

Because we've been doing this for a year and a half now and I know more people who have gotten COVID and suffered significant effects in 2021 than in 2020. In my orbit, the last 2 months have made the previous 16 months look like a paper cut in comparison. And yes, these people have been vaccinated. They've masked up, they've vaccinated, they've scrubbed surfaces, and done everything they've been told to do. I know people who died and I know people still in the hospital. And these aren't people who were in a nursing home or in hospice when they got COVID and then have it ruled a COVID death. These were people who were doing just fine until getting COVID.

So, from what I have personally experienced, the government can put out whatever numbers they want to and that's great. But, it doesn't match what I'm seeing and never has.

Right, because the virus in 2020 is different from the virus (Delta variant) in 2021.

 

[WilliamDuVOL]

The fact that anyone still blindly trusts corporations or government blows my mind. The US government has a track record of blatant disregard for human life. Pfizer, Moderna, JNJ, all have settled multi-billion dollar lawsuits over FDA APPROVED PRODUCTS that, as it turns out, kill people or cause cancer. But this time is totally different because Facebook and Twitter told me so, right?

 

[VolNExile]

At some point we have to return to normal life.

When COVID first broke-out, I was VERY pro-mask, pro-lockdowns, and pro-vaccines. But, those things were then used as a bludgeon and proved ineffective in stopping the spread. I still remember “14 days to flatten the curve,” where we shut down businesses with the exception of large stores, which caused people to congregate in fewer places in greater concentration, likely increasing the spread.

I’m not arguing that someone shouldn’t be allowed to attend a game and live their normal life. If you are vaccinated and want to go, good; if unvaccinated, then also go, but remember the risks.

No one can live their life risk-free.

It is rank futility to coerce others to conform to actions that are also ineffective in preventing the spread. In fact, someone who is vaccinated may be more likely to infect others if they unknowingly contracted COVID, as the reduced symptoms could go unnoticed, or dismissed as another illness.

I would rather no one attend than to segregate fans in such a way.

Again, if they’re going to mandate something, mandate the negative test and not the vaccine.

That’s a reasonable take. Not mine, but reasonable.

(Re: lockdowns: “where we shut down businesses with the exception of large stores, which caused people to congregate in fewer places in greater concentration, likely increasing the spread” - yeah, that wasn’t a lockdown. You identified the problem. I’m not advocating lockdowns now, but if you do, go big or go home.

 

[OrangeEtBlanc]

That’s a reasonable take. Not mine, but reasonable.

(Re: lockdowns: “where we shut down businesses with the exception of large stores, which caused people to congregate in fewer places in greater concentration, likely increasing the spread” - yeah, that wasn’t a lockdown. You identified the problem. I’m not advocating lockdowns now, but if you do, go big or go home.

Yeah, when the “lock-downs” were initially announced, I thought they didn’t go far enough. In my opinion, they should have allowed everyone 5-7 days to get supplied and shut EVERYTHING down, even grocery stores, for the 14 days (with the exception of emergency services). Gov’t stimulus funds could have then went to everyone to supplement the loss of two weeks work instead of months of increased & extended unemployment benefits (which only hurt employers).

Instead, by only limiting the places the populace could go, people concentrated in fewer locations. A highly-contagious virus with increased potential host density was bad news. The half-hearted “lockdown” only made the situation worse, in my opinion.

 

[wmcovol]

This is gonna get interesting

 

[golfballs]

This is gonna get interesting

It’s gonna get stupid

 

[99gator]

The fact that anyone still blindly trusts corporations or government blows my mind. The US government has a track record of blatant disregard for human life. Pfizer, Moderna, JNJ, all have settled multi-billion dollar lawsuits over FDA APPROVED PRODUCTS that, as it turns out, kill people or cause cancer. But this time is totally different because Facebook and Twitter told me so, right?

For sake of argument, it may be different. But, we don't know. We can't know.

What we do know is......

they told us to flatten the curve.....didn't matter.
they told us to scrub surfaces......but, that didn't matter. Still Disinfecting Surfaces? It Might Not Be Worth It
they shut down businesses all across the country.....that didn't do a damn thing.
they told us masks don't help......then, wear a mask.....then, wear two masks....meanwhile no one knows how to put on a mask.
they told us to social distance, but good ventilation is far more important.....Masks, good ventilation are more important than social distancing for reducing COVID spread
they told us to use plastic in schools and stores......Those Anti-Covid Plastic Barriers Probably Don’t Help and May Make Things Worse
they told us to get the vaccine....people are getting COVID who have gotten the vaccine.

So, what we do know is that given a certain amount of time, what we've been told turns out to be incorrect.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

For sake of argument, it may be different. But, we don't know. We can't know.

What we do know is......

they told us to flatten the curve.....didn't matter.
they told us to scrub surfaces......but, that didn't matter. Still Disinfecting Surfaces? It Might Not Be Worth It
they shut down businesses all across the country.....that didn't do a damn thing.
they told us masks don't help......then, wear a mask.....then, wear two masks....meanwhile no one knows how to put on a mask.
they told us to social distance, but good ventilation is far more important.....Masks, good ventilation are more important than social distancing for reducing COVID spread
they told us to use plastic in schools and stores......Those Anti-Covid Plastic Barriers Probably Don’t Help and May Make Things Worse
they told us to get the vaccine....people are getting COVID who have gotten the vaccine.

So, what we do know is that given a certain amount of time, what we've been told turns out to be incorrect.

George Washington was given "state of the art" medical treatment...... he was bled with leeches.

My very, very wealthy aunt had ovarian cancer and received crude surgery and massive, skin burning radiation in the mid 60's which was the "state of the art" in the mid-60s.

Science changes, yet you blame it for changing.

Like rank and file doctors and nurses WANT to make the wrong decisions just to screw you?

A new virus means treatments, protocols, data will change...... but you blame science for studying results and changing treatments.

"They got it wrong......" Yes. And they changed. And they'll keep changing because unlike most of you guys, they aren't out to prove a political point or score debate points on VN....... they're working to end this crap.

As they say about people who criticize soldiers, kindly take a watch or STFU.

 

[Mightyvol]

This entire nightmare would be over if everyone got a simple vaccination. I hope all sports, concerts, travel etc.. make vaccination an absolute requirement

Vaccines won’t solve Covid or the multitude of variations forth coming, anymore than the flu vaccine solves the flu. Covid-19 or SARS-2 is a Corona virus and past attempts to use vaccines for Corona viruses have failed.

 

[99gator]

George Washington was given "state of the art" medical treatment...... he was bled with leeches.

My very, very wealthy aunt had ovarian cancer and received crude surgery and massive, skin burning radiation in the mid 60's which was the "state of the art" in the mid-60s.

Science changes, yet you blame it for changing.

Like rank and file doctors and nurses WANT to make the wrong decisions just to screw you?

A new virus means treatments, protocols, data will change...... but you blame science for studying results and changing treatments.

"They got it wrong......" Yes. And they changed. And they'll keep changing because unlike most of you guys, they aren't out to prove a political point or score debate points on VN....... they're working to end this crap.

As they say about people who criticize soldiers, kindly take a watch or STFU.

Seems to me you are proving my point.

First of all, some of those rank and file doctors and nurses aren’t taking the vaccine either. I saw this article the other day. The most vaccine-hesitant group of all? PhDs - The Post

To use your example, If they had said to George, we don’t know what we’re doing but we’re going to give this a try because it’s the best we can come up with at this point in time, that would be one thing.

However, if they said, George do this and you’ll be cured and back roaming around on the grounds of Mount Vernon in no time, that would have been a line of bull.

You already have people in power (Fauci for one) who have knowingly lied and even admitted doing so. That’s not doing the best they can and learning from mistakes. That’s purposeful deception.

They are doing something, presenting it with absolute certainty, without acknowledging any possibility that they’re wrong or aren’t 100% sure.

Same as declaring that the virus could not have come from the Wuhan lab when you don’t know where it came from. If you don’t know where it came from, how can you possibly rule out the lab?

It’s almost religious. If you admit parts of the Bible aren’t true, than how can anyone believe the rest of the Bible.

These guys never admit or put out the possibility that they are wrong, because if they’re wrong some of the time, how can you be sure when they are right and when they are wrong.

So if the “science” in this is guessing, screwing up, learning, and then getting it right….I don’t want to go through the guessing, screwing up and learning part. I’ll wait until they get it right.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Seems to me you are proving my point.

First of all, some of those rank and file doctors and nurses aren’t taking the vaccine either. I saw this article the other day. The most vaccine-hesitant group of all? PhDs - The Post

To use your example, If they had said to George, we don’t know what we’re doing but we’re going to give this a try because it’s the best we can come up with at this point in time, that would be one thing.

However, if they said, George do this and you’ll be cured and back roaming around on the grounds of Mount Vernon in no time, that would have been a line of bull.

You already have people in power (Fauci for one) who have knowingly lied and even admitted doing so. That’s not doing the best they can and learning from mistakes. That’s purposeful deception.

They are doing something, presenting it with absolute certainty, without acknowledging any possibility that they’re wrong or aren’t 100% sure.

Same as declaring that the virus could not have come from the Wuhan lab when you don’t know where it came from. If you don’t know where it came from, how can you possibly rule out the lab?

It’s almost religious. If you admit parts of the Bible aren’t true, than how can anyone believe the rest of the Bible.

These guys never admit or put out the possibility that they are wrong, because if they’re wrong some of the time, how can you be sure when they are right and when they are wrong.

So if the “science” in this is guessing, screwing up, learning, and then getting it right….I don’t want to go through the guessing, screwing up and learning part. I’ll wait until they get it right.

Science ALWAYS GUESSES. I'm going to go out on a limb and say you don't do research in ANY field.

And when you're struggling for breath, God Forbid it happens to you, you'll HOPE they give it their best guess.

As I said, stand a watch or STFU. When it's you in ICU, you'll welcome whatever is the best protocol at that time. Admit it.

 

[99gator]

Science ALWAYS GUESSES. I'm going to go out on a limb and say you don't do research in ANY field.

And when you're struggling for breath, God Forbid it happens to you, you'll HOPE they give it their best guess.

As I said, stand a watch or STFU. When it's you in ICU, you'll welcome whatever is the best protocol at that time. Admit it.

You’re missing the point.

It’s not that they aren’t doing the best they can.

It’s that they don’t know and they’re selling it as if they do.

The phrase even exists “medical opinion”. Two doctors can see the same patient and make a different diagnosis or recommend a different treatment, but neither of them are quacks.

There is NO differing opinion. There is NO scientific debate (or at least not allowed). We know there are medical professionals who disagree. Are their voices heard? Are the points of view considered?

The public is fed one piece of information without decent and all other scientific exploration is quashed.

But, again, I will also say that I choose not to act like science is not above lying for money or political reasons….they even lied about the food pyramid for crying out loud.

At some point, you have to trust something. I get that. You can’t go through life without believing in something and not putting faith or trust in anything.

But, to question things….to have doubt….when those doubts get confirmed time and time again. That seems reasonable to me.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

You’re missing the point.

It’s not that they aren’t doing the best they can.

It’s that they don’t know and they’re selling it as if they do.

The phrase even exists “medical opinion”. Two doctors can see the same patient and make a different diagnosis or recommend a different treatment, but neither of them are quacks.

There is NO differing opinion. There is NO scientific debate (or at least not allowed). We know there are medical professionals who disagree. Are their voices heard? Are the points of view considered?

The public is fed one piece of information without decent and all other scientific exploration is quashed.

But, again, I will also say that I choose not to act like science is not above lying for money or political reasons….they even lied about the food pyramid for crying out loud.

At some point, you have to trust something. I get that. You can’t go through life without believing in something and not putting faith or trust in anything.

But, to question things….to have doubt….when those doubts get confirmed time and time again. That seems reasonable to me.

You just hate the science. Of course ANYONE, the greenest intern at the least respected research facility in the country, who comes up with a testable, reliable, plausible (that means your dreaded "trial and error" scenario BECAUSE THAT'S HOW SCIENCE WORKS, ALWAYS!) treatment becomes a worldwide hero.

You act as if there's a conspiracy to kill people, destroy the worldwide economy, shut down people's lives...... and there's not. There's ZERO MONEY in that. There's a ton of money, prestige, etc in solving this, not perpetuating it.

Your idea that some forces WANT death, WANT a global economic collapse, WANT people to be quarantined, etc....... is crazy. It's costing Australia a butt load of money to shut down their economy. Why? Why do this?

It cost America a ton of jobs, created huge debt, and freaking has killed nearly 3/4 million Americans.

Where's the upside? Why do you think there's a "conspiracy" to continue this?

 

[lukeneyland]

The fact that anyone still blindly trusts corporations or government blows my mind. The US government has a track record of blatant disregard for human life. Pfizer, Moderna, JNJ, all have settled multi-billion dollar lawsuits over FDA APPROVED PRODUCTS that, as it turns out, kill people or cause cancer. But this time is totally different because Facebook and Twitter told me so, right?

If an older person wants to take the vaccine because many of them are at risk then it makes sense to me. The risk reward ratio seems correct. But this blanket prescription of it to the countries young people is chilling. I hope I’m wrong. We’ll start to know in the coming years

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

If an older person wants to take the vaccine because many of them are at risk then it makes sense to me. The risk reward ratio seems correct. But this blanket prescription of it too the countries young people is chilling. I hope I’m wrong. We’ll start to know in the coming years

Just curious if the 4.5 million worldwide COVID deaths is chilling to you?

Let me guess. You believe those totals are inflated because there's a "conspiracy" to inflate the totals worldwide because......... well...... because why?

Dead people are dead people. The life expectancy in America has been lowered. That's not inflated. That's DEAD PEOPLE. That's not a lie. That's statistics based on live people vs dead people. Let me guess, it's some kind of coincidence that more people are dying? They're dying but it's not COVID? Better yet, they're making it up...... all these people are lying about deaths, they're not happening!

They are. COVID is killing them. The life expectancy dropped. It's a real pandemic.

So, if you believe that it's real, do you now think we should just "ride out" a global pandemic without trying to overcome the virus? Just let "herd immunity" save us and whoever dies, dies? It's fine if that's your call. Let's let 1% die..... 3.4 million Americans or even 0.5%....... 1.75 million Americans. You good with that?

 

[Volprofch05]

Seems to me you are proving my point.

First of all, some of those rank and file doctors and nurses aren’t taking the vaccine either. I saw this article the other day. The most vaccine-hesitant group of all? PhDs - The Post

To use your example, If they had said to George, we don’t know what we’re doing but we’re going to give this a try because it’s the best we can come up with at this point in time, that would be one thing.

However, if they said, George do this and you’ll be cured and back roaming around on the grounds of Mount Vernon in no time, that would have been a line of bull.

You already have people in power (Fauci for one) who have knowingly lied and even admitted doing so. That’s not doing the best they can and learning from mistakes. That’s purposeful deception.

They are doing something, presenting it with absolute certainty, without acknowledging any possibility that they’re wrong or aren’t 100% sure.

Same as declaring that the virus could not have come from the Wuhan lab when you don’t know where it came from. If you don’t know where it came from, how can you possibly rule out the lab?

It’s almost religious. If you admit parts of the Bible aren’t true, than how can anyone believe the rest of the Bible.

These guys never admit or put out the possibility that they are wrong, because if they’re wrong some of the time, how can you be sure when they are right and when they are wrong.

So if the “science” in this is guessing, screwing up, learning, and then getting it right….I don’t want to go through the guessing, screwing up and learning part. I’ll wait until they get it right.

I find those survey results to be surprising, to be clear I'm not questioning their authenticity, but it differs a lot from my experience. I know many PhD scientists who were chomping at the bit to get vaccinated as soon as possible (anecdotal). I will note that it would be a difficult group to poll since it is small (PhDs ~1.2% of US population according to census). It is also a group that may receive and not respond to a large number of unsolicited surveys...

 

[wmcovol]

Now they’re saying new variants will beat the vaccines. Face it, it’s here for a loooonnnnggg time.

Besides making biological weapons against humans, what has the NIH & Wuhan done to help people? They’re sure not working to beat cancer, Alzheimer’s or Parkinson’s. Shut down the funding, destroy the place & prosecute any criminal activity. If this were a nuclear accident that killed 1/10,000th of the people Covid has, nuclear would be completely shut down.

 

[Hallie]

The vaccinated can still get infected and spread COVID.

Some of us have ALREADY had COVID. How are we being selfish if we don’t wish to take a vaccine that’s rather superfluous for us at this point?

High percentage of people dying and in hospitals now are the unvaccinated ..if all were vacinated the infections would be less total and less serious .. its plain and simple ..so get a shot if you want to go to games in the future .. or provide a neg covid test if Vols adopt that ..which they should but they probably wont .. its about the dollar ..but id say all the big donors are smart and have gotten vaccine.

 

[Hallie]

sorry to bust your bubble, just dont attend if it bothers you that much.

When others adopt this ..including TN ..then get a shot or provide neg test or dont attend if you want to be selfish

 

[Volprofch05]

Now they’re saying new variants will beat the vaccines. Face it, it’s here for a loooonnnnggg time.

Besides making biological weapons against humans, what has the NIH & Wuhan done to help people? They’re sure not working to beat cancer, Alzheimer’s or Parkinson’s. Shut down the funding, destroy the place & prosecute any criminal activity. If this were a nuclear accident that killed 1/10,000th of the people Covid has, nuclear would be completely shut down.

Labs funded by NIH are working incredibly hard to combat cancer, Alzheimer’s, Parkinson’s, and many other diseases. Health disorders in which human biological processes are dysregulated are extremely challenging to understand and to treat. Dramatic increases in average human lifespan point to the success of medical research.

 

[OH-Vol]

Vaccines won’t solve Covid or the multitude of variations forth coming, anymore than the flu vaccine solves the flu. Covid-19 or SARS-2 is a Corona virus and past attempts to use vaccines for Corona viruses have failed.

Vaccines have already proven their effectiveness by essential getting life back to normal over the course of a few months… If rednecks like you would leave your trailer park you will discover a world of doctors and modern medicine that can put an end to this ordeal.

 

[GoDucks349]

Vaccines aren’t 100 percent

This is from the CDC:

COVID-19 vaccines are effective

• COVID 19-vaccines are effective. They can keep you from getting and spreading the virus that causes COVID-19. Learn more about the different COVID-19 vaccines.
• COVID-19 vaccines also help keep you from getting seriously ill even if you do get COVID-19.
• Getting vaccinated yourself may also protect people around you, particularly people at increased risk for severe illness from COVID-19.

Delta Variant
The Delta variant causes more infections and spreads faster than earlier forms of the virus that causes COVID-19. It might cause more severe illness than previous strains in unvaccinated people.

• Vaccines continue to reduce a person’s risk of contracting the virus that cause COVID-19, including this variant.
• Vaccines continue to be highly effective at preventing hospitalization and death, including against this variant.
• Fully vaccinated people with breakthrough infections from this variant appear to be infectious for a shorter period.
• Get vaccinated and wear masks indoors in public spaces to reduce the spread of this variant.

 

[NO SIR EEE]

When others adopt this ..including TN ..then get a shot or provide neg test or dont attend if you want to be selfish

Tennessee is not going to do it. Get a hold of yourself. Listen to yourself. My GOD. You don't like it, then stay shuttered inside your home.