Not espn's fault that manning lost the heisman?

#126
#126
Lawrence Wright said:
Can you name a sport where the individual awarded "most outstanding/valuable player" comes from a losing team?
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MVP is not "most outstanding player". I think a better comparison would be OPOY, or DPOY and those most certainly come from teams with a variety of success.
 
#129
#129
droski said:
yes and he beat out mcfadden and a qb from hawaii. i assure you if peyton had the same competition he would ahve won in a landslide.
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Colt Brennan's big year was the year Troy Smith won Heisman. Brennan had untouchable stats. I don't care that he played in the WAC. He was the most outstanding.
 
#131
#131
droski said:
how many qbs have won the heisman who weren't on undefeated teams or teams with signature late season victories?
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It is most interesting that you have narrowly defined the criteria for winning the Heisman to suit your personal argument. To address your question, however, let us turn back the hands of time to an era when the quarterback was not necessarily the most instrumental position on the field. In 1956, Paul Hornung won the Heisman while playing for a 2-8 Notre Dame team. Runnerup Johnny Majors and third-place Tommy McDonald played, respectively, for Tennessee and Oklahoma teams that were 10-0 and 10-0.
 
#132
#132
Dbake005 said:
Such as?
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1990 Warren Moon QB Houston Oilers
1991 Thurman Thomas RB Buffalo Bills
1992 Steve Young QB San Francisco 49ers
1993 Jerry Rice (2) WR San Francisco 49ers
1994 Barry Sanders RB Detroit Lions
1995 Brett Favre QB Green Bay Packers
1996 Terrell Davis RB Denver Broncos
1997 Barry Sanders (2) RB Detroit Lions
1998 Terrell Davis (2) RB Denver Broncos
1999 Marshall Faulk RB St. Louis Rams
2000 Marshall Faulk (2) RB St. Louis Rams
2001 Marshall Faulk (3) RB St. Louis Rams
2002 Priest Holmes RB Kansas City Chiefs
2003 Jamal Lewis RB Baltimore Ravens
2004 Peyton Manning QB Indianapolis Colts
2005 Shaun Alexander RB Seattle Seahawks
2006 LaDainian Tomlinson RB San Diego Chargers
2007 Tom Brady QB New England Patriots
2008 Drew Brees QB New Orleans Saints
2009 Chris Johnson RB Tennessee Titans
2010 Tom Brady (2) QB New England Patriots

A lot of those guys weren't playing for SB contenders.
 
#133
#133
Volosaurus rex said:
It is most interesting that you have narrowly defined the criteria for winning the Heisman to suit your personal argument. To address your question, however, let us turn back the hands of time to an era when the quarterback was not necessarily the most instrumental position on the field. In 1956, Paul Hornung won the Heisman while playing for a 2-8 Notre Dame team. Runnerup Johnny Majors and third-place Tommy McDonald played, respectively, for Tennessee and Oklahoma teams that were 10-0 and 10-0.
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They also crowned national champions before the bowl games back then....and I would have probably attended Florida A&M instead of Florida.

Yeah, let's use that era to establish criteria in a thread about a late 1990s Heisman Trophy race.
 
#134
#134
Volosaurus rex said:
It is most interesting that you have narrowly defined the criteria for winning the Heisman to suit your personal argument. To address your question, however, let us turn back the hands of time to an era when the quarterback was not necessarily the most instrumental position on the field. In 1956, Paul Hornung won the Heisman while playing for a 2-8 Notre Dame team. Runnerup Johnny Majors and third-place Tommy McDonald played, respectively, for Tennessee and Oklahoma teams that were 10-0 and 10-0.
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i'm not saying it's fair, but historically it's how the heisman has been determined. hornung played for ND which at the time was america's team. any other team and there is no chance he would have won it.
 
#135
#135
Dbake005 said:
Didn't David Boston just absolutely toast Woodson for a TD in that game? I might be remembering incorrectly, i was a young'n
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Yes he did. In fact, if memory serves me correctly, Boston beat him so badly on that particular play that he taunted Woodson by turning around and backing into the endzone.
 
#136
#136
nbakerld said:
I get that, but the award is most outstanding player, and it's completely bogus that players from bad teams are eliminated from consideration. There are 22 starters on the field. You are 1 player. You could be 10x better than any other CFB player and be on a losing team.
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Manning had the ball in his hands every single offensive play. He threw an ill-advised touchdown pass to Tony George, in the biggest game of his biggest season. There is little to no excuse for a Heisman Candidate QB to be the biggest factor in his team's loss (that was a 14 point swing in a game that ended up being decided by 13 points).
 
#137
#137
Volosaurus rex said:
Yes he did. In fact, if memory serves me correctly, Boston beat him so badly on that particular play that he taunted Woodson by turning around and backing into the endzone.
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But Woodson came back and returned a punt to the house to clinch victory against his most hated rival, a Big 10 title, a Rose Bowl berth and a national title shot.

Manning didn't have a bounce-back play in his defining game of the year. Had he not thrown the pic-6 to Tony George, and UT went on to lose by 6 points, things may have played out differently.
 
#138
#138
therealUT said:
Manning had the ball in his hands every single offensive play. He threw an ill-advised touchdown pass to Tony George, in the biggest game of his biggest season. There is little to no excuse for a Heisman Candidate QB to be the biggest factor in his team's loss (that was a 14 point swing in a game that ended up being decided by 13 points).
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Yeah, but if there's no Manning maybe they lose by 35. That's why you can't judge him on one play or even one game. He maybe had the greatest statistics ever by a QB in a pro-style offense. It's a "season" award. Not a rivalry game award.
 
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#139
#139
Lawrence Wright said:
But Woodson came back and returned a punt to the house to clinch victory against his most hated rival, a Big 10 title, a Rose Bowl berth and a national title shot.

Manning didn't have a bounce-back play in his defining game of the year. Had he not thrown the pic-6 to Tony George, and UT went on to lose by 6 points, things may have played out differently.
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So Woodson broke even for the game?
 
#140
#140
nbakerld said:
Yeah, but if there's no Manning maybe they lose by 28. That's why you can't judge him on one play or even one game. He maybe had the greatest statistics ever by a QB in a pro-style offense.
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Tim Couch. Where is your argument for his Heisman?
 
#141
#141
droski said:
Excerpt: Peyton Manning?s Heisman snub was not Chris Fowler?s fault, and he can prove it - Dr. Saturday - NCAAFBlog - Yahoo! Sports

enjoy
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Droski.... Don't you ever ever ever ever post some garbage like this again!!!!!! Yes, I read the article while the tractor loaded my truck and this is BS!!!!! ESPN promoted Woodson like presidential candidate especially to the northern media and they "STOLE" Peytons Trophy, END OF DISCUSION!!!!!!

Next time I see some crap like this I'm gonna take a tobacco stick to your rear end. Trust me them things hurt!!!! Joke joke!!
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#142
#142
nbakerld said:
So Woodson broke even for the game?
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Yes, unlike Manning who contributed directly to the loss.

Without the pick-6 it's a one possession game and anything can happen. UT was playing from two scores behind most of the game, thanks to Manning's poor decision.
 
#143
#143
droski said:
and your evidence that fowler hated tenn before woodson won is that he didn't appreciate a bunch of idiot rednecks sending him hate mail and threatening his life after woodson won?
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The hate mail is because he's an AL grad and his douchebag comment about trailer parks in TN.
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#146
#146
droski said:
yes and florida and michigan were on it's way and tenn was not.
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Actually, at the time of the voting, there was a scenario where he might be playing for a national title since Michigan was tied into the Rose Bowl.
 
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#149
#149
BigPapaVol said:
The hate mail is because he's an AL grad and his douchebag comment about trailer parks in TN.
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Kind of like TN fans talking about trailer parks in Alabama. Both are tremendously stupid.
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#150
#150
BearCat204 said:
Kind of like TN fans talking about trailer parks in Alabama. Both are tremendously stupid.
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Not kinda like it. We don't do it from a pulpit and with a faux air of legitimacy provide by faux media impartiality
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