Migration Nightmares Hitting Europe

#301
#301
hog88 said:
You help criminals become legal? Why would a legal immigrant need your help becoming legal?
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The majority of folks I worked with were legal. There were some who were not. The only difference between the two groups was the status of their citizenship. Diming on them would destroy their families. I guess that's what you'd rather see.
 
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#304
#304
MercyPercy said:
This is where you lose me and I think most rational people. "Most" of the people in the middle east are bad? We're talking women, children, moderates, everyone? You really think the majority of the people there are bad people? Not just ignorant, but "bad"?

I'm curious as to what you specifically understand the word "bad" to mean in the context of a person's nature.
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Yes. What you might see as moderates are just well trained radicals.

I'm sure you've seen many people who thought differently than me on tv over in Syria helping out all these poor misunderstood people who are just trying to better their lives. Hopefully you didn't watch the videos of them having their heads chopped off.
 
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#306
#306
FLVOL_79 said:
After...

Remember during the civil war the north greeted new immigrants with a comfy wool uniform, a rusty gun, and meager pay and sent them to the front lines..right off the boat.
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You might be on to something there, Trump did say he wanted to build the military back up and take out ISIS. It could work...The Beaner Battalion, it has a nice ring to it..😎
 
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#307
#307
n_huffhines said:
More fearmongering from pisspants republicans
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Muslims do a pretty good job of fear mongering without the help of anyone else. Google new Isis video for a good old fashioned halal bbq.

Sadly portions of our population turn a blind eye to reality because they cannot accept that their blissful ignorance is leading to a dystopian future and not the multicultural global community of tolerance and rainbows that they think could exist. Do yall believe in unicorns and jackelopes as well?
 
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#312
#312
therealUT said:
Being uninvited does not make one an invader.
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That is literally exactly what it means. Back to the books.

I'm sure you'd have no problem if I walked into your house while you and your wife are eating dinner, grope her, eat your food, then leave, or maybe stay..depends on how good the fung shui of your joint is. I mean I wasn't invited so I am obviously not invading..
 
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#313
#313
Why do I get the feeling that the people here who think an immigrant is an immigrant is an immigrant probably live the farthest away from any area that actually experiences large amounts of foreign immigration and thus are removed from experiencing the actual consequences of said immigration.

It's easy to stand on a soapbox and champion a cause that you naively think is just when you don't get to reap the results.
 
#314
#314
FLVOL_79 said:
That is literally exactly what it means. Back to the books.

I'm sure you'd have no problem if I walked into your house while you and your wife are eating dinner, grope her, eat your food, then leave, or maybe stay..depends on how good the fung shui of your joint is. I mean I wasn't invited so I am obviously not invading..
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It's actually not exactly what it means. Just as killing someone is not necessarily murder, being on someone's property uninvited is not necessarily invading and/or violating their property right.

Property rights are claim-rights; claim-rights have correlative duties. That is, if someone has a legitimate claim-right, others have a legitimate duty to refrain. Yet, duties have stringencies; i.e., there exist priority of duties, so some duties do not hold if higher duties compete with them. Private property rights have correlative duties that are quite stringent, yet not absolute; public property rights have correlative duties that have very weak stringency.

Here's an example of where my entering your house uninvited would neither be invading nor violating your private property right: I'm coming home late at night, I walk by your house and see all the lights are off, presumably everyone is asleep. Yet, I also notice a lot of smoke and some flicker of flames through on of the lower floor windows.

Here I not only do not have a duty to not break your door down and enter your house uninvited, but I have a duty to break down your door and enter your house uninvited in order to save you, so long as I think it reasonable to believe that I can succeed in doing so.

Thus, being on someone's private property uninvited cannot be seen as necessarily entailing invading or violating any right; however, if you want to hold on to the term 'invade', well, now it loses any and all moral grip you want it to possess.

You might want to move away from your unreflective 'common sense' near-sighted view of the world and reflect on the concepts you employ to sort out the vast intricacies involved in what, on the surface, appear to be simple moral terms such as property, rights, duties, etc.

Oh, and try to avoid thinking that just because I used an example in which your life was going to be saved that the only justifying reason for entering someone else's property without an invite is to save that person's life. I used the example to clearly demonstrate the disconnect in your thought. I did not use it because it is the only example that shows such a disconnect.

Anyway, it's my birthday, and I'm going to start making some carnitas so they are ready by the time the guests arrive and the game starts (I have at least 2 friends...maybe as many as 3).
 
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#315
#315
FLVOL_79 said:
Why do I get the feeling that the people here who think an immigrant is an immigrant is an immigrant probably live the farthest away from any area that actually experiences large amounts of foreign immigration and thus are removed from experiencing the actual consequences of said immigration.

It's easy to stand on a soapbox and champion a cause that you naively think is just when you don't get to reap the results.
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Because you want to have that feeling.
 
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#317
#317
These immigration decisions that countries around the world are facing are the direct results of poor leadership by those same countries, including ours. This is what happens when they are left to solve problems on their own. Our leaders turn their heads and we all end up paying the price.
 
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#318
#318
FLVOL_79 said:
Muslims do a pretty good job of fear mongering without the help of anyone else. Google new Isis video for a good old fashioned halal bbq.

Sadly portions of our population turn a blind eye to reality because they cannot accept that their blissful ignorance is leading to a dystopian future and not the multicultural global community of tolerance and rainbows that they think could exist. Do yall believe in unicorns and jackelopes as well?
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Great points but wtf are you talking to me about ISIS?
 
#319
#319
FLVOL_79 said:
Why do I get the feeling that the people here who think an immigrant is an immigrant is an immigrant probably live the farthest away from any area that actually experiences large amounts of foreign immigration and thus are removed from experiencing the actual consequences of said immigration.

It's easy to stand on a soapbox and champion a cause that you naively think is just when you don't get to reap the results.
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Because your feelings are uninformed. I would bet all my money i have more experience with immigrants than anyone here.

1. I live in Phoenix. My landlord is a Mexican immigrant, for hell's sakes.

2. I was a spanish speaking mormon missionary in Nashville. I spent 70 hours a week for 2 years meeting and getting to know immigrants from every spanish speaking country (except i never met someone from Paraguay).
 
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#321
#321
n_huffhines said:
Because your feelings are uninformed. I would bet all my money i have more experience with immigrants than anyone here.

1. I live in Phoenix. My landlord is a Mexican immigrant, for hell's sakes.

2. I was a spanish speaking mormon missionary in Nashville. I spent 70 hours a week for 2 years meeting and getting to know immigrants from every spanish speaking country (except i never met someone from Paraguay).
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I live in Orlando...Africans, Hispanics, Brazilians, Haitians, Crapistans, Ricans, Russians, Brits, etc.
 
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#324
#324
therealUT said:
It's actually not exactly what it means. Just as killing someone is not necessarily murder, being on someone's property uninvited is not necessarily invading and/or violating their property right.

Property rights are claim-rights; claim-rights have correlative duties. That is, if someone has a legitimate claim-right, others have a legitimate duty to refrain. Yet, duties have stringencies; i.e., there exist priority of duties, so some duties do not hold if higher duties compete with them. Private property rights have correlative duties that are quite stringent, yet not absolute; public property rights have correlative duties that have very weak stringency.

Here's an example of where my entering your house uninvited would neither be invading nor violating your private property right: I'm coming home late at night, I walk by your house and see all the lights are off, presumably everyone is asleep. Yet, I also notice a lot of smoke and some flicker of flames through on of the lower floor windows.

Here I not only do not have a duty to not break your door down and enter your house uninvited, but I have a duty to break down your door and enter your house uninvited in order to save you, so long as I think it reasonable to believe that I can succeed in doing so.

Thus, being on someone's private property uninvited cannot be seen as necessarily entailing invading or violating any right; however, if you want to hold on to the term 'invade', well, now it loses any and all moral grip you want it to possess.

You might want to move away from your unreflective 'common sense' near-sighted view of the world and reflect on the concepts you employ to sort out the vast intricacies involved in what, on the surface, appear to be simple moral terms such as property, rights, duties, etc.

Oh, and try to avoid thinking that just because I used an example in which your life was going to be saved that the only justifying reason for entering someone else's property without an invite is to save that person's life. I used the example to clearly demonstrate the disconnect in your thought. I did not use it because it is the only example that shows such a disconnect.

Anyway, it's my birthday, and I'm going to start making some carnitas so they are ready by the time the guests arrive and the game starts (I have at least 2 friends...maybe as many as 3).
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oh megherd you're right! The muslims saw the declining baby rates in Europe and decided that they needed to show up to help them repopulate! Oh man I can't believe I never looked at it that way!! And all this time I thought they were just looking for a free ride while expanding their barbaric religion. Silly me.
 
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